innov8ion wrote:^ You're setting up a straw man argument. No one's interested in playing your game. We should focus on improving welfare for the homeless. That website seems to do a pretty good job exposing the various problems about Larry Rice's NLEC.
I didn't bring up personal attacks on Larry Rice in order to "improve welfare for the homeless".
Check out Wed Jan 14, 2009 11:11 pm. We have a three-fer: hanging with low-lifes, child molesters, and preparing for divorce #2. All based on speculation.
Not so much a strawman, as the presumed author of the site made the accusations.
Just providing my ongoing opinion to point out why this anti-Rice movement gains no traction; it simply does not understand how making baseless attacks against an individual doesn't win many supporters or help the homeless at all.
innov8ion wrote:^ You're setting up a straw man argument. No one's interested in playing your game. We should focus on improving welfare for the homeless. That website seems to do a pretty good job exposing the various problems about Larry Rice's NLEC.
I didn't bring up personal attacks on Larry Rice in order to "improve welfare for the homeless".
Check out Wed Jan 14, 2009 11:11 pm. We have a three-fer: hanging with low-lifes, child molesters, and preparing for divorce #2. All based on speculation.
Not so much a strawman, as the presumed author of the site made the accusations.
Huh? You keep distorting the truth. That website says nothing of the sort. You keep trying to reframe the central argument with some fringe viewpoints. That's simply misleading and you should be ashamed of yourself.
bprop wrote:Just providing my ongoing opinion to point out why this anti-Rice movement gains no traction; it simply does not understand how making baseless attacks against an individual doesn't win many supporters or help the homeless at all.
We all know that you condone Larry Rice and the methods in which he mistreats the homeless. Considering that the links are substantiated by many news outlets and other evidence, I don't see how they can be considered baseless. For your reference, the link is here: http://larryricetruth.com/links
I never said the "truth" site said those things. gopher wrote the comments indicating Larry Rice was a wife abuser, hung out with pedophiles, etc. on urbanstl. I assume gopher is also the author of the "truth" (ahem) site. If not, then my sincere apologies for the error in attribution.
We all know that you condone Larry Rice and the methods in which he mistreats the homeless.
I've made my opinions quite clear, and they don't condone mistreatment of the homeless or even certain methods employed by NLEC. It has more to do with using personal attacks against Rice as an ineffective springboard toward other ends. I'll keep saying it and it will keep coming true; if you can't separate personal attacks from the truth and positive efforts at change, the "movement" won't get anywhere.
bprop wrote:I never said the "truth" site said those things. gopher wrote the comments indicating Larry Rice was a wife abuser, hung out with pedophiles, etc. on urbanstl.
Larry Rice might not literally "hang out" with convicted sex offenders, but he does house them.
Do you see anything wrong with this picture?
The park and library for the children were here first.
bprop wrote:I never said the "truth" site said those things. gopher wrote the comments indicating Larry Rice was a wife abuser, hung out with pedophiles, etc. on urbanstl. I assume gopher is also the author of the "truth" (ahem) site. If not, then my sincere apologies for the error in attribution.
He wrote that at least three months ago or so. Why the need to bring up old news? With that said and as you suggest, this information has little to do with some of NLEC's methods that negatively affect the homeless. I agree that we should focus on the latter rather than the former.
bprop wrote:I've made my opinions quite clear, and they don't condone mistreatment of the homeless or even certain methods employed by NLEC. It has more to do with using personal attacks against Rice as an ineffective springboard toward other ends. I'll keep saying it and it will keep coming true; if you can't separate personal attacks from the truth and positive efforts at change, the "movement" won't get anywhere.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm not attacking Larry Rice personally. Although as head of the NLEC, he is ultimately responsible for its poor track record. For a better understanding of this record, check the website: http://larryricetruth.com
Revoke his non-profit status and he legally can't get the building and would be forced to report his income and that of his "organization" and actually PAY taxes on it. Not to mention his donations wouldn't be "tax-deductible"...
As a Southeast Missouri State alum and former Cape Girardeau resident, I am deeply concerned about Larry Rice's efforts to acquire the former federal courthouse. Cape Girardeau has made significant strides in bringing its historic downtown back to life, including the conversion of the former Marquette Hotel just across the street from the former courthouse into offices, restaurants, and retail, and the former St. Vincent's Seminary into the SEMO River Campus and a performing arts center.
Just as it would have been with the Abrams Building in our downtown, granting Rice the rights to this former federal courthouse would be a giant setback for the revitalization of downtown Cape Girardeau. Furthermore, Cape Girardeau County is interested in the space for offices to replace those in the Common Pleas Courthouse, a historic building that overlooks the Mississippi River and is home to county offices after serving as Cape Girardeau's city hall until the late 1970s.
If Rev. Rice is speaking of southeast Missouri as a whole, I can see where there would be a need for more homeless services. I must say, however, that I'm unaware of any significant number of homeless people in Cape Girardeau. The city has about 40,000 residents, while the county has 75,000. Maybe there are 2,000 homeless people in the immediate area, but I never noticed that it was much of a problem.
I hope Cape Girardeau residents, businesses, and elected officials fight this proposal tooth and nail. Renovation of the Marquette Hotel, and improvements to the nearby Southeast Missourian Building were signs that the revitalization that's taken place in the blocks along the river was beginning to spread westward along Broadway toward the main SEMO campus. I'm afraid Rev. Rice's plan would bring that momentum to a halt, and based on what we've seen here in St. Louis, I think it may even do homeless people more harm than good in the long run.
gopher wrote:Revoke his non-profit status and he legally can't get the building and would be forced to report his income and that of his "organization" and actually PAY taxes on it. Not to mention his donations wouldn't be "tax-deductible"...
"Rice said, he is willing to change where he puts his programs. But it must be on the same terms as the federal building -- he must be given the keys at no cost."
So give him a free building or he'll take the one downtown... how about just saying "No". This is total abuse of the law's intent to further Rice's ego at the expense of yet another community.
I'm fully supportive of an audit of any non-profit agency. But the "inappropriate" transfer of buildings sounds like it's far more a problem with the system:
Federal agencies that review the applications "basically rubberstamp" New Life Evangelistic Center requests, Bond wrote.
Rice doesn't sound too scared of an audit though:
Rice, in response to both Bond and McCaskill, said he welcomes any scrutiny that federal agencies care to give his programs.
Is there any evidence that an audit would result in revocation of non-profit status? Doesn't sound like it.
But Rice was referring to his programs not his finances. As a "church" and "non-profit" he falls under the Separation of Church and State Clause, up to a point...
