Ballpark Village Towers and Mixed Use Project

matguy70 · PostMar 05, 2005#12005-03-05T02:25+00:00

For the latest news, please see the end of the thread.

Are these photos (still on the Cardinal's website) still valid construction photos for the Village?

http://cardinals.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/stl ... photos.jsp

xing · PostMar 05, 2005#22005-03-05T02:29+00:00

What they're building is already different than what you see there, so my answer would be "no."

MattnSTL · PostMar 05, 2005#32005-03-05T04:31+00:00

Simple answer no. More complex answer is that it is unknown how much residential, retail, office, entertainment, etc. will be built until a developer is selected in a couple of months and some more concrete plans are drawn up. Those were never really final concepts, they were just ideas to show the public what the Card's were envisioning for the area, and I'm sure they didn't hurt the effort to obtain public funding, which ultimately basically failed. It will be built though, I can assure you of that.

metzgda · PostMar 05, 2005#42005-03-05T15:56+00:00

Question - Is the residential tower in these renderings taller than it was originally? It seems to be 30 or so stories in these renderings, and I could have swore it was only about 20 when they first came out.

Anyway, I would agree that Ballpark Village will probably look nothing like this.

MattnSTL · PostMar 05, 2005#52005-03-05T16:38+00:00

Those renderings have not changed in 4 years. They were only conceptual, so they will not be built either way. I think the height is just taller from the angle of one of the renderings.

smsplanstu · PostMar 05, 2005#62005-03-05T17:49+00:00

Funny how buildings never turn out to be as colorful as drawings depict. Even the worst of buildings were glossed, water colored, or the incorporation of light from the building in the drawings made it seem like the thing to build at the time. I wish archtects would not be ordered to depict buildings more colorful than reality. We need realism in the drawings not deception. It's all in the eye of the beholder.

MattnSTL · PostMar 05, 2005#72005-03-05T20:55+00:00

Administrator wrote: Parts of this discussion, starting with this post, were moved here from the <A HREF="http://www.urbanstl.com/viewtopic.php?t=4">Pet Building Condominiums Redevelopment</A> thread where it was stated that the parking lot across the street from the Pet Building has been listed for sale at $8 million

brickandmortar wrote:Having a redeveloped Pet Building must fit into some plan for Grubb-Ellis as only they know why it's worth $8 million. This could be a sign that they don't see the Cardinals reneging on the Ballpark Village Deal. I can't wait to see a website to see the plans of the new Pet Building.

^The Cardinal's aren't going to renege on Ballpark Village. I don't understand why people keep bringing that up. They don't want an empty lot outside of the new park for one, and they want the profits Ballpark village would bring them. I guess everyone thinks since they are rich corporate people that they won't carry through, and it was just a ploy to get public funding. (not an attack on any specific person, just St. Louisans in general.)

matguy70 · PostMar 05, 2005#82005-03-05T21:16+00:00

New Stadium construction photos from I-44/I-55 Southbound ramp off the PSB. The stadium is looking very nice (I must admit I am beginning to like it)

all taken 03/05/05

MattnSTL · PostMar 05, 2005#92005-03-05T21:27+00:00

Matguy, do you mind if I use those on ballparkconstruction.com.

matguy70 · PostMar 05, 2005#102005-03-05T21:28+00:00

Everyone is given full use of all of my photos as long as they are promoting the Gateway City. So - Yes - and thanks!

MattnSTL · PostMar 05, 2005#112005-03-05T21:29+00:00

That's what I figured. Thanks.

brickandmortar · PostMar 05, 2005#122005-03-05T23:04+00:00

MattnSTL wrote:^The Cardinal's aren't going to renege on Ballpark Village. I don't understand why people keep bringing that up. They don't want an empty lot outside of the new park for one, and they want the profits Ballpark village would bring them. I guess everyone thinks since they are rich corporate people that they won't carry through, and it was just a ploy to get public funding. (not an attack on any specific person, just St. Louisans in general.)

Just look at the promise of the Kiel Opera House renovation by the Blues which hasn't happened in the 12+ years Savvis Center has been open. That is why it comes up and will continue to be brought up. The Cardinals will more than likely build Ballpark Village given the incentives in the ballpark deal. This parking lot is not part of the Ballpark Village plan.

MattnSTL · PostMar 06, 2005#132005-03-06T12:09+00:00

Kiel Opera house is a whole different situation in my mind. That was a Civic progress deal, which truly didn't surprise me that it was never done. But I can see how the two are seen related like that. I guess I am just more trusting of the Cardinal's than most people.

mcarril · PostMar 06, 2005#142005-03-06T18:59+00:00

Also I think the Cardinals are contractully obligated to build the Ballpark Village. (I think it's linked to their tax breaks, but not sure) Civic Progress's pledge to restore Kiel Opera House was more of a Gentlemen's Agreement, I believe. There were no penalties if they didn't do anything.

MattnSTL · PostMar 06, 2005#152005-03-06T19:23+00:00

Right, they don't have to develop the whole thing according to their obligations, but they have to spend at least 60 million and develop 2 blocks. Why would the stop at that though. They already have many developers interested.

courtland · PostMar 06, 2005#162005-03-06T23:35+00:00

remember, the cards owners are home grown st. louisans. that's why I believe that you will see ballpark village built and built well.

brickandmortar · PostMar 07, 2005#172005-03-07T02:09+00:00

^The Cardinals are not owned by St. Louisans only a small percentage

courtland · PostMar 07, 2005#182005-03-07T03:06+00:00

^are you sure? I thought they were country day boys...

MattnSTL · PostMar 07, 2005#192005-03-07T03:11+00:00

I don't know what the percentages are, but there is a good number of local owners, and yes, some out of towners. While the majority owner, Bill Dewitt III, lives in Cincinatti, he is basically still a St. Louisan. He was even a bat boy for the St. Louis Browns way back when.

matth · PostMar 07, 2005#202005-03-07T13:45+00:00

It has been thrown around that St. Louis will probably get the 2009 All-Star game, and the owners mentioned in an interview that this was perfect for them, because they would be able to showcase a good portion of the Ballpark Village by then. So one would have to assume from this that they have intentions of moving forward rather quickly with the rest of the project.......

debaliviere · PostMar 07, 2005#212005-03-07T16:05+00:00

The great thing about Ballpark Village is that it is not nearly as risky an investment as it was when the project was originally proposed. Just think about how far downtown has come since 2000 - when the original renderings were released. The public's perception of downtown is improving rapidly, and by the time the current Busch Stadium is completely torn down, the land that will be the site of Ballpark Village should be hot property!

I would really like to see development that resembles the Ballpark Village renderings - I love the highrise and the office/residential buildings with terraces overlooking the stadium. I especially like the canyon-like rendering showing Broadway looking north. This project should add some much-needed density to the southern part of downtown.

chesterfieldkid03 · PostJun 02, 2005#222005-06-02T13:07+00:00

Cardinals team up with developer for Ballpark Village

By Martin Van Der Werf

Of the Post-Dispatch

06/02/2005

The St. Louis Cardinals today will announce a partnership with Baltimore-based Cordish Co. to develop Ballpark Village, sources close to the deal say. The Cardinals and Cordish apparently have agreed to be 50-50 partners on the office-residential-retail complex that will rise in and around where Busch Stadium now stands.

Cordish is perhaps best known for four large redevelopments in Baltimore's Inner Harbor. It has focused much of its urban renewal work on the East Coast but has been branching out.

The company now is developing the Power and Light district in downtown Kansas City.

Expat · PostJun 02, 2005#232005-06-02T13:11+00:00

This is great! They have done some fantastic things in the Balto/Wash area.

debaliviere · PostJun 02, 2005#242005-06-02T13:44+00:00

I think they're also handling the Main Street Live development in Louisville. Sounds like a good developer for this project.

There's an ESPN Zone in the Baltimore Inner Harbor - maybe they'll be able to get one for Ballpak Village.

chesterfieldkid03 · PostJun 02, 2005#252005-06-02T14:10+00:00

I would bet on St. Louis getting an ESPN Zone, we are one of if the not the best sports cities in the country, how could we not get one? I would also like to see a Bubba Gumps, I have been to the one in Chicago and San Fran and loved it. I would not be surprised if Hard Rock decided to move. Ballpark Village will have action a lot more often then Union Station does. Hard Rock is usually located at other Cordish projects too. As far as retail stores, I?m not too sure what to expect for the development.