Nice pics Zezus. When the landscaping & trees mature, these streets will look even better. Especially if they resolve the barrier issue. Besides, the barrier issue is a citywide problem, not just GS. This far west in the city, setbacks are standard in residential areas, so I think it is appropriate. Within a block or two of Grand, I would like to see less setback to give it more of a downtown/urban feel.
I'm very pleased that someone might be developing the odd triangular-shaped lot at Olive & Boyle. I noticed a sign today from BK Development that simply read "Coming Soon - New Construction Homes". I wonder how many homes they can squeeze into this lot...
Here's a link to the developer's website:
http://www.brown-kortkamp.com/BK_Develo ... 24428.html
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Here's a link to the developer's website:
http://www.brown-kortkamp.com/BK_Develo ... 24428.html
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It is easy to criticize certain aspects of this project. But taken as a whole, Gaslight Square is by far the best residential redevelopment currently being done outside of downtown. Other than its lack of retail, the density, diversity and quality of construction make this one a winner. I especially like how the builders are filling in all vacant lots over a wide area (even 6 new town homes next to Metro High!) Contrasting Gaslight Square to McCormick Barron's Westminster Place that it encompasses shows how far we have come in the last few years. This is why it is so important to hold companies like Pyramid and Eagle along with their political bed mates to a higher standard.
GLS continues to pick up steam! Good news form Van Der Werf:
"For folks who frequent the Gaslight Square area, the Dove on Boyle Avenue has been a mystery for years. Inside is a well-kept dark wooden bar and tables and chairs. But, for the last three years or so, it has opened sporadically, only to close again.
That is likely to change. William Roth, who spent $1 million rehabbing a neighboring building into offices for his advertising agency, the Eleven, has bought the building.
He plans to rehab it, and try to bring in a restaurant. "I would really like to see it keep the Gaslight jazz and blues scene alive," said Roth."
Link
"For folks who frequent the Gaslight Square area, the Dove on Boyle Avenue has been a mystery for years. Inside is a well-kept dark wooden bar and tables and chairs. But, for the last three years or so, it has opened sporadically, only to close again.
That is likely to change. William Roth, who spent $1 million rehabbing a neighboring building into offices for his advertising agency, the Eleven, has bought the building.
He plans to rehab it, and try to bring in a restaurant. "I would really like to see it keep the Gaslight jazz and blues scene alive," said Roth."
Link
Hmmm....the old GSL was a world reknown entertainment district...crowded and noisey. I wonder if after this project is in operation, if it's a big enough success to serve as a catalyst to draw in more such venues...how will that affect the neighborhood?
I really wish initially this was the kind of development introduced to bring this area back, instead of much bulldozing and new residential construction. But since redevelopment has occured, I only wish for the neighborhood to be successful in terms of those who have bought homes here. At this point, however, I think the two can co-exist. But who am I? I don't live in GLS. Maybe Zezuz or some other resident can give some insight.
I really wish initially this was the kind of development introduced to bring this area back, instead of much bulldozing and new residential construction. But since redevelopment has occured, I only wish for the neighborhood to be successful in terms of those who have bought homes here. At this point, however, I think the two can co-exist. But who am I? I don't live in GLS. Maybe Zezuz or some other resident can give some insight.
Well, apparently the two halves of this development (East and West of the infamous barriers) can't even co-exist, so I doubt that a live-music venue would be welcomed. But I don't live in Gaslight Square, so what do I know?
new-to-STL wrote: I'm glad that I did though, because I stumbled upon this little gem! It's actually a block south of the main new Gaslight Square development, on McPherson, settled in between original homes. There are a few other new infill houses on the block, but none like this!
I hope the other houses don't make fun of this one. It really is totally out of place. Like that Miami Vice house on Lindell across from Forest Park.
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What if the floor heights were raised to that of the older buildings <scale>
And different materials were used like pinkish limestone or soft concrete with special types of glass <green> and wooden or shiny metal beams?
We need a new post post modern type of architecture called 21Retromodern
And different materials were used like pinkish limestone or soft concrete with special types of glass <green> and wooden or shiny metal beams?
We need a new post post modern type of architecture called 21Retromodern
I've just finished reading this thread and I'd like to share a few thoughts. First off, I'm embarrased to say I lived in St. Louis for eight years and I didn't even know what GLS was. And I probably still wouldn't know except for this site (I'm addicted to it now that I'm buying an apartment in the CWE).
When I was in St. Louis last (for school) I avoided GLS like the plague because of those barriers. I had to make a U-Turn once and I never wanted to make that mistake again. From that point on I took Lindell or Delmar. Now that might be exactly what the residents want, no thru traffic. But if the neighborhood wants to support any businesses, you can't expect a business to thrive only on the immediate population. The flipside to this is that certain business owners on Lindell probably LOVE those barriers because it forces people to drive by their stores on Lindell.
I guess if the area wants to stay completely residential, I can see the benefits of having those barriers. They serve a purpose, they keep people like me out of the neighborhood so kids can play hockey or football on the street. On the other hand they also keep my money out the neighborhood. If you're not friendly to outsiders, don't expect them to support businesses on your street. I mean, what a pain in the ass it is to drive when you don't know if you're going to have to make a U-Turn every other block. But, keeping things in perspective, I'm not so sure that a barrier alone can divide a neighborhood. It's usually things like wealth and race that divide neighborhoods. And if you're too lazy to go to your neighbor's house down the block because you can't drive there, maybe we should invite Richard Simmons onto the site for motivational pep talks, cause that just sounded silly.
When I was in St. Louis last (for school) I avoided GLS like the plague because of those barriers. I had to make a U-Turn once and I never wanted to make that mistake again. From that point on I took Lindell or Delmar. Now that might be exactly what the residents want, no thru traffic. But if the neighborhood wants to support any businesses, you can't expect a business to thrive only on the immediate population. The flipside to this is that certain business owners on Lindell probably LOVE those barriers because it forces people to drive by their stores on Lindell.
I guess if the area wants to stay completely residential, I can see the benefits of having those barriers. They serve a purpose, they keep people like me out of the neighborhood so kids can play hockey or football on the street. On the other hand they also keep my money out the neighborhood. If you're not friendly to outsiders, don't expect them to support businesses on your street. I mean, what a pain in the ass it is to drive when you don't know if you're going to have to make a U-Turn every other block. But, keeping things in perspective, I'm not so sure that a barrier alone can divide a neighborhood. It's usually things like wealth and race that divide neighborhoods. And if you're too lazy to go to your neighbor's house down the block because you can't drive there, maybe we should invite Richard Simmons onto the site for motivational pep talks, cause that just sounded silly.
Marmar wrote:I wonder if after this project is in operation, if it's a big enough success to serve as a catalyst to draw in more such venues...how will that affect the neighborhood?
I think several venues would be great for the surrounding neighborhood. I would really like to see the added foot traffic on the sidewalks at night. There are several empty lots facing Boyle between the Dove Cafe and GS that seem ideal for retail/venues/condos.
Marmar wrote:At this point, however, I think the two can co-exist. But who am I? I don't live in GLS. Maybe Zezuz or some other resident can give some insight.
Just a guess, but I bet most residents wouldn't be excited about any loud businesses at Olive/Whittier. Maybe Olive/Boyle or Olive/Sarah would be a better location for a venue? But I do agree - I think retail and residential can and should coexist in the neighborhood. I only hope the remaining proposed condo buildings at Olive/Whittier and Olive/Boyle have first floor retail. I still haven't seen any renderings...
^Thanks for the input, Zezuz. I agree completely. Although my main concern is for the residents, the idea of increased foot traffic is an excellent point and can be achieved with more retail. Although the new infill is quite nice, I feel this area's future projects needs to be a tad more urban with emphasis on modern architecture as opposed to infill type, IMHO.
Does anyone have any updates on the status of the barriers? Last I heard (2+ months ago) we were waiting for the alderman to organize a meeting for us with city reps from the street department to discuss alternatives to barriers. I'm starting to get anxious b/c I've heard that "beautifying" the barriers is on the agenda for the next resident meeting.
I read in Steve Patterson's blog today that eastbound Olive is now open (temporarily?) at Walton. Who is responsible for achieving this? Can they help us get the barriers removed from GS?
I read in Steve Patterson's blog today that eastbound Olive is now open (temporarily?) at Walton. Who is responsible for achieving this? Can they help us get the barriers removed from GS?
Zezuz wrote: eastbound Olive is now open (temporarily?) at Walton.
Is this near Bowood Farms Nursery? I visited them shortly after they openned, and they seemed really isolated by some nearby barriers. Maybe they had something to do with it?
Zezuz, all i know is that we were promised at a meeting in early may that the street department and the city were working up a plan that would make sense for the entire neighborhood, not just the residents in 4200 Olive. we were told it would take about two weeks. to date, the alderman has been unresponsive to emails and phone calls. he certainly doesnt get my re-election vote!
i would hope the residents of 4200 block would be more inclusive of their neighbors down the street in efforts to "beautify" the neighborhood. seems all the talk of wanting to be inclusive was a bunch of hot air.
i would hope the residents of 4200 block would be more inclusive of their neighbors down the street in efforts to "beautify" the neighborhood. seems all the talk of wanting to be inclusive was a bunch of hot air.
Thanks for the update. I'll send a follow-up e-mail and let you know if I hear anything. If not, what other action we can take?stp1975 wrote:Zezuz, all i know is that we were promised at a meeting in early may that the street department and the city were working up a plan that would make sense for the entire neighborhood, not just the residents in 4200 Olive. we were told it would take about two weeks. to date, the alderman has been unresponsive to emails and phone calls. he certainly doesnt get my re-election vote!
ive been in contact with the mayors office. they are looking into the issue and why the alderman isnt responding.
other than that, until the ordinance expires, our hands are tied.
other than that, until the ordinance expires, our hands are tied.
update on barriers - there is a meeting next week at city hall with the alderman, street department and several residents.
meeting with alderman went well. reps were there from mcpherson, boyle, washington, olive and westminster. everyone came up with a good plan which should be implemented soon. the best development is that the blockades at olive and whittier will be removed and a four way stop will be placed at olive and boyle.
shockingly, none of those that were vocally pro barrier cared to show up at the meeting.
shockingly, none of those that were vocally pro barrier cared to show up at the meeting.
Very good news! Unfortunately we were out of town and couldn't voice our support at the meeting. I don't see how a 4-way stop at Olive & Boyle will make any difference, but I'm very glad to hear the barriers are finally going to come down. Did the alderman say when the barriers will be removed?
Actually, I think a four-way stop at Olive and Boyle is much needed. The way Boyle curves right there makes it difficult to see oncoming traffic when heading West on Olive.
agreed - its hard to cross the street there when walking because of the curve and sometimes cars are going quite fast. i know not everyone will obey the stop sign, but i think it should help.
implementing the new plan will be a process of course as ordinances are required. id estimate 45-60 days from the end of this week?
implementing the new plan will be a process of course as ordinances are required. id estimate 45-60 days from the end of this week?
I got a couple of notes in my mailbox over the weekend, and want to make sure I understand what was discussed at the alderman meeting. If I understand correctly, the barriers will be removed at Olive & Whittier and McPherson & Whittier (next to Schnucks), but three new ones will be installed at Washington & Sarah, Olive & Sarah, and Westminster & Sarah?
that is essentially correct.
Barriers will be put up on the West side of the following intersections:
+ Olive @ Sarah, Westminster @ Sarah, Washington @ Sarah
Barriers will be removed from the following locations:
+ Olive @ Whittier, Whittier @McPherson
All streets will be two way with two exceptions:
+ Westminster between Boyle and Whittier - this will be one way east bound as it is currently
+ Whittier between Washington and Delmar - this will be one way northbound.
A FOUR WAY Stop will be put up at Olive and Boyle
***The 4200 block of McPherson is still unsure if they will locate their barricades on the east or west end of their block.
What this plan accomplishes:
+ keeps the majority of the traffic in the neighborhood as "local" traffic
+ eliminates Schnucks trucks from McPherson except in the block directly behind Schnucks.
+ creates Whittier as a major point of entry and exit from the neighborhood (at the traffic light on Lindell)
+ slows speeding traffic on Boyle
Barriers will be put up on the West side of the following intersections:
+ Olive @ Sarah, Westminster @ Sarah, Washington @ Sarah
Barriers will be removed from the following locations:
+ Olive @ Whittier, Whittier @McPherson
All streets will be two way with two exceptions:
+ Westminster between Boyle and Whittier - this will be one way east bound as it is currently
+ Whittier between Washington and Delmar - this will be one way northbound.
A FOUR WAY Stop will be put up at Olive and Boyle
***The 4200 block of McPherson is still unsure if they will locate their barricades on the east or west end of their block.
What this plan accomplishes:
+ keeps the majority of the traffic in the neighborhood as "local" traffic
+ eliminates Schnucks trucks from McPherson except in the block directly behind Schnucks.
+ creates Whittier as a major point of entry and exit from the neighborhood (at the traffic light on Lindell)
+ slows speeding traffic on Boyle