urbanSTL

This is great, but WHY CANT THEY EVER BUILD THESE PROJECTS WITH ACTUAL STREET GRIDS? That picture shows pedestrian walkways. Really. Why do they have to close things off like this? The loop is successful. The 14th street mall was not.

Jeff, Your negative rheteric on almost every thread you post on here gets really old. You tend to be awfully anti-everything and pessimistic. Come on already.



http://www.urbanstl.com/search.php?sear ... +Vanderlou



As for me... I could care less if they get TIFF, more gaming laws from MO, cash under the table, or a good lap dance... to build.

Pinnacle also will work to convince people that downtown St. Louis is a safe environment to live in or visit. Lee said the casino complex will have strong security.



"I can make 20 acres secure. I can't make a whole city secure," he said.

This does bother me. Last night (Friday 11/17) Downtown, Midtown and the Central West End were packed with people everywhere. Downtown had 30 -45 minute waits in every restaurant we went to. Enjoyed the Symphony at Powell and then we waited over an hour to get a cocktail in midtown. The West End for coffee later (after midnight) was crowded as well. So, I think people have already discovered that downtown is safe. I don't think Pinnacle or Lee need to be downtown's patrol. The Admiral casino keeps visitors pretty safe down there already and hasn't had a terrible time keeping business, nor does the Landing. The restaurants and bars/clubs down there seem to be busier than ever these days IMO.

I have seen a LOT of county friends increasingly come to CWE and DT for HH, watching college games (Flannery's is awesome. There every Sat. ), etc.



Another trend that was pointed out, regarding our cultural center (Fox, Symphony, creepy crawl (heh heh)) is SO TRUE. Spamalot has been successful, as do most of the Broadway series. Most of the people that I talked to were Fox season ticket holders like me and MANY were not from the city. The symphony hall has been attracting some excellent performers too.



STL and specifically DT are indeed back. I don't think CWE was ever that depressed as DT had become. All in all, good news for OUR region.......

I actually disagree. I wouldn't call the St. Louis government or the Missouri legislature "patsie's" when it comes to handing out subsidies. They're actually far stingier than virtually ever other major metro area - they were one of the only governments in the country to turn down huge subsidies for the new stadium ... they drove a really hard bargain with the BPV. If anything I wish they were MORE generous.

I think this may be the unfortunate result of being on the edge of the state instead of the center and not the state capital. Indianapolis, by contrast, is the focus of the entire state of Indiana. Oklahoma City in Oklahoma, etc. In Missouri, the legislators routinely overturn votes of the people if the deciding votes came from KC and St. Louis. In the concealed gun debate, they acted like the vote didn't count since the rural counties voted for it -- so they quickly overturned the vote. The same will happen with the stem cell vote.



As long as Jefferson City sees itself as the government of the rural center of the state, and not the edge urban areas of the state, St. Louis cannot expect the kind of state support received by other large cities.



Of course, if the urban legislators of St. Louis and KC got together, they could outvote the rural areas. But legislators from the St. Louis suburbs often vote as if they are rural -- against the urban core. And by grouping the legislators in rural Jeff City away from urban neighbors, we make it very easy for local lobbyists to wine and dine them into thinking the important issues are bigger trucks, more guns, cheap cigarrettes.

Very good analysis Gary.



People tend to say that "nearly all" counties in MO were red, which means we are a republican state (BTW, I normally vote Rep ). This is like saying that "people" do not matter, but land does.



Jeff city officials are mostly influenced by rural counties NOT because they have their best interests in mind, but because they are the true "swing" in votes. The Urban cores are highly educated in the domain of politics(sorry for the generalization), while the Rural domain is highly educated in the day to day survival. Jeff city officials know that they cannot easily change the mind of the political savvy population in urban centers, but by "promoting" some of the ideas of Rural counties (like cheap necessities and some cheap non essentials aka cigs), they tend to make them believe that MO is all about them.



Equality is the best way to resolve the current polarization. Unfortunately, politics is all about divisiveness. This is why we are where we are.

Gary Kreie wrote:I think this may be the unfortunate result of being on the edge of the state instead of the center and not the state capital. Indianapolis, by contrast, is the focus of the entire state of Indiana. Oklahoma City in Oklahoma, etc. In Missouri, the legislators routinely overturn votes of the people if the deciding votes came from KC and St. Louis. In the concealed gun debate, they acted like the vote didn't count since the rural counties voted for it -- so they quickly overturned the vote. The same will happen with the stem cell vote.

That is a good analysis. I hope you're wrong about the last statement, but I fear that you'll be right.



St. Louis and Kansas City do have more of an uphill battle thanks to the urban/rural divide. Despite significant increases in population, outlying areas like St. Charles and Jefferson counties still have more in common politically with their neighboring rural counties. And the petty bickering between St. Louis and Kansas City interests effectively stifles the possibility of forming a true urban agenda from which both of Missouri's major cities could benefit.

ThreeOneFour wrote:And the petty bickering between St. Louis and Kansas City interests effectively stifles the possibility of forming a true urban agenda from which both of Missouri's major cities could benefit.

Definitely.

Buffalo Bills

Does anyone know if they plan on opening both the Casino and the hotel at the same time? Or will just the casino be open first?

I doubt they will open the hotel without the Casino. Casino will bring in BIG money as well as crowds.....

Atlanta

Phoenix

Twin Cities

Denver

Indianapolis

in addition ... not sure if you realized these are all state capitals too.



Indy "thriving"... ? not too sure. I was just there yesterday. It reminds me of a small city with poor infra-structure. Nice, yes - "thriving" not really.

Matthew/E36 wrote:

ThreeOneFour wrote:And the petty bickering between St. Louis and Kansas City interests effectively stifles the possibility of forming a true urban agenda from which both of Missouri's major cities could benefit.

Definitely.

Can you expand upon this? I was not aware there was an issue here (unless it is for state tax $$)

TheWayoftheArch wrote:Savannah is the capital of Georgia.

No, it's actually Atlanta.

DeBaliviere wrote:

TheWayoftheArch wrote:Savannah is the capital of Georgia.

No, it's actually Atlanta.

(If I remember right) if you drive north on the road from Turner Field you'll run right into the State Capital building.

dweebe wrote:

DeBaliviere wrote:

TheWayoftheArch wrote:Savannah is the capital of Georgia.

No, it's actually Atlanta.

(If I remember right) if you drive north on the road from Turner Field you'll run right into the State Capital building.

That's how I remember it too.

<b>State capitals of Georgia</b>, in order



Savannah

Augusta

Louisville

Milledgeville

Atlanta

publiceye wrote:<b>State capitals of Georgia</b>, in order



Savannah

Augusta

Louisville

Milledgeville

Atlanta

Here's some history: http://www.cviog.uga.edu/Projects/gainfo/capital.htm