Butler Brothers is a behemoth and falls squarely in that ??? category.jsbru wrote:With this recent barrage of announcements, are there really any major buildings left in the ??? category? The only one I can think of is the MX Library. I suppose nothing specific has been announced for the Chemical, either. Which I thought would be one of the first ones to be redeveloped because it seemingly has so much potential.
We're almost out of the hole when it comes to boarded up buildings. By 2020, people may have little to complain about.
Then it will be on to Phase II of revitalizing DT: turning the myriad of surface parking lots into something attractive.
I thought somebody had a plan for Butler Brothers. Or has that not gone through or already fallen through?
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^ don't think it was an actual plan... when the owners began marketing it for sale they mocked up a mixed-use vision to try and create some buzz for potential buyers. iirc they thought about 300 luxury units with inside parking and some retail. Something similar occurred with the marketing of the KMOV building which has potential for another tower.
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Just got back from a nice road trip in Michigan. I stop at places such as Grand Haven Grand Rapids and Detroit.
I really enjoyed Grand Haven a nice little historic downtown. Downtown Grand Rapids had a few cranes with quite a bit of rehabs going on there and i finally Detroit which i thought i wasn't going to like all that much however happened to really enjoy it a lot Campus Martius Downtown Riverfront i stopped in a few places such as Moose Jaw saw the New Detroit Arena the new street car line which they are still working on along Woodward then went to Belle Isle and before leaving went to check on the Grosse Pointe neighborhoods Lake St Clair is so beautiful
Downtown Detroit has a lot going on was very alive so many people just enjoying themselves lots of rehabs the atmosphere felt refreshing i honestly thought i was not going to like it but found the people to be so friendly and helpful
I really hope that we can someday get a street car downtown cause honestly think that could further more redevelopment here likes its doing there in Detroit
Anyways Detroit doesn't seem like a city that had gone through a bankruptcy
Oh that Michigan Central Station is darn beautiful even abandoned just think of what that will be like once they bring that big beautiful building back to life.
I really enjoyed Grand Haven a nice little historic downtown. Downtown Grand Rapids had a few cranes with quite a bit of rehabs going on there and i finally Detroit which i thought i wasn't going to like all that much however happened to really enjoy it a lot Campus Martius Downtown Riverfront i stopped in a few places such as Moose Jaw saw the New Detroit Arena the new street car line which they are still working on along Woodward then went to Belle Isle and before leaving went to check on the Grosse Pointe neighborhoods Lake St Clair is so beautiful
Downtown Detroit has a lot going on was very alive so many people just enjoying themselves lots of rehabs the atmosphere felt refreshing i honestly thought i was not going to like it but found the people to be so friendly and helpful
I really hope that we can someday get a street car downtown cause honestly think that could further more redevelopment here likes its doing there in Detroit
Anyways Detroit doesn't seem like a city that had gone through a bankruptcy
Oh that Michigan Central Station is darn beautiful even abandoned just think of what that will be like once they bring that big beautiful building back to life.
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^ I really do think having a Saint Louis Streetcar would cement downtown/midtown as an unquestionably heading-in-the-right-direction place. A big plus would be helping to stitch up former weak spots as it is doing in Detroit... Olive and Locust etc. would really benefit big time from say 14th Street over to Grand Center....the Hard Times Lounge close by the police HQ could be renamed the Moving On Up Lounge! And by all accounts the KC Streetcar is absolutely crushing it so far on ridership.
And as for Detroit, I really wish I were up there this weekend for the Movement Festival, which brings techno fans from around the globe.... Kraftwerk was a headliner.
And as for Detroit, I really wish I were up there this weekend for the Movement Festival, which brings techno fans from around the globe.... Kraftwerk was a headliner.
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One thing that was very obvious is Detroit's blight it was sad seeing it. I honestly feel St.Louis's blight is very salvageable and rather sooner than later we can start to see a resurgence of North St.Louis in redevelopment.
St.Louis is doing some great things just sad that crime is always over shadowing the progress the city has made.
St.Louis is doing some great things just sad that crime is always over shadowing the progress the city has made.
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Downtown STL, Inc.'s 2016 State of Downtown report is out now:
http://www.downtownstl.org/wp-content/u ... d_6-28.pdf
The large increase in units and residents definitely is the highlight; estimated 7% population growth from '14 to '15
http://www.downtownstl.org/wp-content/u ... d_6-28.pdf
The large increase in units and residents definitely is the highlight; estimated 7% population growth from '14 to '15
That's great to see. At that rate the DT Core (DT & DTW) will eclipse 10,000 residents sometime next year.
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^ And with 5,000 each in both Downtown & Downtown West. Definitely a nice milestone to reach. Hopefully we're getting closer to the point where retailers besides bars/restaurants are looking more closely at downtown, whether it's locally owned shops or nationals.
A couple stories between PD and Business Journals in regards to hotel rooms downtown. Between remodel and botique hotels proposed it looks like up to a $100 million between the $12 million Lumier remodelling rooms and two of the botique hotels at roughly $45-47 million a piece in rehab going forward this fall.
http://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/morn ... hotel.html
http://www.stltoday.com/business/local/ ... 25d1d.html
and one step back again...wonder if Gils tried to do to much at one time and decided that the blackhawk hotel was priority or if selling price just doesn't work for the numbers?
http://www.stltoday.com/business/column ... fd7d7.html
http://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/morn ... hotel.html
http://www.stltoday.com/business/local/ ... 25d1d.html
and one step back again...wonder if Gils tried to do to much at one time and decided that the blackhawk hotel was priority or if selling price just doesn't work for the numbers?
http://www.stltoday.com/business/column ... fd7d7.html
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^ given the number of deals that have fallen through, the Chemical must need some MAJOR work that isn't immediately evident.
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The International Shoe owner has had a building permit in for a few weeks now (but not yet approved)... it'll be nice to get one of these announced downtown projects actually started.
As for the Cursed Chemical, I've heard small floor plates are a design challenge but never anything about the condition of the building itself being significantly worse than your standard rehab of such buildings. I'm confident it'll eventually come back online and while acknowledging beggars can't be choosers when it comes to downtown rehab, Id rather see buildings like the International Shoe and LaSalle get rehabbed first.
As for the Cursed Chemical, I've heard small floor plates are a design challenge but never anything about the condition of the building itself being significantly worse than your standard rehab of such buildings. I'm confident it'll eventually come back online and while acknowledging beggars can't be choosers when it comes to downtown rehab, Id rather see buildings like the International Shoe and LaSalle get rehabbed first.
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^ My understanding with the Chemical is that it's a relatively small building (with small floor plates), has zero parking, and isn't in bad enough shape to be a bargain.
^Sounds just like the Roberts Tower before UrbanStreet bought it and built it out.
So Chemical building needs either a developer with financial ability to go out of their comfort zone but afford the risk or as Wabash noted, someone who might go full steam ahead with outcome to be known later because they really didn't know what they were doing in first place.Alex Ihnen wrote:^ My understanding with the Chemical is that it's a relatively small building (with small floor plates), has zero parking, and isn't in bad enough shape to be a bargain.
I'm still under the impression that Gils decided that one downtown project is enough for their plate and risk factor which I'm sure their banker(s) were also expessing. So I do think it is better outcome if they will be able to move forward on the Blackhawk hotel now that they dropped Chemical. Going out on a limb for both projects but not getting either one down would be a much worse outcome.
Thought that this would have been a good opportunity for Enterprise to bring presence downtown. Local corporate leadership simply will not make that move.
http://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/news ... -deal.html
http://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/news ... -deal.html
Definitely disappointing not to see more downtown offices from the big corporation from the county. Is there any specific reason that companies in the region don't see value in having offices in downtown or in the city?
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Unfortunately my corporate office is not based downtown, but yesterday I was lucky enough to be called to Jury Duty. Given a large break I was able to spend 11:30 - 1:15 just walking around. I spend a lot of time downtown but very little of it is during a normal work day. Anecdotally, I was under the impression that the majority of DT was dead during the day. I had the exact opposite experience. I grabbed lunch from the Seoul Taco food truck and enjoyed it in City Garden with 100's of others. From there I walked to the Old Courthouse through the CBD to the OPO, checked out Arcade and the Alverne and everything in between while I meandered back to the Civil Courts building. Everywhere I went the streets had a lot of life. There are still obvious gaps, but overall I felt like DT is in a better position that it was when I lived down there 4 years ago.
To finish the day I showed my loft to a young man from Lawrence, KS who just took a job with BJC. He had his parents with him and they shared the same feeling I just had about downtown. They were blown away with how much DT St. Louis had to offer from the architecture, restaurants, bars, etc. Sometimes it is good to take a look at our city through an outsider's eyes. Someone that doesn't get caught up in the same BS we do as stakeholders.
To finish the day I showed my loft to a young man from Lawrence, KS who just took a job with BJC. He had his parents with him and they shared the same feeling I just had about downtown. They were blown away with how much DT St. Louis had to offer from the architecture, restaurants, bars, etc. Sometimes it is good to take a look at our city through an outsider's eyes. Someone that doesn't get caught up in the same BS we do as stakeholders.
5 Rules For Designing Great Cities
https://www.fastcodesign.com/3061586/sl ... r-urbanist
https://www.fastcodesign.com/3061586/sl ... r-urbanist
I'm willing to bet a large part of that was Pokemon Go. Not kidding. The last few days have been crazy.robertn42 wrote:Unfortunately my corporate office is not based downtown, but yesterday I was lucky enough to be called to Jury Duty. Given a large break I was able to spend 11:30 - 1:15 just walking around. I spend a lot of time downtown but very little of it is during a normal work day. Anecdotally, I was under the impression that the majority of DT was dead during the day. I had the exact opposite experience. I grabbed lunch from the Seoul Taco food truck and enjoyed it in City Garden with 100's of others. From there I walked to the Old Courthouse through the CBD to the OPO, checked out Arcade and the Alverne and everything in between while I meandered back to the Civil Courts building. Everywhere I went the streets had a lot of life. There are still obvious gaps, but overall I felt like DT is in a better position that it was when I lived down there 4 years ago.
To finish the day I showed my loft to a young man from Lawrence, KS who just took a job with BJC. He had his parents with him and they shared the same feeling I just had about downtown. They were blown away with how much DT St. Louis had to offer from the architecture, restaurants, bars, etc. Sometimes it is good to take a look at our city through an outsider's eyes. Someone that doesn't get caught up in the same BS we do as stakeholders.
210 North Tucker and 900 Walnut Data Center buildings sold from Digital Realty to Netrality Properties this past weekend.
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KSDK had a report that the Omni changed hands and will be getting an overhaul and new brand (don't know which though). It needs it to compete if the plentiful plans for more hotels proceed.
user28 wrote:Definitely disappointing not to see more downtown offices from the big corporation from the county. Is there any specific reason that companies in the region don't see value in having offices in downtown or in the city?
Earnings tax.
A largely county based workforce that will incessantly piss and moan about having to go into THE CITY.
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There are a variety of different factors. Earnings tax and crime are 2 of the most overblown reasons but companies will use them as a reason not to locate in the city because it's an easy out.
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