urbanSTL

^ yes adding jobs... why is this so hard to understand?



New jobs to Centene, new jobs to the region, new jobs to St. louis, new jobs to dT, new jobs to BPV

I'm pumped to see some serious renderings and a time table. First time in my memory STL wins a big one over Clayton and its about time.

Doug wrote:The jobs are relocating Downtown but they are not new to the region. Good for Downtown and a loss for Clayton.

This is incorrect. There was just a Centene spokeswoman on KTRS that said the jobs in Clayton will stay in Clayton except for the executives which will move downtown. So like 400+ stay in Clayton. The 1200 jobs coming into downtown will be new jobs.

ArchMadness wrote:I'm pumped to see some serious renderings and a time table. First time in my memory STL wins a big one over Clayton and its about time.

Until you all realize that it's virtually impossible for "STL to win a big one over Clayton," the musical chairs will continue.

Centene does have an office in West County that faces highway 40 am I right? I know I just drove past a building with a Centene sign two weeks ago. If this is true, they may just be moving the jobs from this building downtown, but I obviously have no clue.

The office in West County across the highway from Chesterfield Mall is for those workers who will be affected by the 40/64 construction next year. They were very proactive in finding alternative office space for the folks that live out west. That is a temporary office site.

Some of you really need to get over yourselves concerning tax incentives. When other locations across the country including high growth cities are offering great packages, we have to one up them. For all the optimism we have for St. Louis, we are still way behind other cities, and even our suburbs. It's just a fact of life that we have to deal with. Until huge incentives are no longer offered by everyone, we will have to play the game as well. Stop comparing St. Louis to Chicago or New York. We are just not in that league.Having seen how other deals are financed first hand, I don't have a particular problem with this one. Sure, I'd love to see this being done with completely private money, but we are still in the early stages. As long as we don't kill the momentum now we can maybe have that in 20 years.



About 31% of Centene's project will be funded by tax credits. This is about the same percentage as Ballpark Village as a whole. I'd love for it to be less, but that is just what we have to deal with.



Somewhat the same topic, I potentially see this as attracting other companies downtown. Not necessarily Fortune 500's, but smaller high growth companies. Between most major tenants resigning downtown in the last few years, and Centene among other moving downtown, there have been some major commitments. Hopefully more companies will see these companies willing to stay or move and considering moving themselves.

bonwich wrote:

ArchMadness wrote:I'm pumped to see some serious renderings and a time table. First time in my memory STL wins a big one over Clayton and its about time.

Until you all realize that it's virtually impossible for "STL to win a big one over Clayton," the musical chairs will continue.

Except we did win a big one over Clayton and other locations in the nation. And remaining competitive within the region, nation and world is critical to St. Louis' success. I'm glad the city is run by people who understand how to keep and bring in new business to the city rather than by theorists with little basis in reality.

I'm just happy about getting a firm date for the start of construction. This pretty much guarantees that they will finally build BPV.

^That doesn't make sense, Doug. These are new positions, with the old ones at Centene still existing in Clayton and other areas. If someone leaves another company for Centene, don't they need to fill that job at the other company. They won't just leave that vacant because their employee left for another opportunity. The new employee may come from here, or somewhere else, but it is still a new job. It's pretty simple, really.

^^ I don't think it matters how "region" is defined. What part of 600 additional jobs do you not understand?

Somewhat the same topic, I potentially see this as attracting other companies downtown. Not necessarily Fortune 500's, but smaller high growth companies. Between most major tenants resigning downtown in the last few years, and Centene among other moving downtown, there have been some major commitments. Hopefully more companies will see these companies willing to stay or move and considering moving themselves.

In some ways this is an ice breaker, kind of like when the first loft development came in, then the first new restaurant, then the first new retail. I believe what you say, now watch for the new business class to take shape.

irocktheparty2000 wrote:In some ways this is an ice breaker, kind of like when the first loft development came in, then the first new restaurant, then the first new retail. I believe what you say, now watch for the new business class to take shape.

That's the way I look at it. This could be a tremendous show of confidence in the viability of downtown as a place in which to do business. Let's hope others follow Centene's lead.

Doug wrote:I am saying this because employees leaving one company (old) for another (Centene) and moving the HQ to Downtown from Clayton is not regional growth. It is the City proper gaining a new company which could have remained in the MSA, or left for another, however this does not necessarily indicate that people outside our MSA will move here for Centene. Instead, existing MSA residents could quit their old job and work for Centene. So it is more revenue for the City, less for Clayton, but it does not mean our region is growing. Growth implies more workers and residents from other MSA's and Centene's move does not guarantee that will occur.

Wow. By that logic, every company from a startup growing organically, to a Fortune 500 company moving its international HQ to St. Louis would not be adding jobs to the St. Louis region, because, of course, there is no guarantee that St. Louisans won't quit their current jobs and take the new jobs. And, of course, the people that did move to the region with their company would eventually quit and then St. Louisans might take their jobs...ow, my head hurts...

For every new job that gets created, is another job that needs to be filled by a human. If that human leaves another job to take the new one, then that job gets vacated, and needs to be filled by another human. The cycle turns until somebody who was unemployed gets a job, and then unemployment goes down.



Good, right?

^...or someone decides to move to St. Louis because there is a job opening.

Doug wrote:It is a new job as in it didn't exist before, and this is good for the City itself as we will capture more revenue through earnings and consumption taxes, but in terms of regional growth and competition with other cities I am not entirely convinced. If these new positions don't attract people from other cities, and this is simply people within the MSA choosing to work for Centene in Downtown over a previous employer, then this is not regional growth. It is positive for the City in that we are trying to recenter the CBD, but that doesn't mean that we will have regional population growth by attracting workers from other regions.

Doug, you're almost always pro-city and anti-anything not in the city proper (st louis suburbs, inner-suburbs, metro-east, etc). Anytime any of those places come up your response is too bad it's not in the city or it should be in the city...



So, why the negativity on this?

Hopefully it won't be 1200 - 600 = 600 new jobs for downtown, but rather 600 in Clayton + 1200 new jobs in downtown.