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PostJul 17, 2008#3626

P-D: You've taken some jabs about the halting progress of Ballpark Village. To some extent things have been out of your control. But to what degree can you offer assurances that it's going to happen?



BDJ: I feel confident that the Village will get developed and, from this point forward, in a more timely manner. The market's changed. There will be less residential and more office. We spent a lot of time on the Centene Project, which we thought if it could work would be a great addition to the Village and downtown. But it didn't work. It set us back a number of months. Now you look out there with the dirt and the water…— we need to get started with construction.



P-D: The club has offered assurances before on behalf of itself and the developer. Why should the public be convinced now?



BDJ: I think we have more certainty now because we know Centene won't be here and we were able to acquire the Bowling Hall of Fame site. That also had its own set of complications. If they hadn't chosen to move, we would have loved for them to be in Village. But in that location on that parcel, it wasn't ideal. That would have complicated things to move them to another part of the Village. We could have done it. But I think the way it worked out is probably a cleaner way for us to have certainty for that site and simplify the project.



P-D: Will the project be recognizable compared to its original rendering?



BDJ: I think it will be recognizable from the original vision. I don't think residential will be Phase I. It will be a second phase. I hope the residential market comes back to where it's viable.



P-D: Projections no longer call for completion of the project before the team hosts the All-Star Game next July. What can be done by then?



BDJ: The site will be a lot nicer for the All-Star Game. We'll definitely need to pave and set up an area for various All-Star activities. We were hoping to have it open for the All-Star Game but as of now that's not going to happen.



P-D: When can the city expect to see something coming out of the ground?



BDJ: I think toward the end of the year, the first of next year. I think you'll see some cosmetic things before then. But in terms of real construction ... nothing until later.



P-D: So, for you, is there still a question of whether Ballpark Village will be built?



BDJ: The Village will be built. It's just a matter of when it will be completed.


READ MORE HERE





AHAHAHAHAHAH PAVED!!!!! AHHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA, WHAT A F'N JOKE!



No residential in phase 1, that's such BS.... I wish this project would just go away. We're gonna end up with the same gimmicky faux crap food court flavor of the month that KC has with no residential to sustain it. :bash:

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PostJul 17, 2008#3627

I don't understand this. You have a unique residential draw in that it offers a view of the field. Whats the big office draw? Where's the big demanbd for office space?



without residential this project just doesn't make any sense.

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PostJul 17, 2008#3628

Found on another board:








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PostJul 17, 2008#3629

I'm starting to doubt if it will even be as good as KC's district, but yeah if you cant sell condos looking into the Cards stadium, where can you in this town? Like I said before, they would be sold before you could even build them. I wish we didnt have to follow up NY, we're really going to look like sh*t now....thankyou Cordish.

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PostJul 17, 2008#3630

This whole thing mystifies me. I realize that the housing market sucks. I realize that the downtown condo market looks saturated given the current economic conditions. but THESE ARE UNIQUE! Its the equivalent of beach front property. There's always demand for beach front residential.



I worry that they're going to throw up a few mediocre mid rise office buildings in those prime residential spots. The entire opportunity will be lost.

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PostJul 17, 2008#3631

Downtown could use some new Class A office space. Especially if it involves the multitude of Law offices with leases coming up (I think it approaches a million square feet of space over the next 2-3 years). Otherwise you might see the law offices make an exodus to Clayton Central Business District. Anything that stops the bleeding of office workers from downtown will only help the residential market in the long term.



Law offices is a good example of a business driven by servicing cliente. Having a premium corner office overlooking the ballpark does mean something in business. Plus, their is ample room for a number of towers which this project should strive for in the long term.

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PostJul 17, 2008#3632

And a lot of the Class B space would make good residential conversions similar to the former PET building, especially the upper floors of older mid-century small-floor-plate buildings, like Millenium Center (6th/Olive) and Gateway Tower (Memorial/Market).

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PostJul 17, 2008#3633

The last two points are well taken - the ball park is a draw for business as well and office space can be converted at a later date ... but I'd much rather see a building DESIGNED for residential take advantage of those views. And you could always do both. There's nothing stopping them from building 10+ floors of office on top of the residential floors.



lets just pray to god they don;t foul up the opportunity all together and build itty bitty buildings with less than 10 stories ....

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PostJul 17, 2008#3634

southslider wrote:And a lot of the Class B space would make good residential conversions similar to the former PET building, especially the upper floors of older mid-century small-floor-plate buildings, like Millenium Center (6th/Olive) and Gateway Tower (Memorial/Market).


At the same time though, both of those buildings fill important roles in the office market and offer a good product at a very reasonable price.

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PostJul 17, 2008#3635

markofucity wrote:The last two points are well taken - the ball park is a draw for business as well and office space can be converted at a later date ... but I'd much rather see a building DESIGNED for residential take advantage of those views. And you could always do both. There's nothing stopping them from building 10+ floors of office on top of the residential floors.



lets just pray to god they don;t foul up the opportunity all together and build itty bitty buildings with less than 10 stories ....


I have the feeling they will.

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PostJul 17, 2008#3636

yeah I have the same feeling .... another case of St. Louis shooting itself in the foot.

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PostJul 17, 2008#3637

You know, building out the site with no building over ten stories would certainly be an opportunities lost, but I would hardly call it shooting downtown in the foot. No, for downtown to "shoot itself in the foot" the site would need to become parkland.

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PostJul 17, 2008#3638

^ Our backwards comptroller Darlene Green thought it would be a good idea to turn the site into a "nice park with benches and a pond". It was pretty disgusting to say the least. I'm just infuriated that neither Corshit, the city bleeders, or Dimwitt realize that you could sell multiple tall ass condos looking into the ballpark before you could even get them built. Its likely that only doctors, lawyers, etc. would be able to afford those views anyway. The demand for these kind of units is inelastic, there will always be someone willing to buy a condo in this close proximity to one of the nation's most popular franchises. Only in St. Louis could we blow an opportunity like this, because our city leaders truly do not have the confidence or balls to make it work.

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PostJul 17, 2008#3639

^I could not agree more with this statement. I feel that this kind of residential, unlike none other in its' area and seen as a form of destination living for those with excess, would pre-sell without issue. It almost seems as though Dewitt is being fed lines about why this cannot be build and why residential would have to be part of Phase 2 (being that there ever will be a Phase 1). Besides, by the time a high rise tower would be completed...the market may be in a completely different place. These things are cyclical...



Can you imagine a vacant lot next to Wrigly Field or Petco Park "struggling" to find residents or tenants to live in that location?



The more I hear about this project, the more I become disillusioned with this city.

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PostJul 17, 2008#3640

markofucity wrote:yeah I have the same feeling .... another case of St. Louis shooting itself in the foot.


The only thing St. Louis could do successfully is shoot itself in BOTH feet with a single bullet.

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PostJul 17, 2008#3641

I would love to see, if the option were available, how many people would plunk $100,000 as a deposit for the first chance to own a home in ballpark village. Either Cordish knows something I don't (which is highly possible) or they are simply blowing a huge opportunity here.

PostJul 17, 2008#3642

is it possible Cordish simply doesn't have enough experience with residential real estate and they are going with what they know? I looked on their website under the "residential" and they only mentioned two properties.



I know I have spent a lot of time talking about the positive effects of Cordish developments elsewhere, but I really wish someone else had the rights to this property.

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PostJul 17, 2008#3643

I really wanna kick these guys in the nutsatchel for this!

and the worst part is that too many people here just shrug and say "well, whaddya expect, we're just St. Louis" :evil:

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PostJul 18, 2008#3644

markofucity wrote:There's nothing stopping them from building 10+ floors of office on top of the residential floors.
Nothing but Cordish and/or their financiers. And I'm pretty sure that'd be the other way around, 10+ floors of residential on top of the office floors. :)

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PostJul 18, 2008#3645

Bill DeWitt adds more info on project in an interview with the STL Post-Dispatch:

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/sports ... enDocument



The info can be found near the end of the interview. What I got out of it is that we an expect a big paved area for All-Star Game activities with some preliminary construction activities going on on a section of the site?

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PostJul 18, 2008#3646

http://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/stor ... tory2.html


City, Cordish near Ballpark Village deal



St. Louis Business Journal - by Christopher Tritto and Lisa brown



After more than a year of delays, Ballpark Village developers and St. Louis city officials said they expect to finalize a development agreement for the vacant site next to Busch Stadium within the next couple weeks.



"We're at the point where we're either going to get it done or not going to get it done," said Jeff Rainford, Mayor Francis Slay's chief of staff.



Plans still call for a $650 million multi-phased, mixed-use development similar to that proposed before Centene Corp. announced last September it would purchase a portion of the site and build a new headquarters there, according to Rainford and Cardinals President Bill DeWitt III.



That deal fell through in March when Centene opted to build instead in Clayton. Earlier plans for the first phase of Ballpark Village included at least 100,000 square feet of office space and 270,000 square feet of entertainment and retail space.




-RBB

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PostJul 18, 2008#3647

there will be a press conference early next week. Might not be a residential component.


A major difference in the revised agreement is that Cordish wants to eliminate the residential component from its $387 million first phase of construction and save it for a later date when market conditions improve. Citing tight credit markets and a battered housing market, DeWitt said a new condominium tower does not make sense right now.



Cordish officials have always been careful to call the housing market in downtown St. Louis an emerging one, noting that no new residential high-rise projects have been built downtown in decades. In an April 18, 2006, memo to city officials, Cordish Director of Finance Jason Epstein said that the final project would change to meet evolving market conditions.



Slay has long pushed for condominiums or apartments as part of the plan, but is now willing to give Cordish more flexibility.




http://stlouis.bizjournals.com/stlouis/ ... tory2.html

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PostJul 18, 2008#3648

Not great, but not awful. Given downtown is on the verge of loosing two of the areas top law firms because downtown has no developments to offer up for new Class A space, it is critical that this development provide such space. If, as we all believe, residential development adjacent to the Ballpark is a sure-fire money maker, then it is ok that the residential component of the BPV be pushed off until a second or third phase (and yes I am skeptical that such a phase would ever be built) because there is plenty of land around the stadium for residential development not part of the BPV.

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PostJul 18, 2008#3649

Finally - real news.



The paper edition of the business journal this morning is reporting that an agreement has been reached on the $650 million project. Stifel was brought on by the city as a mediator in the negotiations. Both parties lost out on something:



- The city loses out on new residential construction in Phase I. Residential will be considered for Phase II based on market conditions.



- Cordish loses out on guaranteed bonds from the city. Apparently all other Cordish developments received this (including the KC P&L) so this was a big win for the city.



- Stifel is considering leasing space in the development.



- Office space for Phase I will be between 100,000 sq. ft and 750,000 sq. ft (big range)

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PostJul 18, 2008#3650

Whoop-de-freaking-do.



We're about to lose two major law firms that employ 1,000 people and lease over 300,000 sf of space.

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