Delmar Loop Trolley

leeharveyawesome · PostJul 02, 2015#9262015-07-02T13:28+00:00

Someone help me out here. Keep in mind I'm a huge advocate of public transportation and particularly a North South Metrolink.

Who's this trolley for mostly? Is it for people who want to go from the Loop and Forest Park and vice versa? Do you think people will use it for destinations just on the Loop? Say I'm at Cicero's and I'm headed to the Pageant which I guess is sort of a long walk for some people. Are they expecting people to use it for that sort of thing? I'd just walk every time. The Loop is kind of all about the walk to me. I hope it works out.

STLEnginerd · PostJul 02, 2015#9272015-07-02T13:37+00:00

^exactly. To me 1/4 mile is not worth waiting for a ride. I'll always walk that. On some level it's nice to get from say Ciceros to Metrolink station. But I think they are mainly looking at it as an amusement ride. Basically pseudo-public transit vehicle. The problem I've always had with it is if it fails which I think is at least moderately likely, it will be used as ammunition on why public transit doesn't work here.

moorlander · PostJul 02, 2015#9282015-07-02T13:45+00:00

Would be nice in bad weather (cold/rain). I think locals will use it to navigate the loop and I think tourists will use it when checking out Forest Park and the loop. The true test is if it will spur quality development east on Delmar and south on Deb.

roger wyoming II · PostJul 02, 2015#9292015-07-02T15:06+00:00

^ I'm with you on that..... there are a couple of ways to judge the success of this project. Although it would be a disappointment if the line musters only low ridership, it still could be called a success if it spurs more infill and businesses opening to take advantage of the data rail, etc.

I really don't know expected ridership levels and what is needed to meet operating costs, etc., but I think it can do fairly well. And I give major props to the King of The Loop for believing in streetcars and getting it done.... I would have preferred those federal $$ would have gone to a more strategic streetcar or rapid transit project, but those weren't on the table as transportation leaders have their heads up their rears.

quincunx · PostJul 04, 2015#9302015-07-04T02:41+00:00

MatthewHall · PostJul 04, 2015#9312015-07-04T02:57+00:00

leeharveyawesome wrote:Someone help me out here. Keep in mind I'm a huge advocate of public transportation and particularly a North South Metrolink.

Who's this trolley for mostly? Is it for people who want to go from the Loop and Forest Park and vice versa? Do you think people will use it for destinations just on the Loop? Say I'm at Cicero's and I'm headed to the Pageant which I guess is sort of a long walk for some people. Are they expecting people to use it for that sort of thing? I'd just walk every time. The Loop is kind of all about the walk to me. I hope it works out.

Streetcars don't spew exhaust into the street and are much smoother and quieter riding than buses. They last for decades as well. This will demonstrate this so that other lines can come along. St. Louis may even create a system of streetcars that run along streets and in separate rights of way, maybe even connecting with metrolink lines.

wabash · PostJul 04, 2015#9322015-07-04T05:01+00:00

quincunx wrote:

Great shot.

roger wyoming II wrote:Although it would be a disappointment if the line musters only low ridership, it still could be called a success if it spurs more infill and businesses opening to take advantage of the data rail, etc.

I agree. I don't think anyone will care if 300 or 3,000 people are riding the Loop Trolley every day. If new businesses and infill projects are sprouting up in the East Loop, and if revenues are up for the businesses to the west, it will be deemed a success.

If the Loop Trolley spurs Delmar and Debaliviere to become dense, vibrant mixed-use corridors with new businesses, buildings and residents from Hodiamont to the Parkway, 30 people could ride it a day and it would still be a success.

imran · PostJul 18, 2015#9332015-07-18T17:18+00:00

roger wyoming II · PostJul 18, 2015#9342015-07-18T20:25+00:00

^ There are no people in the pics! The opponents were right all along!

btw, I heard the Loop Trolley project isn't laying cable now and will wait for the westbound track construction... it sounds like it isn't even a done deal.

urban_dilettante · PostJul 19, 2015#9352015-07-19T05:27+00:00

^ it's st. louis; they're in the cars, obviously.

EDIT: wait, there aren't any cars, either! AHHHHHHHHHH…!

framer · PostJul 22, 2015#9362015-07-22T16:17+00:00

Tracks are being laid, concrete is being poured, and trolley opponents have filed another lawsuit:

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/crim ... b4272.html

Mound City · PostJul 22, 2015#9372015-07-22T16:33+00:00

leeharveyawesome wrote:Someone help me out here. Keep in mind I'm a huge advocate of public transportation and particularly a North South Metrolink.

Who's this trolley for mostly? Is it for people who want to go from the Loop and Forest Park and vice versa? Do you think people will use it for destinations just on the Loop? Say I'm at Cicero's and I'm headed to the Pageant which I guess is sort of a long walk for some people. Are they expecting people to use it for that sort of thing? I'd just walk every time. The Loop is kind of all about the walk to me. I hope it works out.

I think this thing could wind up being really nifty, cool, quirky, novel, etc.

But ultimately if it doesn't lead to more streetcar lines throughout the City, I feel like it will have been too much effort/time/money for something that's not quite worth it.

stlgasm · PostJul 22, 2015#9382015-07-22T16:40+00:00

Another lawsuit-- these people need to get a life. They complain about the Loop Trolley being a waste of money, yet they blow money on filing these silly, frivolous lawsuits based on trivial technicalities (the trolley route extends 100 feet outside of the taxing district, they claim. Seriously? 100 FEET!). Oh, and in case they haven't noticed, the tracks are already IN THE GROUND, so let's ponder that one for a minute. This is beyond NIMBYism, these people are BANANAs (Build Absolutely Nothing Anywhere Near Anything). They need to find a hobby and suck it up-- the rails are returning to Delmar and we'll all survive.

dredger · PostJul 22, 2015#9392015-07-22T18:37+00:00

Realistically, I think transit advocates admitted that the Loop Trolley is not about transit first and foremost. However, it garnered federal funding & local TDD funding, adds more connections and with some vision you could at least extend east or west on Delmar.

What I do agree with is that this is one place that a trolley will encourage more density & development and offer an unique way to connect Loop & Forest Park. In other words, about development and tourism.

dbInSouthCity · PostAug 14, 2015#9402015-08-14T15:47+00:00

Not even half way through the construction this bad boy is $7M over budget already...now projected at $50m, programmed at $43M and wasn't it originally planned at $25?

Ps the extra $7m was found at EWGateway when this project was magically awarded CMAQ/STP funding during the last round

pat · PostAug 14, 2015#9412015-08-14T16:38+00:00

Any idea why its over budget? Because of the bad weather earlier this summer, contractor issues?

DogtownBnR · PostAug 14, 2015#9422015-08-14T16:47+00:00

^DB, is there a link anywhere, that verifies they are already $7M over budget?

While that is not at all a good sign, we should probably wait until the project is complete, to get any accurate picture of the projects budget. They could make up some of this or it could be worse. Hard to say this early into the construction. If accurate, they are off to a bad start, no doubt!

dbInSouthCity · PostAug 14, 2015#9432015-08-14T16:51+00:00

pat wrote:Any idea why its over budget? Because of the bad weather earlier this summer, contractor issues?

it was over budget (the $43M) when the job was bid...they just didn't include $7m of it in the contact until they got the money from EWG

PostAug 14, 2015#9442015-08-14T17:05+00:00

it was bust from the beginning...i think they knew that $44m wasn't going to cover it so they just cut out some of the things and applied for EWG STP funds to cover what they cut out to make the $44M number work.

arch city · PostAug 14, 2015#9452015-08-14T23:02+00:00

Meanwhile over in Kansas City and Cincinnati...............................

Cincinnati pens letter putting Kansas City's streetcar manufacturer 'on notice'

and

Kansas City hikes late fee for streetcar manufacturer

throatybeard · PostSep 14, 2015#9462015-09-14T17:36+00:00

I am pleased to report that the DeBaliviere bridge is open again, on its west side only for motor vehicle traffic. Edwards drove his vintage car over it on Thursday.

wabash · PostSep 14, 2015#9472015-09-14T21:19+00:00

Is it just me or have you not posted in like 3 years? Keep the Loop Trolley / Skink-D / Deb Place updates coming throaty!

dbInSouthCity · PostSep 15, 2015#9482015-09-15T12:48+00:00

throatybeard wrote:I am pleased to report that the DeBaliviere bridge is open again, on its west side only for motor vehicle traffic. Edwards drove his vintage car over it on Thursday.

Any report that the job is really $50m+ million now instead of $43M?

wabash · PostSep 15, 2015#9492015-09-15T16:08+00:00

^Still not able to substantiate that claim?

dbInSouthCity · PostSep 15, 2015#9502015-09-15T16:13+00:00

$44M + $6.7M= $50.7M

See TIP # in the top image and ID# on the bottom one, if it was the same $ it would have the same TIP/ID #s

Delmar Loop Trolley

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