urbanSTL

I'd rather Union Station die a quick death than the slow demise that was St. Louis Centre. When I worked downtown in 1993-1994 it was already quickly emptying out. When did it finally close? Less than five years ago right?

"so I can only surmise that they have plans that don't include those tenants.



They seem to be actively encouraging the retail tenants in the enclosed portion of the mall to leave, and they are going about it in such a way that it is the tenant's decision to break their lease, so the owner doesn't have to go through the eviction process, buy out leases, or absorb the legal expense of a bunch of breach of contract suits.



Perhaps the owner has redevelopment plans for the enclosed retail area, or perhaps they simply feel that Union Station will be easier to sell as a more or less clean slate. I find it extremely difficult to believe however, that the owner and Jones Lang Lasalle are trying to turn US into a profitable enterprise, and they are simply this inept."

It would be nice to believe something real was going on behind the scenes, but I am skeptic. All to often we assume big companies make good decisions, but I think recently we have seen many a big company fail.



I do know for a fact they they have informed at least one civic group that they no longer want to be identified as a retail center and should be considered an attraction. Other than the Grand Hall and the main building, I am not sure what is the attraction. I do think what they really said, is that they are no longer capapble of hanging on to their retail tenants, so the spin is we are an attraction now. I agree with this direction, but every attraction needs a way of producing income. So where's the income? And to date they have not stopped renewing leases. Just most tenants are not renewing their leases.

If they want to make it an attraction, they better do something to make it attractive...like make it into a museum or soemthing.

jlblues wrote:I find it extremely difficult to believe however, that the owner and Jones Lang Lasalle are trying to turn US into a profitable enterprise, and they are simply this inept.

I'm starting to think you're right.

I know, let's revive the commuter and passenger trains that were prosperous in the 30's and 40's and make Union Station our new Union Station.... In all honesty, I would consider that a step forward, even though we are 70 years past that era. One thing that is never brought up in political elections is expanding public transit infrastructure as one of the solutions to the energy crisis. I'll stop now......

DeBaliviere wrote:

jlblues wrote:I find it extremely difficult to believe however, that the owner and Jones Lang Lasalle are trying to turn US into a profitable enterprise, and they are simply this inept.

I'm starting to think you're right.

I could have worded that better. I should have said: I find it extremely difficult to believe, however, that the owner and Jones Lang Lasalle are trying to turn US into a profitable retail enterprise, but are simply this inept.



Or something like that. Anyway, as I said several pages and a year or so ago, Union Station was taken over, and is owned by, a bank. Banks are not in the business of owning real estate, particularly mixed-use entertainment/retail centers. All of their actions must be looked at through that prism. As with any foreclosed property, the bank's only concern is to get the property into a state where they can sell it and recoup as much of their loss as possible, as quickly as possible.



My only question is that because of all the uncertainties surrounding the financial markets and downtown St. Louis development, who, what, and why, would anyone want to take Union Station off the bank's hands anytime soon, for any price, in any format? The upcoming wave of national retail chain bankruptcies and closures, the tight capital markets, whether or not Ballpark Village is going to happen, and what it's format will be if it does, are at the top of the list. And then there is the election and what kind of "economic stimulus" bill the winner will pursue. And is the Chouteau's Pond thing going to happen? What about redevelopment of the 22nd Parkway interchange land west of Union Station? These are all variables in the viability formulae of any redevelopment plan.



Maybe since she seems so buddy-buddy with him, McCaskill can get a nice big fat earmark in the "stimulus" package for redevelopment of Union Station once Obama is in office.

Union Station has been up and down with occupancy for over the past 15 years.



Starbucks closed because of Starbucks cutting stores nationwide and Union Station was one of them. The store itself was fine for profits according to the manager.



Have you seen the market lately? Have you heard about the economy? Well it is in the toilet which is putting everything else in the toilet. Union Station depends highly on tourism and tourist monies. Unfortunately, if you drive up and down Manchester Road in west county you will find the same thing along every strip mall - some 50 percent empty and small retail moving out / closing everyday - it IS very unfortunate.



and may I remind evryone that "hearsay" of stores and restaurants closing is not allowed on these boards. The numbers above may be correct (quote) but to say it "appears" that more are closing is a generalization. If you have hardcore facts ... post them and your resources.



I'm not saying that Union Station is not having it's own problems, but at least they are marketing the place. TV, Radio and billboards are everywhere for the station - you don't see that for any other mall in this metro area. You cannot fault them there! Let's just not generalize "demise" or place blame. Union Station is a huge money sucking entity and I suggest to anyone, if you want to know the facts and you want more information - write or call the real source... Union Station management themselves. Let them know your concerns or what their plans, ideas or comments are on the current issues/situations that the place is facing.



314-421-6655 # listed on their website

http://stlouisunionstation.com/go/displayHours.cfm

INFO@STLOUISUNIONSTATION.COM

matguy70 wrote: I'm not saying that Union Station is not having it's own problems, but at least they are marketing the place. TV, Radio and billboards are everywhere for the station - you don't see that for any other mall in this metro area.

Granted, I don't watch a whole lot of TV, or listen to the radio much, but I haven't seen a single TV spot, or heard a radio spot, for US. The only Union Station marketing that has reached me is their weekly ad in the RFT, which is usually advertising some concert, movie, or other gathering which actually serves to repel, rather than attract me. I don't recall ever seeing an ad online, do they have the internets?



Again, they may be spending money on marketing, but it seems as though all of their efforts must be targeting white, exurban people over 60.

Either Marriott is opening a new hotel in Union Station or they just bought it from Hyatt....



https://www.marriott.com/hotels/fact-sh ... -marriott/

"they just bought it"

July 2008. Managed by Ocean Hospitalities, beginning next month.

what4 wrote:Either Marriott is opening a new hotel in Union Station or they just bought it from Hyatt....



https://www.marriott.com/hotels/fact-sh ... -marriott/

Where have you been. This is old news as this was announced several months back and anticiapated a year ago. Interesting though, when I look at the site for the Marriot St. Louis Union Station, they make the claim that they have a casino on site. This must be a mistake as in Missouri all casino's must be connected to a body of river water.



Qouted from site:

Hotel Details

6 floors, 528 rooms, 11 suites

27 meeting rooms, 35,000 sq ft of total meeting space

1 concierge level

Casino on-site



I doubt this unless the old Chouteau lake qaulifies to make the the water connection.



Have to admit, Union Station would make a great casino. Can't believe no one has not made this suggestion before.

lamiaposta wrote:

what4 wrote:Either Marriott is opening a new hotel in Union Station or they just bought it from Hyatt....



https://www.marriott.com/hotels/fact-sh ... -marriott/

Where have you been. This is old news as this was announced several months back and anticiapated a year ago. ....

jeez... excuse me for not keeping up with every latest tidbit of development info in STL. i'll be sure to run my next post by you before i post again.

Random Thought:



The layout of Union Station makes it very difficult to restructure the few remaining tenants and mothball the remaining space. There are two anchors to Union Station, the Marriott at one end, and the Hard Rock at the other, but there isn't much left in between.



I'm sure there is some sort of agreement between Marriott and Union Station's owners to maintain enclosed access between the hotel and the parking lot and restaurants, but that is becoming increasingly difficult to justify. At some point - perhaps very soon - keeping that access open will not be financially viable. It costs quite a bit to secure, maintain, and heat/cool the enclosed mall space, and it obviously isn't generating much revenue. They can't move the remaining tenants to one end or the other without damaging one of the anchors, and they can't close off the upper levels without it being obvious, and depressing for both patrons and tenants.



So, how can they keep both Marriott and Hard Rock happy and viable until a redevelopment plan emerges? I'm sure most of the revenue US is generating at this point is from parking, and Hard Rock and Landry's may be viable as long as that parking lot is fairly full, but that obviously isn't enough to justify keeping the enclosed portion of the mall open, and that traffic will be really limited when the Blues' season is over.



The only option, short of shutting the whole thing down, for the near to mid term may be to get Hard Rock and the other remaining tenants to move into or near the Headhouse, around the Marriott, demolish the rest of the retail space in the mall, and put in surface parking under the train shed. That would be relatively expensive though, and would be difficult to justify unless they were fairly certain a redevelopment plan will emerge in the next few years.

Ciocolta - I am sure I spelled that wrong. But the nice chocolate store from US has a store front now on Olive next to the bridal store. When are they opening? Anyone know anything.

And what the heck is left at Union Station now the Senior Julio and CiCi have moved on?

I walked by yesterday and they were already open.

shut it down, gut it and totally redo it. include condos above the stores, oh and, bullet trains to chicago. sounds great!

The latest casualty being the Flag Shop (having been in Union Station as long as I can remember) and correct me if I am wrong the sign shop they also owned has clsoed. Many malls are having problems and many stores are closing, but the problems with Union Station started long before the recent economic downturn we are experiencing now. But now the management at Union Station has found their scape goat for their past blunders and poor management decisions. Like I said "I suspect more stores will close in St. Louis Union Station" leaving only a handful of merchants who do not know it is time to leave. When this plays out you will only have left what I consider the less than respectable type of merchants for the less than desirable customers. If it wasn't for the Marriott coming in, Union Station IMHO would be in dire straights. I feel sorry for the Marriott.

Body Shop at St Louis Union Station to close Jan 28, 2009. Definitely not a surprise and predictable as stores at Union Station continue to leave one by one leaving a handful of (imo) unrecognizable junk and ghetto merchants remaining. Last month Walking Billboards closed leaving now only one t shirt shop remaining from the over proliferation of these type of shops. Certainly it is any bodies guess as who will close next. I wonder if Ceci will be next pulling out her remaining two stores after already closing one of the three stores in St louis Union Station and opening a new store downtown on Washington street. Some may say this is just a result of the economy, but the exodus from Union Station started before the economic down turn.

Another business closes at St Louis Union Station. Over the weekend the Shed Restaruant shuttered its doors. I heard that the employees recieved no advance notice and were notified at the end of the evening they no longer had jobs. The closings at Union Station is like a runaway train.



As for the Marriot, blueprints recently revealed that they are going to take over the East West leg of the mall west from the grand staircase entrance to 20th street and make this area part of the hotel and their new lobby. The plans show the lobby entrance and front desk will still be on Market, but will be moved west to the entrance nearest 20th street. The Grand Hall still accesible will be devoted to functions and will not be interrupted by guest checking in. This addition will increase the number of meeting space areas as they are trying to develop this as their midwest headquarters and meeting center. So one would have to believe that the stores currently in that area will be getting the boot soon to other areas in the mall. If the merchnats decide to stay. Sounds like the Marriott has decided to take charge of their own destiny.