urbanSTL

1 restaurant closes, another cuts hours downtown over crime worries. sparse business
https://www.ksdk.com/article/money/business/downtown-st-louis-businesses-leave-scale-back-operations/63-5c063cd2-8ec8-448b-84f8-e323cddc5535

I don’t know of any restaurant like Rated that has lunch service

^Sad to hear about Rated Test Kitchen. The chef seems like a top notch guy. Food is very good and different so encourage those who can afford a fine dining night out to try it.

I kind of wonder about how much the Simply Delicious comments may be embellished. I suppose it wouldn’t surprise me if an unhoused person did walk in at one point (something that I have witnessed a few times in my travels increasingly in the recent past, not only in StL), as I do think our unhoused community has become generally more, well “emboldened” over the last several years in the US with panhandling. Not sure the word. It’s a controversial topic, and we should be housing individuals, but it may be worth a discussion about how to address shelters and public housing in and around downtown. We certainly don’t have more unhoused than other downtowns, but the ratios of people admittedly aren’t great. The roving encampment of individuals plagues us of course. The google maps street view on Market St at City Hall probably could not be worse for us - check it out you’ll see.

Here’s what I will say as a zealous downtown advocate outside of this forum but can be honest here - downtown is deader than a doorknob way too often. There’s no sugarcoating it - the everyday foot traffic is abysmal. There are some small business owners really trying, but it makes me really sad when I’m the only one in Jovick Brothers, Cobblestone Market, Amaizing Arepa, Park Ave, and Billy’s (a real sad loss imo). The bars like Thaxton, Trust, and Oyster Bar are neat places yet not near as busy as you’d think they’d be. Jack Patrick’s and Hayden’s about half forgotten about at this point I think.

DB has provided data that downtown sales have almost recovered to pre Covid levels and are holding serve at worst. I think that’s probably a good representation. I don’t think it’s getting worse, but we are have definitely not recovered to pre Covid like many downtowns and our downtown 2019 was already pretty low traffic.

I just want “buy in” from the community. We can bring this thing back but we need everyone to take ownership and believe that downtown is each of our responsibilities to support. Right now, I think business and patrons take the “pass the buck” road or even a totally negative road too often.

It needs infrastructure improvements and connectivity to the rest of our city - but without an attitude change, I’m not sure how far even that will take us.

Rants for the day are over

How many posts will it take for us to remember Downtown has very little foot traffic and feels empty a lot of the time? It seems like infinity, but I look forward to being reminded tomorrow, the next day, and the day after that. 

Staffing restaurants downtown has got a to be a royal pain in the ass. You have to have decent capacity to be able to fully serve the booms of traffic surrounding games, concerts, and conventions. Meanwhile you have to have the ability to scale staff down in between because downtown will be fairly dead.

The best opportunity for the restaurant spaces downtown IMO is for existing restaurant groups that already have more stable locations outside of downtown. You could pull employees from other locations during boom times, and keep cash flow consistent during bust times.

There are some great deals on spaces in Downtown, we really just need more buy in from the local restaurant groups besides Sugarfire/Hi-Pionte. I'm talking the usual suspects: Mission Taco, Napoli, Niche, Steve's Hotdogs, Narwhals, and 4Hands.

Would like Dave Bailey to open something else back up but I suspect he's given up on downtown. Bridge hasn't has a valid liquor license for like six months

I live 3 blocks from rated and I had forgot  it was open for anything other than a reservation only planned course meal for dinner.  I do vaguely remember them saying they will have lunch

Simply Delicious was simply over priced. $22-25 for a basic breakfast plate that it’s $9-14 at Chris’ or ukraft, which had to triple its space due to demand. And since it’s moved it’s doing same numbers that a chain like First Watch does on any given day.  Go there for lunch today and see.

delmar2debaliviere2downtown wrote: ↑

Jan 31, 2025

^Sad to hear about Rated Test Kitchen. The chef seems like a top notch guy. Food is very good and different so encourage those who can afford a fine dining night out to try it.

I kind of wonder about how much the Simply Delicious comments may be embellished. I suppose it wouldn’t surprise me if an unhoused person did walk in at one point (something that I have witnessed a few times in my travels increasingly in the recent past, not only in StL), as I do think our unhoused community has become generally more, well “emboldened” over the last several years in the US with panhandling. Not sure the word. It’s a controversial topic, and we should be housing individuals, but it may be worth a discussion about how to address shelters and public housing in and around downtown. We certainly don’t have more unhoused than other downtowns, but the ratios of people admittedly aren’t great. The roving encampment of individuals plagues us of course. The google maps street view on Market St at City Hall probably could not be worse for us - check it out you’ll see.

Here’s what I will say as a zealous downtown advocate outside of this forum but can be honest here - downtown is deader than a doorknob way too often. There’s no sugarcoating it - the everyday foot traffic is abysmal. There are some small business owners really trying, but it makes me really sad when I’m the only one in Jovick Brothers, Cobblestone Market, Amaizing Arepa, Park Ave, and Billy’s (a real sad loss imo). The bars like Thaxton, Trust, and Oyster Bar are neat places yet not near as busy as you’d think they’d be. Jack Patrick’s and Hayden’s about half forgotten about at this point I think.

DB has provided data that downtown sales have almost recovered to pre Covid levels and are holding serve at worst. I think that’s probably a good representation. I don’t think it’s getting worse, but we are have definitely not recovered to pre Covid like many downtowns and our downtown 2019 was already pretty low traffic.

I just want “buy in” from the community. We can bring this thing back but we need everyone to take ownership and believe that downtown is each of our responsibilities to support. Right now, I think business and patrons take the “pass the buck” road or even a totally negative road too often.

It needs infrastructure improvements and connectivity to the rest of our city - but without an attitude change, I’m not sure how far even that will take us.

Rants for the day are over

Simply Delicious failed because it simply was not. I went there once, and while everyone was nice enough...the product just sucked. It was not good. The espresso wasn't pulled right and tasted awful. And the food I had was mid and was akin to the pre-packaged plastic wrapped stuff at Starbucks. 

No. Crime was not their problem. Lack of public interest, public awareness and uninspired fare did them in. Their whole narrative is a convenient cop-out. They just don't want to own the knowledge that their concept failed. Pure and simple. 

pattimagee wrote: ↑

Jan 28, 2025

dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑

Jan 27, 2025

I think having the place packed with people on their laptops for hours on end but just spending $4.5 may camouflage and also contribute to the issue

I chatted with my local barista and he said they were also very surprised and that he heard "the owner" really wanted out for some personal reason... not really sure if that's truth or a game of telephone. 

I don't have any inside knowledge, but the owners of Quarrelsome also own a very successful yeast company (Omega Yeast) that I believe also has an office  in that building (production is in Chicago).  I know that's also why they did some experimenting with fermentation and coffee.  It's possible they are closing the coffee shop because either the fermentation coffee didn't take off or they simply want to focus on the existing, successful, business.  When I heard they were closing, that was where my mind went, not anything to do with foot traffic or other reasoning.  But who knows...

TheWayoftheArch_V2.0 wrote: ↑

Feb 03, 2025

Blondies on Wash Ave has announced its closure. 

I never made it there.   Tried to go for brunch once, and it was a long wait.  This was some time back.

^Many times a wait on the weekend, especially if there was an event. Pretty nice space and patio. The type of place that made downtown feel a little livelier with an inviting entrance, outdoor dining and decent foot traffic. Surprised they weren’t able to keep going. I’d expect a new concept to try the spot, though Wash Ave moves slower than I’d like in filling empty retail.

^ Sounds like US Bank's move out of the building was a bit of a last straw for the owners. They didn't make money last year and with the move, 2025 didn't look promising.

Blondies closed because they were renting from Cushman & Wakefield and more than likely, they went up on the rent.  With the move of US Bank, they are going to be loosing a lot of revenue and those two things don't add up.  Blame Cushman for this, US Bank left because of the huge issues with building. The sewer was backing up into the building and it took months for them fix it. They couldn't have their workers there due to the smell. Elevators constantly broken, doors constantly broken to were people couldn't get into the building.  Parking situation is horrible, and many other things.  There is a huge void of restaurants on Wash Ave for people to visit and it shouldn't be that way. 

^I agree with many of your points. But I have to ask - is there really not enough parking? I mean there are unfortunately just swaths and swaths of surface parking. Did the building not control any of these spots for tenants?

And if that is the case, you would think some of these property owners would want to build structured parking with residential space above, creating more spaces. At least that’s what I’d like to see in places like behind Wash Ave, Grand Center and Delmar Loop. Large surface lots in those places close to attractions where you could build large garages and some residential stories in too that I think would be marketable.

There is not enough with the mixture of residential.  There were times when many employees couldn't find parking close enough and had to park blocks away and walk.  No one would ever build a parking garage around there.

Mom’s Deli closing its doors in a couple weeks.

https://www.firstalert4.com/2025/02/05/ ... hut-doors/

whitherSTL wrote: ↑

Feb 05, 2025

Mom’s Deli closing its doors in a couple weeks.

https://www.firstalert4.com/2025/02/05/ ... hut-doors/

Moving not closing. Headline a bit misleading

jshank83 wrote: ↑

Feb 05, 2025

whitherSTL wrote: ↑

Feb 05, 2025

Mom’s Deli closing its doors in a couple weeks.




https://www.firstalert4.com/2025/02/05/ ... hut-doors/

Moving not closing. Headline a bit misleading

And they can’t even spell Jamieson correctly.

Mom's Deli is a Southside institution, hopefully they will find somewhere incredibly close by.

Hearing that Mom's Deli closure is a family dispute over building ownership. Looking for locations in south city to re-open.

Has nothing to do with lack of business, money losses, etc. The family owns the building but it's split ownership, causing a dispute.

I figured that must be it, as it beggared belief that they did not own that building.

Maybe Mom’s could take over the shuttered El Maguey spot on Chippewa?

DogtownBnR wrote:Maybe Mom’s could take over the shuttered El Maguey spot on Chippewa?

Thought the exact same thing.


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