urbanSTL

Neither one^

I think CG should just change tack, move a little further west, and open up shop. They pioneered before, they'll be fine. There is (will be) enough market for both. They also need to get an angle on Schnucks. A better selection of......X, or "they make better ........X."

Exactly. My thought is that if they are even four or five blocks apart, City Grocers will be just fine. Unfortunately for them I think it's more in CG's interest to move, not Schnuck's. This is not like Best Buy/Circuit City or Penn Station/Steak N Shake because one is clearly the heavyweight and has a lot more to money in other places to draw from. I don't think anyone SHOULD move, but if CG wants to stick around, they have to play a little more defensively now.

[/quote]If you go to Lindberg & 55, there are a Best Buy and a Circuit City across the street from each other. A little farther up, there is a Penn Station and a Steak n' Shake that face off. Which ones should leave?[/quote]



My point would be that 55 & Lindbergh is fairly mature developed retail trade area, while 9th & Olive has a long time to reach that kind of retail synergy and having the first two large retailers going after the same market will not help the OPO gain momentum.

TGE-ATW wrote:I think CG should just change tack, move a little further west, and open up shop. They pioneered before, they'll be fine. There is (will be) enough market for both. They also need to get an angle on Schnucks. A better selection of......X, or "they make better ........X."

That's what I think they should do. There's plenty of residences and business west of Tucker who would view a western CG as a much preferable option to the Schnucks.



But to call Schnucks "jackasses" and "bad business" is just wrong. This is a big step in the rebirth of downtown St. Louis and to use such absolute terms is wrong.

or demolish another building

The Century wasn't enough for you?

hey I'm not against Schnucks moving in there - and I don't think an aggressive business tactic needs to be considered a "jack*ss" move .... budiness is business. I'm just wondering why they didn't consider south Broadway. There is space there for a traditional store with parking ... and the soulard/lafayette area needs a store .... really the market for that type of grocery is still there even IF this Schnucks comes to fruition.





for what its worth a checker at city grocers told me that they were plannign to move in any event - to a larger space somewhere downtown.

Part of the reason may have been simply that it is a new building.

markofucity wrote:


for what its worth a checker at city grocers told me that they were plannign to move in any event - to a larger space somewhere downtown.

They are not any longer.

markofucity wrote:hey I'm not against Schnucks moving in there - and I don't think an aggressive business tactic needs to be considered a "jack*ss" move .... budiness is business. I'm just wondering why they didn't consider south Broadway. There is space there for a traditional store with parking ... and the soulard/lafayette area needs a store .... really the market for that type of grocery is still there even IF this Schnucks comes to fruition.





for what its worth a checker at city grocers told me that they were plannign to move in any event - to a larger space somewhere downtown.

There is already one grocer scheduled to go in to service the Lafayette/Soulard area. It and a Walgreen's are supposed to go in across from the Georgian (the old City Hospital).



As for South Broadway, I hear there is a plot of land there being eyed up by Trader Joe's.



And the clerk at City Grocer's may have been referring to their pending move into the Syndicate.



Other's have suggested a move by City Grocer's to head west which I think makes a lot of sense. The loft district is probably most dense west of 14th and is continuing to grow. You also have a number of big corporations there like AG Edwards, MSD and Ameren UE. I can see City Grocers' doing quite well and really wish them continued success! But it's still kind of dead in that area, especially in the evenings. Obviously Schnuck's is a nice addition and I will shop there but will continue to throw City Grocer's as much business as I can.

I hate to burst anyone's bubbles, but if Schnucks is doing this, why won't Schnucks say that it's doing this?

Now that Schnucks will open up downtown, I hope they have normal business hours that are around the clock 24/7. Many businesses downtown close early and/or open late especially on weekends. I hope the Schnucks will have business starting in the early morning until late at night. A 24/7 Schnucks would be convenient. I think lots of people in downtown will benefit from this Schnucks. It just needs to stay open so that it is convenient for everyone.



I personally would also love to see a Whole Foods open up dowtown!

the BJ also had an article "City Grocers brings on Straubs GM" to head up their new expanded DT store.

Ahh, this is great news for our downtown! Schnuck's will bring a larger market with lower prices than City Grocer's. Let's just hope it's a more upscale Schnuck's and not a piece of crap.



And guess what, there's a parking garage on location. Will we be able to park for free w/ validation? If they're smart, yes.



I have it on inside news that City Grocer's will not stay in that area and compete with Schnuck's. This is common sense. Dollars to doughnuts, they'll attempt to serve the downtown area just west of Tucker.

innov8ion wrote:Ahh, this is great news for our downtown! Schnuck's will bring a larger market with lower prices than City Grocer's. Let's just hope it's a more upscale Schnuck's and not a piece of crap.



I have it on inside news that City Grocer's will not stay in that area and compete with Schnuck's. This is common sense. Dollars to doughnuts, they'll attempt to serve the downtown area just west of Tucker.

My very reliable sources indicate this new store is supposed to be in the same division as Schnucks' "elite" stores- Frontenac, Ladue, Richmond Center, etc.

innov8ion wrote:
I have it on inside news that City Grocer's will not stay in that area and compete with Schnuck's.

No, City Grocers won't be there per se, but Schnucks will have competition.

This is a smart business decision that is twofold. When you consider the numerous current and future residential developments west of Tucker, moving City Grocers is potentially lucrative and it frees up more prime retail space (it's current location and the proposed Syndicate location) for the growing OPO district.

bpe235 wrote:the BJ also had an article "City Grocers brings on Straubs GM" to head up their new expanded DT store.

another savvy business move

As if Schnucks wouldn't come without the garage.

Well, they do have parking requirements they have to fill. There aren't many places downtown they could locate and have their parking requirements met on-site, or within less than 100 feet from a store entrance.



I don't personally feel this is a good move for schnucks - honestly. I don't think the downtown population is there yet to support the schnucks - not a store of 15,000sqft, though I'm sure they've done the market research and know if it is or isn't a good idea yet. I think straubs would have been fine, or another independent. I feel that Schnucks is going to attract a lot of people from outside the downtown area to shop who only shop once a month, if you catch my drift. This isn't a bad thing per se for those people who need a quality grocery store, but I can guarantee you that you will have a hard time finding anything to buy during the first week of every month. I bet this place is really going to struggle for the first year or so, until the downtown population crosses the 12,000 mark.

bprop wrote:

innov8ion wrote:
I have it on inside news that City Grocer's will not stay in that area and compete with Schnuck's.

No, City Grocers won't be there per se, but Schnucks will have competition.

Huh? Are you speaking about some potential City Grocer / Straub partnership? Partnership or not, I don't see how it's viable to compete with Schnuck's on the same block. Schnuck's would put them out of business. West of Tucker, sure...

We shall see!



If we were to play "what if"...what if City Grocers stays as is (possibly changing names ) , keeps an active lunch business, maybe adding some sort of Mongolian BBQ option not found downtown anymore, offering wines, cheese, beer, spirits, desserts, cooking classes, 'ready-made' or make-yourself meals a la Meal Makers, or adding catering, while still keeping some staples.... would it still be viable?



We all talk about the downtown population being 10,000+, but I've been in a number of small towns about that size, and all had more than one grocery store, even near to the Wal-Mart. Is it only the close proximity that would make the two incompatible?