urbanSTL

I went to City Gourmet and got the opposite vibe. First, it was pretty crowded. The line to buy was as long as any other day. There are extra stations (and they're still not done building). One is for burritos, and another is for the mongolian stir-fry. I tried the stiry, and it worked fine and really hit the spot - RIP Hungry Buddha. They are still ironing out some issues; they can't make burritos because the tortilla warmer broke, for example. It will be back up by tomorrow. Not all the fixtures were in, and some of the bowls and utensils they ordered for the stir fry didn't come in yet. But I think it's just fine. All the familiar faces are working there as well.

Well, I sure hope that burritos will save the day. I remain unconvinced at this point. The place was fairly dead when I went in.



But I do WANT them to succeed. My first impression wasn't particularly heartening, but I could be wrong in the end.

Bronte16:



You eat / drink some of the strangest foods... but that's OK - just glad to hear Schnucks Culinaria is carrying your items too - if they are carrying those items in addition to "regular" items I am buying ... they are serving us well.

<consciousness>



I'm concerned about City Gourmet. Here's the issue: Culinaria seems to implement City Gourmet's strategy better than City Gourmet.



An integral CG strategy is to differentiate w/ their beer and wine selection? If Culinaria carries even approximately 75% of CG's selection, Culinaria will pull them in because they can also pick up incidentals. Wine? Culinaria has a better selection.



Culinaria is also heads and tails above CG when it comes to their Kaldi's coffee kiosk which includes gelato. CG needs to up their coffee game and could perhaps gain some steam with a fro-yo station where people can add their own toppings. That'd be fun, eh?



As far as food goes, Culinaria offers a great selection. If CG executes the burrito station and stir fry well, perhaps they could differentiate as Culinaria carries nothing similar to my knowledge (for now.) Why not utilize some of the BreadCo strategy w/ similar bakery items? Wouldn't some nice bagels w/ cream cheese and lox / smoked trout be nice?



The strategy is still not very tight. I don't understand why they are carrying grocery items that aren't what you'd buy to accompany your meal. Those items can be purchased at Culinaria and they take up valuable space that could be utilized to better fulfill their own strategy. Consider selling more gourmet items that accentuate their meal offerings (asian, mexican, etc.) and are near the respective station. I'd also like to be able to check out at each station as well...



Seating seems to be an afterthought. There's like 5 tables sequestered near the corner. There's a fair amount of seating upstairs, but I wouldn't want to have to schlep there unless absolutely necessary. The floor is pretty dingy. The ambience could use more character. Make it a special place. Learn from Starbucks... Do something.



Why is there no soda fountain? If they're selling food that people will eat inside, that may help. I bet the margins on fountain soda are higher than bottled soda. I spent $11 for a stir fry and a fitz's diet root beer. That's too much. They had chopsticks for the stir fry but there were no forks that I saw at the station.



I hope they can make a lot of improvements, because it doesn't seem too promising at the moment.

</consciousness>

^ There are utensils behind the checkouts, where the medicines used to be. It's my understanding that area will also have a soda fountain (something CG never had, I learned, just an ice machine) in the same area. The electrician was putting in wiring today.

Thanks for the tip, bprop. Hope they make the utensils accessible. People shouldn't have to ask for a plastic fork. Kudos on the soda fountain.

I don't know why many of you are upset with Schnucks coming into downtown and it hurting CG. You all know that the commercial space that Schnucks is in Dwtn is owned by Craig Heller who also owns CG. Schnucks signed a 10 yr lease on that space. Do you know how much money commercial space generates? Craig Heller is making so much money of that space regardless if CG is performing or not. Do you really think if he was concerned about CG he would of allowed Schnucks to open a store in his space across the street?

Two Things, First, Craig Heller does not own the Garage-ma-hal. Desco, the real estate arm of Schnucks has the long-term sweet ass lease on the garage (the state of Missouri actually owns the garage).

<sarcasm>

Secondly, Dave, I eagerly await the Grand Opening of Your PERFECT Business! You seem to have become the arbiter of business standards and practices.

</sarcasm>

STL63101 wrote:Secondly, Dave, I eagerly await the Grand Opening of Your PERFECT Business! You seem to have become the arbiter of business standards and practices.

</sarcasm>

Am I the arbiter? No, the final arbiter is the market. The market will determine if City Gourmet is focusing on the right strategies and how effectively they execute them. Are such discussions off limits?



Business strategy is an interest of mine and I'm not afraid to throw out thoughts and opinions. Maybe some analyses are right, some could use more refinement, or some could just be wrong. Perhaps instead of discrediting me with sarcasm, you could consider the points that have been raised and challenge their validity.



Ok, so what are City Gourmet's key strategies?



As I understand it:

1. Offer a greater beer and wine selection than Culinaria.

2. Sell prepared food and fast, gourmet fare

3. Others?



Analysis:

1. Concerning beer/liquor -- CG can either differentiate with quality (breadth of selection) or price. If the differentiation is not appreciable, customers will end up shopping at Culinaria because they can buy the rest of their groceries in the same location. I believe cost is the same. And I'm not sure that the selection of beer is appreciably different. Culinaria carries more wine...

2. Culinaria also sells prepared food and fast, gourmet fare. They have a Kaldi's kiosk that's like a mini Starbucks and also includes gelato. CG doesn't offer this service. How is CG differentiating? Not by price. What about quality? They only sell different kinds of food, with a focus on asian stir fry and burritos. Is that truly enough differentiation? Maybe, but the food needs to be spectacular. The stir fry was ok, but it wasn't great by any stretch of the imagination. Sen Thai is far better.



Additionally, the flow at City Gourmet is confusing and inconvenient for the customer. I waited a normal duration (10-15 minutes) for my food. In the meantime, I was thirsty. So what did I do? I ended up waiting until my food came out from the kiosk, took it and my drink to the register and paid for everything then. Wouldn't it make more sense for the customer to be able to issue their order and pay for any additional items they'd like at that time?



Baladas executes this well. They carry gourmet items that complement their foods (some neat sodas, this and that....) I give them my order, carry whatever else I wanna buy, and pay at that time. Then my food comes out. Makes sense, right?



City Gourmet needs volume to survive. And how many customers want to walk up a flight of stairs to eat? Honestly, the seating on the first floor is a bit scant.



They could make City Gourmet a special place; an anchor of the downtown community. In the parlance, a "third place" as described here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Third_Place. This is something that the Royale executes very well. How well does City Gourmet execute that strategy? As it stands, not well.



You run a successful business, Mike. I have a business degree and completed a variety of MBA coursework at WashU. Is what I'm saying coming from left-field? I don't think so, but the market will tell us in time... I wish them the best of luck and would love for them to succeed and find their niche.

I'm not arguing many of your points about CG. But I do want to point out that although it has some elements of a grocery store still, it's transitioned to more of a restaurant. Saying that it has to compete with Culinaria on various levels is like saying that Baladas or Maurizios or SanSai has to 'compete' with Culinaria. On the remaining grocery store elements, yes, but on the restaurant pieces, not as much. It might have a bit much space, or is awkwardly arranged, but unless Heller has tenants banging on the door to get in, it's not costing any opportunity cost in rent to use the place.



That said, of the remaining items, I talked with Craig today, who was walking around upstairs, busing tables, and soliciting suggestions. They're watching the ordering process and I totally agree that it needs to change. So does he, and they're going to improve signage and the process overall. If nothing else, they may give barcode stickers out like they used to to at the prepared foods counter, allowing you to pay while they cook the food.



They soda fountain was going in today. The burrito bar was running.



I counted from the mezzanine when I was about to leave: the burrito bar had two people ordering and eight in line. There were five getting their vegetables or waiting in line for the stir fry. There were two people ordering at the sandwich counter and four in line behind them. There was one ordering at the cold foods counter and two ordering on the far side by the prepared dishes (steak, fish - they have combo specials on that too). On top of that there were maybe 10 or 12 browsing the remaining groceries, beer, and wine and more at the registers.



Now, whether the lines were a testament to slow service or lots of demand, I don't know.

Matt Drops The H wrote:I think the crucifix hanging above the customer service desk at Culinaria is inappropriate, personally.

I agree, and we were both raised in the same religion as the person who put it up.



Just stopped in for a smoothie. Thumbs up.

Doug wrote:City Gourmet will be closed by the beginning of next year.

I said the same thing on the phone to my boyfriend today after leaving a very disappointing first lunch there today. I really hate to say it, but unless they really get it together soon, I don't see it surviving. Reasons/comments:



1.) They call it City Gourmet but I am really left wondering what was so "gourmet" about my lunch - a mediocre veggie hummus wrap (with hummus that tasted oddly peanut buttery/Asian. Weird. Really weird.), baked lays, and a fountain lemonade. Sure, there are other choices, but from what I saw the only thing gourmet were the names of each dish.



2.) They certainly don't need to be selling goldfish crackers, planters peanuts, etc. when like so many others have noted, Culinaria has all that for much less right next door. Get rid of all the regular grocery items. Only stock above-average quality food and beverages. Tout organic ingredients and green practices on the front and back-end of your business. Consult with some real “foodies” to tweak the menus and other offerings so that gourmet isn’t just a pipe dream for the place, but the real deal.



3.) Service was awkward. I waited several minutes behind two people having burritos made before I walked away to get a wrap at the sandwich counter instead. I couldn’t bear to watch the person making the burritos move so slowly while piling tons of stuff onto the open tortilla – there was NO way she was going to be able to wrap that up and have someone eat it without it falling apart into a total mess immediately. In other words, there was clearly a lack of training.



4.) Super awkward setup for eating downstairs. I glanced at the stairs to the balcony level but it seemed too far out of the way for a quick bite. After I finished my wrap I looked everywhere for some place to empty my trash and place my dirty plate. Nowhere to be found. I guessed that maybe there was a trash can around the other side of the register and I was right. This should been obviously addressed as part of the re-do, it was so odd to wander around looking for a place for my trash.



5.) Lack of atmosphere. Yes, it’s new looking but it just seemed a little rough around the edges. This is a tough thing to put into words, but I just didn’t get the “sit and stay awhile” vibe.



6.) Train train train your staff. They seem like good people. Train them in the importance of quality ingredients (let them try stuff out for themselves and build up real knowledge) and how to make people feel that they are in a cool space, instead of what almost feels like a glorified campus dining hall.



I’m crossing my fingers for them. I really am.

Matt Drops The H wrote:I think the crucifix hanging above the customer service desk at Culinaria is inappropriate, personally.

Why?

STLcolleen wrote:

Doug wrote:City Gourmet will be closed by the beginning of next year.

I said the same thing on the phone to my boyfriend today after leaving a very disappointing first lunch there today. I really hate to say it, but unless they really get it together soon, I don't see it surviving. Reasons/comments:



1.) They call it City Gourmet but I am really left wondering what was so "gourmet" about my lunch - a mediocre veggie hummus wrap (with hummus that tasted oddly peanut buttery/Asian. Weird. Really weird.), baked lays, and a fountain lemonade. Sure, there are other choices, but from what I saw the only thing gourmet were the names of each dish.



2.) They certainly don't need to be selling goldfish crackers, planters peanuts, etc. when like so many others have noted, Culinaria has all that for much less right next door. Get rid of all the regular grocery items. Only stock above-average quality food and beverages. Tout organic ingredients and green practices on the front and back-end of your business. Consult with some real “foodies” to tweak the menus and other offerings so that gourmet isn’t just a pipe dream for the place, but the real deal.



3.) Service was awkward. I waited several minutes behind two people having burritos made before I walked away to get a wrap at the sandwich counter instead. I couldn’t bear to watch the person making the burritos move so slowly while piling tons of stuff onto the open tortilla – there was NO way she was going to be able to wrap that up and have someone eat it without it falling apart into a total mess immediately. In other words, there was clearly a lack of training.



4.) Super awkward setup for eating downstairs. I glanced at the stairs to the balcony level but it seemed too far out of the way for a quick bite. After I finished my wrap I looked everywhere for some place to empty my trash and place my dirty plate. Nowhere to be found. I guessed that maybe there was a trash can around the other side of the register and I was right. This should been obviously addressed as part of the re-do, it was so odd to wander around looking for a place for my trash.



5.) Lack of atmosphere. Yes, it’s new looking but it just seemed a little rough around the edges. This is a tough thing to put into words, but I just didn’t get the “sit and stay awhile” vibe.



6.) Train train train your staff. They seem like good people. Train them in the importance of quality ingredients (let them try stuff out for themselves and build up real knowledge) and how to make people feel that they are in a cool space, instead of what almost feels like a glorified campus dining hall.



I’m crossing my fingers for them. I really am.

It's like the place is an afterthought to them. Where's the passion? It's a mystery.

I think the crucifix is inappropriate because it's a non-sectarian place of business. I have no problem with it in someones home or someones place of worship but it makes me not want to shop there.



On another note...



What does Express Sandwich Ordering mean at Culinaria? I assumed it meant that you order a sandwich that's already made and you don't have to wait for all the custom sandwiches to be made. From the experience I had today, it doesn't.



Also, no spicy bloody mary mix. Meh.

Can't say a crucifix bothers me at all. Religious symbols of any other type wouldn't bother me either. It is a private place of business after all, even if smoking can be banned there because it is considered public space.

dweebe wrote:

BL211 wrote:I think the crucifix is inappropriate because it's a non-sectarian place of business. I have no problem with it in someones home or someones place of worship but it makes me not want to shop there.

Then do something about it. Tell someone in store management or the HQ.

http://www.schnucks.com/consumersline.html

I did. I spoke to the manager about it.