I think the two go hand in hand, developing the area around the Dome/convention center would bring in more conventions. Right now the best we have to offer is you come out the convention center and the first thing you see is a dreary garage. Instant quick fix is a STL Made mesh sign on this whole thing
- 1,864
Absolutely. And I think that Downtown STL, Inc. and the Downtown CID have some low hanging fruit opportunities like that just aren't pursued. (Full disclosure, I always get these two mixed up as to who does what and how they're interconnected, so apologies if one isn't responsible for this type of investment or planning).
- 2,928
Wow... His intentions may be in the right place, but his understandings of business, travel, and the role of conventions are truly abysmal. There is no tangible comprehension of modern economics. If we are to give up on pursuing conventions because of COVID-19 and market competition, then that logic would also conclude that we give up Downtown's hotels, bars, and restaurants. Also, the airport.framer wrote: ↑Jul 08, 2020Just curious how folks on here feel about Steve Patterson's proposal to defund the convention center:
https://www.urbanreviewstl.com/2020/07/ ... nventions/
"Why invest in things that make money? Why not put our money in things that aren't in demand and abandon what already works? SILVER BULLET!"
^ As usual, you said it better than I could.
He mentions the Convention Center taking up as much space as 4 BPVs...but seems to forget it took 14 years just to get BPV a little more than half built out. The idea that bulldozing the convention center will somehow spur all kinds of construction on the north end of downtown just doesn’t compute.
Never mind the spiral that would put downtown restaurants and businesses in.
He mentions the Convention Center taking up as much space as 4 BPVs...but seems to forget it took 14 years just to get BPV a little more than half built out. The idea that bulldozing the convention center will somehow spur all kinds of construction on the north end of downtown just doesn’t compute.
Never mind the spiral that would put downtown restaurants and businesses in.
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^Thanks for that compliment; certainly appreciated. You got my vote for mayor...
^ Appreciate it, but considering our current reality I think I’ll keep my mayoral talents in SimCity 4 lol.
Finally moving forward:
https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... ing%20News
Dome debt will be paid off next year.
https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... ing%20News
Dome debt will be paid off next year.
Street vacation request is before the Planning Commission on September 2nd. This is for 9th Street between Cole Street and MLK Drive.
Tiny update from the CVC:
https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/new ... dapts.html
https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/new ... dapts.html
Ratcliffe also addressed the $175 million expansion of America's Center, OK'd by a key city panel in August. She said the city's comptroller could now issue bonds for the project by the end of the month. Then, the city's Board of Public Service will sign contracts with service providers, such as the project manager.
St. Louis County will then issue bonds for the project, Ratcliffe said. Construction could take two to two-and-a-half years, she said. It was first unveiled in late 2018.
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When they constructed the dome, the dome roof structure was built while resting on multiple temporary steel towers rising from the field. Then they lowered the dome roof structure down on to the finished walls and removed the temporary support towers.
How expensive would it be to put the temporary towers back up, then detach and jack the dome roof structure straight up say 50-70 feet. Then raise the wall heights 50-70 feet and lower the roof structure back down on to the raised walls. That would allow more room for windows all the way around for natural light. And also allow room for more scoreboards and video boards up high, as well as more room for a very large hanging scoreboard from the center, or in a ring.
I still think creative lighting of the dome roof interior would be at least as interesting as the now fixed-in-place non-opening grey glass roofs in the newest stadiums in Minneapolis, LA, and Las Vegas.
How expensive would it be to put the temporary towers back up, then detach and jack the dome roof structure straight up say 50-70 feet. Then raise the wall heights 50-70 feet and lower the roof structure back down on to the raised walls. That would allow more room for windows all the way around for natural light. And also allow room for more scoreboards and video boards up high, as well as more room for a very large hanging scoreboard from the center, or in a ring.
I still think creative lighting of the dome roof interior would be at least as interesting as the now fixed-in-place non-opening grey glass roofs in the newest stadiums in Minneapolis, LA, and Las Vegas.
^ If I recall, that was part of the original renovation plans to the Dome before and the new stadium was proposed. Change the roof some and let in natural light. I don't remember all the other bells and whistles, but I THINK the total renovation was somewhere in the realm of $700 million.
Actually, here's a link to the story from 2012: https://bleacherreport.com/articles/1182554-st-louis-rams-want-major-renovations-to-the-edward-jones-dome
Actually, here's a link to the story from 2012: https://bleacherreport.com/articles/1182554-st-louis-rams-want-major-renovations-to-the-edward-jones-dome
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That one was the Rams ridiculous counter-proposal which involved tearing down the East Side of the stadium and rebuilding it with seats further from the field to be like Dallas. It would have cost $700 million and shut down the use of the stadium for 3 years.EssTeeEll wrote: ↑Oct 26, 2020^ If I recall, that was part of the original renovation plans to the Dome before and the new stadium was proposed. Change the roof some and let in natural light. I don't remember all the other bells and whistles, but I THINK the total renovation was somewhere in the realm of $700 million.
Actually, here's a link to the story from 2012: https://bleacherreport.com/articles/1182554-st-louis-rams-want-major-renovations-to-the-edward-jones-dome
CVC proposal wast $124 million and a lot smarter. It would have included a center-hung scoreboard, (which they could still do it they chose), and natural light coming above the seats all the way around. Also involved expanding the East side of the building cantilevered out over Broadway with all glass walls. Also new seats and club seats and suite renovations. Here is a link to the CVC proposal. https://www.stltoday.com/sports/football/professional/rams-receive-dynamic-new-plan-to-renovate-edward-jones-dome/article_a2c1e2ac-eaed-11e1-9314-001a4bcf6878.html
I saw the interior of the new Las Vegas dome, and it looked a lot like the interior of the EJD except it had a fixed-in-place glass roof and there was more wall space above the top row for video boards. If you have a glass roof that doesn't open, and it is just for light, put in LEDs to simulate the same thing in the dome. The dome has always been way too dim inside.
I actually liked this plan more than the CVC plan or the new stadium on the riverfront.EssTeeEll wrote:^ If I recall, that was part of the original renovation plans to the Dome before and the new stadium was proposed. Change the roof some and let in natural light. I don't remember all the other bells and whistles, but I THINK the total renovation was somewhere in the realm of $700 million.
Actually, here's a link to the story from 2012: https://bleacherreport.com/articles/1182554-st-louis-rams-want-major-renovations-to-the-edward-jones-dome
To be fair, both the CVC and the Rams' proposal (which it turns out was basically just designed to give them legal cover to move the team to LA) addressed the light situation but I don't think either included doing what Gary suggested. The CVC just wanted holes cut into the dome and fill those with windows, whereas the Rams proposed (among other things) completely demolishing and rebuilding the east half of the Dome.EssTeeEll wrote: ↑Oct 26, 2020^ If I recall, that was part of the original renovation plans to the Dome before and the new stadium was proposed. Change the roof some and let in natural light. I don't remember all the other bells and whistles, but I THINK the total renovation was somewhere in the realm of $700 million.
Actually, here's a link to the story from 2012: https://bleacherreport.com/articles/1182554-st-louis-rams-want-major-renovations-to-the-edward-jones-dome
Gary's idea is since the roof is technically just resting in place, in theory it could be jacked up, a ring of windows built under the suspended roof, then lower it onto the new windows - like taking a ready-to-eat hamburger and making it a cheeseburger by sliding a piece of cheese under the top bun.
Personally I like it! I'm no engineer; I'd think something like that would be technically possible, but I've no idea how practical or expensive such an undertaking might be.
-RBB
I remember seeing a picture of those steel towers and the framework for the roof taken from the upper stands looking to the south in the Post Dispatch. You could see right into the stadium from the Mercantile Tower and it seemed so logical to have an open section of the roof to take advantage of the skyline views.
Wonder what the cost differences would be for a ceiling jack compared with a new, translucent or clear roof material like the Rams new stadium? Maybe we can put Stan on the hook for our stadium improvements while we are wishing for things?
Wonder what the cost differences would be for a ceiling jack compared with a new, translucent or clear roof material like the Rams new stadium? Maybe we can put Stan on the hook for our stadium improvements while we are wishing for things?
pdm_ad wrote: ↑Oct 26, 2020I remember seeing a picture of those steel towers and the framework for the roof taken from the upper stands looking to the south in the Post Dispatch. You could see right into the stadium from the Mercantile Tower and it seemed so logical to have an open section of the roof to take advantage of the skyline views.
Wonder what the cost differences would be for a ceiling jack compared with a new, translucent or clear roof material like the Rams new stadium? Maybe we can put Stan on the hook for our stadium improvements while we are wishing for things?
-RBB
My first thought is that shadows would be a nightmare on the field. Though maybe not if the glass is diffuse enough.
No architect, but always thought it would have just been easier to remove most of the roof. Keep an overhang for the top stands.
No architect, but always thought it would have just been easier to remove most of the roof. Keep an overhang for the top stands.
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Aside from the fact that they'd have to completely dig up the entire floor to add in the required drainage systems, as well as completely renovate all HVAC systems, they'd also lose the ability to host many many large scale concerts that require an indoor facility. No more possibility to host NCAA Final Fours, winter major concert tours, or tradeshows that require the use of the Dome floor for space.
City closed on the sale of bonds today for the Convention Center renovation:
https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... ccd10.html
https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... ccd10.html
The way Green laid it out to the BJ seems that the City was able to raise a little extra money. The expansion was originally billed at $170 million...that has now increased to $210 million.The offering was oversubscribed and raised enough to cover the city's share of $105 million in bonds for the project. St. Louis County agreed last year to cover the other half of the project. It hasn't issued its bonds but has an existing account that can cover its share of the project's beginning stages.
Work is expected to start soon on the project that will add 92,000 square feet of exhibit space along Cole Street and a 65,000-square-foot ballroom along Ninth Street, as well as a new pavilion and public plaza on a surface parking lot behind the T-Rex business incubator. The project is slated for completion in 2023.
https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/new ... 8#cxrecs_sGreen said the bonds generated three-and-a-half-times oversubscription in orders from interested investors, and that the sale allowed the city to net "additional proceeds for the expansion projects."
Well, well, well:
St. Louis convention commission buying long-sought Seventh Street garage
https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... the-latest
St. Louis convention commission buying long-sought Seventh Street garage
https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... the-latest
“This acquisition is just to get it under control," Ratcliffe told the board. "We would anticipate, although I think there's further discussion that needs to happen on this, that this would eventually be demolished.”
She said it would likely become a surface lot in the short term but that owning the land would allow for future development on the site.
Never thought I would see the day.sc4mayor wrote: ↑Mar 03, 2021Well, well, well:
St. Louis convention commission buying long-sought Seventh Street garage
https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... the-latest“This acquisition is just to get it under control," Ratcliffe told the board. "We would anticipate, although I think there's further discussion that needs to happen on this, that this would eventually be demolished.”
She said it would likely become a surface lot in the short term but that owning the land would allow for future development on the site.
Can’t wait for more surface lots though! Hopefully this is a quick turn around to something else.
I'm surprised about the surface lot. I thought the goal of buying the garage was to expand the second floor ballroom? Or is there no money for that now?jshank83 wrote: ↑Mar 03, 2021Never thought I would see the day.sc4mayor wrote: ↑Mar 03, 2021Well, well, well:
St. Louis convention commission buying long-sought Seventh Street garage
https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... the-latest“This acquisition is just to get it under control," Ratcliffe told the board. "We would anticipate, although I think there's further discussion that needs to happen on this, that this would eventually be demolished.”
She said it would likely become a surface lot in the short term but that owning the land would allow for future development on the site.
Can’t wait for more surface lots though! Hopefully this is a quick turn around to something else.
^ Article says they couldn’t acquire the garage before the bonds were sold for the already planned expansion. I don’t believe they’re able to go back and rework it all now that the bonds have been sold.
Ballroom is being expanded into other areas.
Ballroom is being expanded into other areas.
Where are they expanding? I thought the whole point was to have one larger ballroom space: not two separate ones.sc4mayor wrote: ↑Mar 04, 2021^ Article says they couldn’t acquire the garage before the bonds were sold for the already planned expansion. I don’t believe they’re able to go back and rework it all now that the bonds have been sold.
Ballroom is being expanded into other areas.