2,076
Life MemberLife Member
2,076

PostAug 12, 2009#801

There was some talk about how much, if any, the new Schnucks/Culinaria will raise prices after they open. This morning I took pics of a sample of products. Will go back in a year or six months and check again. Here they are.



Cheerios, 14oz: $4.57

Starkist Chunk Light Tuna in Water: $0.98 on sale for $0.79

Puffs tissues: $2.39, on sale for $1.67

Uncle Ben's White Rice, 32oz: $3.86

C&H Granulated Sugar, 4lb: $2.59

Bananas: $0.65/lb

Totinos Pepperoni Party Pizza: $1.25

Schnucks 1 doz XL eggs: $1.97

Campbells Tomato soup: $0.77

Folgers Classic Roast 33.5 oz: $6.98 on sale for $6.47

Huggies #1 50ct diapers: $10.98



and finally some booze....



Tanqueray 25.4oz Gin: $24.99 on sale for $20.99

Guest
Guest

PostAug 12, 2009#802

GelatinousEndive wrote:a grocery store that is open until 10 pm yay yay ya y yay yay!!!!!!!!!


All they need to do now is be open 24hrs O_O

5,631
Life MemberLife Member
5,631

PostAug 12, 2009#803

bprop wrote:There was some talk about how much, if any, the new Schnucks/Culinaria will raise prices after they open. This morning I took pics of a sample of products. Will go back in a year or six months and check again. Here they are.



Cheerios, 14oz: $4.57

Starkist Chunk Light Tuna in Water: $0.98 on sale for $0.79

Puffs tissues: $2.39, on sale for $1.67

Uncle Ben's White Rice, 32oz: $3.86

C&H Granulated Sugar, 4lb: $2.59

Bananas: $0.65/lb

Totinos Pepperoni Party Pizza: $1.25

Schnucks 1 doz XL eggs: $1.97

Campbells Tomato soup: $0.77

Folgers Classic Roast 33.5 oz: $6.98 on sale for $6.47

Huggies #1 50ct diapers: $10.98



and finally some booze....



Tanqueray 25.4oz Gin: $24.99 on sale for $20.99
Inflation is typically about 2-3% per year and shortages can cause spikes in prices as well. Might be interesting if you also take a price snapshot of the same goods at a suburban Schnuck's to compare with and again in 6months to a year or so.

291
Full MemberFull Member
291

PostAug 12, 2009#804

Prices of items will probably change in six months. I think the fair comparison would be the price of an item at this store relative to the price at other Schnucks. Right now the prices of items at The Culinaria are exactly the same as the prices of those items at the other Schucks in town...At least the Schucks on the Hill where I did some shopping just before Culinaria opened. If they maintain prices equal to their other outlets, I don't think anyone has anything to complain about relative to priciing.

2,076
Life MemberLife Member
2,076

PostAug 12, 2009#805

I'll grab another Schnucks prices as well. I was just going to take a snapshot in case the prices got wildly out of the normal range, as proof that they were once normal :)

7,810
Life MemberLife Member
7,810

PostAug 12, 2009#806

asckee wrote:
GelatinousEndive wrote:a grocery store that is open until 10 pm yay yay ya y yay yay!!!!!!!!!


All they need to do now is be open 24hrs O_O


Even in Chicago, a number of the urban Osco/Jewels, Whole Foods, Cub Foods, Dominicks etc aren't 24 hours.



10pm is fine for now IMHO. We'll know things are going good if/when the hours get extended.

PostAug 12, 2009#807

Inbetween talking about douchebags, strippers, baseball and poker: Tim McKernan over at insidestl.com has a great article.



http://www.insidestl.com/TimMcKernan/ta ... fault.aspx


One Small Store For Schnucks...One Giant Leap For Downtown

By Tim McKernan Wednesday, August 12, 2009

In what was one of those moments I'll never forget, I was sitting with Jack Buck on the 4th of July by the pool at his home in 2001.



Just Jack Buck, my KMOV camera man, and me.



If there's one thing---and really, I think it may be just this one thing---I miss about doing TV regularly, it's the ability to get to sit down with sports personalities of note---whether they be athletes, coaches, or broadcasters---and have a conversation recorded on tape. Not an interview. But, a conversation.



It's in conversations---not interviews---where you find the real personality...and the subject's real, honest thoughts.



And, it was in this conversation with Jack Buck that he got a little fired up when I asked him about the back-and-forth between the city/county/state and the Cardinals over the proposal for the new ballpark downtown. Keep in mind that it was 2001, and the new ballpark hadn't been approved...and the Cardinals were considering leaving downtown St. Louis. Here's the exact transcript:



McKernan: "You said on the day the Governor and Bud Selig came to town that the downtown ballpark, and the plans being approved, was 'one of the greatest days in the history of downtown St. Louis.' Please tell me if I am misquoting you."



Buck: "No, that's right. I think it should be. The way I look at it is a city, or any entity is either going forward or it's going back. I don't think that St. Louis downtown right now is any great shakes. I think there are many other cities that are more attractive downtown than St. Louis. And, many of those cities have come from the bottom. And they've been reborn---like Pittsburgh, and Cleveland, and Milwaukee and some others."



McKernan: "Denver…?"



Buck: "Yeah, but Denver is not a bad city to start with. Neither is San Francisco. San Francisco didn't need the ballpark downtown. St. Louis needs a ballpark downtown, either this one or a new one. And, some day there will be a new ballpark downtown. Now, I don't know anything about bonds. I don't know anything about debt, except that I've had my own. I know this: the ballpark and the ball club are supported by the people that live out of the city and out of the state. The people that work in the city live in the county. They pay the city ordinance taxes. They go to the ballgames, and they pay the tax. People at home don't worry about the national debt. Do they? If they lay awake at night, worried about the billions of dollars that we owe, they'd never sleep. This city needs a new ballpark. Someday, they will get one. Even if they started now, it wouldn't be until 2005 or 2006. So, if they started in 2005, we'll have one in 2010. I think the current owners have done nothing but good for the Cardinals. I think a lot of people are jealous. I think a lot of people of ordinary income don't like rich people. I know that for a fact. And you do, too. And, I think the folks tuned in know that, too. They talk about the rich kids from Country Day. One of the owners, David Pratt, is a self-made man from Kirkwood. Never went to a university. And he's a brilliant person, and he's an interested Cardinal owner. Some of these attitudes have to change. But, it's not going to be the end of my life if they don't approve it. But, I will say this; it could be the end of St. Louis's downtown life if they lose that ball club."



Not only was he a great broadcaster, Jack Buck was a candid visionary.



As he was so often, the Hall of Famer was right on target. And, Jack Buck made some statements in the above two paragraphs that other people wouldn't be able to get away with, but he was Jack Buck. And, so his---at the time---radical viewpoint on class envy, the state of downtown St. Louis, and the importance of the Cardinals to the region...but specifically downtown...were accepted, and quite frankly in hindsight, somewhat ignored.



More than eight years later, downtown St. Louis is in a different world than where it was when Jack Buck spoke those words. Washington Avenue serves as home not only for a number of bars and restaurants opened in the last eight years, but for thousands of residents, including myself.



When Mr. Buck called the day in which the Governor and Bud Selig approving the plans for the new ballpark "one of the greatest days in the history of downtown St. Louis," I'm quite certain that he didn't envision Washington Avenue where it is now...or the unfortunate state of Ballpark Village where it is now.



Yet here we are in 2009...with the new Busch Stadium in its fourth year of existence...and you'd be hard-pressed to find many people---business owners or residents---who can tell you they are where they are on the south end of downtown St. Louis because of the new Busch Stadium.



In Field of Dreams, Kevin Costner's character Ray Kinsella responded to the famous voice calling, "If you build it, they will come." The city, county, state, and ownership built the new ballpark, and yes...they do indeed come, but only on 81 nights a year. The promise of the early part of this decade in getting the new ballpark approved---albeit in a much different capacity than originally proposed---was that it would spur growth around the south end of downtown.



With no Ballpark Village and hardly any businesses or residents flocking to the area as of yet, that promise has not been fulfilled.



And, yet, here we are in 2009 with downtown St. Louis growing despite it all. The downtown area showed a growth of 6% in population in 2008...one of the largest jumps in the metropolitan area. Young, professional people are moving downtown. And, more and more are doing it...even without Ballpark Village.



In quite the twist, it's the north side of downtown that actually has led to the city's resurgence.



When I was 24 in 2001, we hardly ever even considered going out downtown. That completely changed within two years. But, it was one thing to go out downtown....it was a totally different thing to actually commit to living downtown.



Yet, in the last five years, thousands have elected to do so, and areas that were once danger zones are now filled with residents, restaurants, and energy.



But, despite all of that growth and all of the people...up until yesterday, there was no real grocery store for downtown residents. Sure, City Grocers did its best, but for those who were used to the sprawling 63,000 sq ft of a Schnucks or Dierbergs, it just wasn't the same.



I've lived here since February, and I'd still make the trek out to Kirkwood once a week to get groceries. And, I know some of my neighbors would do the same thing.



Those days are officially over.



The Culinaria, a Schnucks Market, opened at 9th and Olive yesterday, and it's the store that downtown St. Louisans have wanted and needed for years. Quite honestly, it's perfect. And, I'm not even getting a dollar of advertising revenue from Schnucks.



It's surprisingly massive. It has everything my Schnucks in Kirkwood has. And, it now ends the questioning from those who don't want to believe---for whatever reason---that the downtown St. Louis rebirth is just a fad. If Schnucks---a name brand synonymous not just with St. Louis...but with old school St. Louis---feels confident enough in what has happened down here, then you, too, skeptical potential businesses and residents can feel more comfortable about downtown St. Louis.



I have lived in St. Louis Hills. I have lived in Clayton. I have lived in Kirkwood. And, I now live on Washington Avenue.



There's not a place in the city I would rather live than where I live right now.



Period.



I have a two minute commute to the radio station on The Landing. And, I have a two minute commute---if that---to the insideSTL.com offices at 19th and Locust.



Now, with the Culinaria at 9th and Olive, I have no need to go past 20th Street unless I want to visit my parents or pick up some Mom's Deli.



I know...downtown is not for you if you have kids. I completely respect that. And, I know...the school system still sucks. And, I know...the issue of panhandlers and car break-ins are real and more prominent than they should be.



But, the journey back to where so many believe this city can once again be is about taking steps. And, as stupid as it sounds, a downtown grocery store is a big step in the right direction.



I assure you that if Jack Buck were alive today, he would think the same thing.



"The way I look at it is a city, or any entity is either going forward or it's going back. I don't think that St. Louis downtown right now is any great shakes." Those are his words in 2001.



I'm happy to say that, finally, things are changing in 2009.


(If an admin wants to trim the article down, please do so. But based upon my lurking on his forum, I doubt he would care.)

200
Junior MemberJunior Member
200

PostAug 12, 2009#808

Great article.

10K
AdministratorAdministrator
10K

PostAug 12, 2009#809

^

Thanks for posting that. McKernan has really become a great downtown advocate recently.

5,631
Life MemberLife Member
5,631

PostAug 12, 2009#810

^ Almost as much as Charlie Brennan!

459
Full MemberFull Member
459

PostAug 12, 2009#811

I agree...good article. Question? Does the store has a pharmacy?

3,785
Life MemberLife Member
3,785

PostAug 12, 2009#812

Why would this guy to go Kirkwood for groceries? There are several much closer in the City. He has no credibility. He also has no memory, obviously, like many newer residents.



I suppose people are forgetting that we had a Schnucks on Cass Avenue?



But, you know, that probably was "scary," aka had African Americans, like the ones on South Grand and Lindell.



We essentially spend millions of our public dollars, at the same time when we have budget issues combined with obligations like the St. Louis Centre TIF (which we are erecting a parking garage to pay for), in order to move Schnucks a few blocks South because the former West Countian "urban" loft dwellers can't deal with diversity?



What does that say about our City, the kind of Downtown we desire? What does it say about how this Administration and business class views the near North Side? What does it reveal about our priorities?



Besides City Grocers, downtown already had a grocery store. It was at Cass Avenue and readily served the near North Side as well.



"Downtown St. Louis" was never a fad, but rather an eventuality constantly stymied by decades of errant decision making. The success of Downtown St. Louis is not tied to a grocery store, but the quality of our planning decisions -- which have been egregiously subpar for decades. The public subsidization of a grocery store, when we had one blocks away, along with the accompanying demolition of the National Register marble-clad Century Building, follows the same logic as the demolition of Real Estate Row (historic, heavily used office space) for the Gateway One Building (newer, shiny office space).



Downtown St. Louis already had a grocery store and this provides nothing new. Even greater hooplah (with actual merit) would have occurred if Schnuck redesigned their store at Cass Avenue, while the Century re-opened as mixed use with residential, offices, and internal parking.



But this is St. Louis! We're the City that turns St. Louis Centre into a parking garage, even though it's attached to a parking garage, in order to pay for the TIF that was supposed to finance it's rehabilitation into condos!



What did comedian Lewis Black say hell would be like? A Starbucks across the street from a Starbucks? How about publicly financing the relocation of Schnucks a few blocks south to where the Century Building once stood, or perhaps parking garages daisey chained around a large urban plaza containing a statue of Mayor Slay performing fellatio on Robert Moses and Richard J. Daley? Perhaps we can do this with the Old Post Office district.



When will we stop following Jim Jones and realize this constant circle jerk must discontinue?

2,076
Life MemberLife Member
2,076

PostAug 12, 2009#813

courtland wrote:I agree...good article. Question? Does the store has a pharmacy?




Yes

6,775
Life MemberLife Member
6,775

PostAug 12, 2009#814

Doug wrote:Why would this guy to go Kirkwood for groceries? There are several much closer in the City. He has no credibility. He also has no memory, obviously, like many newer residents.


I have no idea who this person is, but my guess would be that he is from Kirkwood. So perhaps he still spends a lot of time out there. No adult would consider that to be a lack of credibility.


Doug wrote:I suppose people are forgetting that we had a Schnucks on Cass Avenue?



But, you know, that probably was "scary," aka had African Americans, like the ones on South Grand and Lindell.


Unlike you, I was actually in that store. There was a lot of trash that frequented that location. Given its location, that's not surprising. So you probably shouldn't comment on someplace you've never been.

10K
AdministratorAdministrator
10K

PostAug 12, 2009#815

^

McKernan bought a house in Kirkwood, which he still owns, and rents a loft downtown where he practically lives full-time. I'm guessing he did his grocery shopping when he was at his house.



And snobbish as it may sound, there's no way in hell I would have ever shopped at the Cass Schnucks if I lived downtown. Just like I refused to shop at Grand and Gravois when I lived in TGS or at Lindell when I was at SLU. Awful stores are awful stores.

7,810
Life MemberLife Member
7,810

PostAug 12, 2009#816

Doug wrote:Why would this guy to go Kirkwood for groceries? There are several much closer in the City. He has no credibility. He also has no memory, obviously, like many newer residents.


McKernan still owns a house out there. He's spent too much time with strippers and poker so he's going through a divorce and can't sell the place. Holding on to it until the market improves. Plus I think he's got family in the area.

PostAug 12, 2009#817

DeBaliviere wrote:^

McKernan bought a house in Kirkwood, which he still owns, and rents a loft downtown where he practically lives full-time. I'm guessing he did his grocery shopping when he was at his house.



And snobbish as it may sound, there's no way in hell I would have ever shopped at the Cass Schnucks if I lived downtown. Just like I refused to shop at Grand and Gravois when I lived in TGS or at Lindell when I was at SLU. Awful stores are awful stores.


I could have sworn that Cass Schnucks was an old National? Even the suburban Nationals they kept open weren't treated the best.



Schnucks is weird. Certain stores are treated well and others they let slide. There's no uniformity.

10K
AdministratorAdministrator
10K

PostAug 12, 2009#818

^

I think you're right. The Lindell store was a National as well.

367
Full MemberFull Member
367

PostAug 12, 2009#819

Dear lord, I really think the anti-Schnucks thing has gone over the top. If you ever get over your bitterness you migth be able to see that it is more productive to be happy that something good came out of the demolition of the Century building...at least there is a public benefit.



Some facts that Doug may have forgotten:

1. Schnucks is a local company and the only one of our two major local grocers who does business in the City.



2. Schnucks has focused Culinaria on the downtown residents not just daytime population like some other newer businesses. they also seem genuinely interested in what downtown residents want/need.



3. The Century is gone, it ain't coming back and no amount of flogging away at the horse will bring it back...



4. By taking such an extreme and unreasonable position you probably turn reasonable people away from your viewpoint (saving historical buildings) than you convert to your side.



5. Heller opened City Grocers as a loss leader to give people a place to get groceries, it was never intended as a long term project, this is a fact and Heller has repeatedly said that.



If you don't like it, don't go there...but don't try to guilt others into doing the same.

2,831
Life MemberLife Member
2,831

PostAug 12, 2009#820

To compare Cass "downtown" store is irrelative.



In 2001 and before it was a National store that was bought by Schnucks (which Schnucks closed most older National Stores within a few years of buy out).



In 2001 and before - downtown St. Louis had very few residents and revitalization efforts had barely begun.



The Cass store WAS NOT located "downtown" - it was on the cusp on downtown north (not in walking distance to most of downtown businesses) and was not a desirable neighborhood. Regardless of race - the store was consistently plagued with crime inside and out. I doubt most people shop in undesirable crime areas for safety issues and concerns not because of racial barriers.



This argument (of the Cass old National store) is ignorant to say the least.

291
Full MemberFull Member
291

PostAug 12, 2009#821

I went to the grand opening and then went back after work last night and bought groceries. What a great store! Everything is laid out well and displayed well, too. Tons of people but the lines moved quickly during check-out.



I went back at 8:30 PM as I forgot an item. There were still people sitting outside at the tables and it was still busy inside. That part of downtown is so much more alive now. I'm really glad the store turned out so well.



Now I'm looking forward to seeing what City Gourmet will be like. I spoke with Craig Heller on Sunday and they were already busy moving things around to accomodate the new layout. He said they'd be closed Thursday through Sunday and will open Monday with their new format. It sounded like they'll be a nice complement to Culinaria.

3,785
Life MemberLife Member
3,785

PostAug 12, 2009#822

I have a September 2000 Post-Dispatch article listing it as a Schnucks, but that really does not matter.



The Cass store was 0.7 miles from Washington Avenue -- well within walking distance -- and a little further from what is now Crown Square in ONSL. I will agree that it was technically in Columbus Square.



If needed the suburban style Cass store could have been demolished and rebuilt serving both neighborhoods.



We demolish entire neighborhoods for crime problems, like McRee Town, but this one store couldn't be reconfigured and instead we tore down the Century Building?



This store would have provided much needed services to both the near North Side and Downtown St. Louis. Given it's not right across the street from City Grocers, Heller might have even been able to expand or at least remain open.



The demolition of National Register buildings has no public benefit to our City.

7,810
Life MemberLife Member
7,810

PostAug 12, 2009#823

I say we do the following:

-get a posse together

-carpool out to West County (Don’t worry: we’ll pass the time by listening to Central Scrutinizer talk about how great he is.)

-go to Doug’s parents’ house and abduct him from his basement

-drive back downtown

-throw him into the front lobby of the Culinaria and hold the doors shut

-watch him burst into flames like a vampire in daylight.



[/sarcasm]

2,076
Life MemberLife Member
2,076

PostAug 12, 2009#824

Craig never made a dime on City Grocers. He's quite relieved that the new Schnucks is taking its place.

3,785
Life MemberLife Member
3,785

PostAug 12, 2009#825

I no longer reside with my parents -- and they do not live in St. Louis County.



I am however allergic to parking lots/garages and certain ill advised demolitions.



If he's happy then why was he going to expand, thus drive himself further into the red as everyone here speculates? Only with the hope that this sells even more units?

Read more posts (424 remaining)