Is the consensus among the angry and protesting people, that the police planted the gun and bullets? If so, this same situation is going to be popping up a lot with mistrust and "it's your word against ours". That to me is the scariest part of this all, with so much crime in STL, how do you deal with it if there is no trust in the community?
- 284
I suggest the police stop patrolling all areas where theres protest & or areas of high violence & allow them all to fend for themselves ...
Hey if you want justice seek it on your own terms.
These very same people are the ones that condone this kind of criminal behavior..
It goes to show racism isn't only a white against black but its also black against white but thats never brought up because it will always be whites are in the wrong & blacks are in the right when in reality both are in the wrong..
This all will be a devastating set back to the entire region & not sure if St.Louis will ever recovery from such short sited unorganized riots & protest rallying for a guy with a lengthy criminal record ...
Hey if you want justice seek it on your own terms.
These very same people are the ones that condone this kind of criminal behavior..
It goes to show racism isn't only a white against black but its also black against white but thats never brought up because it will always be whites are in the wrong & blacks are in the right when in reality both are in the wrong..
This all will be a devastating set back to the entire region & not sure if St.Louis will ever recovery from such short sited unorganized riots & protest rallying for a guy with a lengthy criminal record ...
- 1,644
We are inadvertently creating a toxic environment where people who have no respect for the law, other people, the city, and criminals who fire stolen guns at cops are now gaining public support so in a sense we ARE "appeasing criminal behavior".sirshankalot wrote:I'm very interested to see how the law of unintended consequences plays out with regard to these protests....
The always painful unintended consequence will probably end up being continued high crime in the city, more black lives that matter spent in jail and another generation or two of black lives that matter who view the cops as enemies (criminals always view the cops as enemies).
Case in point, about 20 years ago I was coming from Chicago with a Pablo Escobar amount of drugs in the car and I'd probably be in jail today had I got busted. You can bet I was seeing the cops as the enemy that day. Whew, I was sweating bullets for five hours!
You got someone yelling "He had a sandwich he had a sandwich" when clearly he had a gun, well, this is the part where everyone is trying to be really, really, really, really nice and "respectful" about things. It's absurd but I guess that's where we are headed.ImprovSTL wrote:Is the consensus among the angry and protesting people, that the police planted the gun and bullets? If so, this same situation is going to be popping up a lot with mistrust and "it's your word against ours". That to me is the scariest part of this all, with so much crime in STL, how do you deal with it if there is no trust in the community?
The cops are in a no-win situation in the black community. If they don't solve the crime issues in North St. Louis it's because they don't care about the residents of North St. Louis and if they do their jobs (sometimes while getting shot at by very serious criminals) and something really bad happens then they are the enemy.
- 3,235
I feel as if the protesters need to take their demonstrations to other areas of the metro. Areas where people moved to like St Charles, West Co, Jeff Co, Madison Co to escape these issues which exaggerated the problem. In Shaw, they are preaching to the choir. In Ferguson, some people have stopped paying attention.
- 8,155
I guess you could go down to MoKabe's and ask around... Mo said something like half of the late night protestors were her staff and the other half their friends. As Improv asked, I'm not sure how many just don't believe the police account or are just plain angry about the whole "Ferguson" situation and this is their convenient chance to protest. Anyway, it was very interesting to see the Shaw/Grand response to all this and there certainly the protestors reflected the diversity of the area. Going down Hampton would be an interesting social experiment.dbInSouthCity wrote:Ferguson protests, i understand but this, this is just plain stupid.
So did the guy have a gun AND a sandwich? I always thought that the main issue at hand was, if the guy had a gun or not.. and thats the reason for the protest. And a secondary issue being how many times the cop shot at the guy. But I'm not completely sure..
Just got back in town...what the hell? This is the stupidest protesting I've seen by far. The guy fired off three rounds at a policeman, and had a ton of prior offenses. What is the story here? STLPD should be congratulated for doing its job and taking out the trash. Why is this criminal's race even relevant?
- 9,597
hopefully todays rain will keep people away and that will give SLMPD more time to paint a clearer picture of this idiot and the shooting.
I agree that in this situation the protesting seems misguided. I feel like it's kind of a dress rehearsal, keeping the energy alive and the people organized, for when the grand jury inevitably doesn't indict D. Wilson and the sh*t really hits the fan. There was that Reuters story a few days ago about how multiple law enforcement agencies are meeting multiple times a week to plan for such a situation--which seems yet like another hint from officials that no one's really expecting it go to trial. We'll see I guess. All I can say is I hope they've got a better plan than last time.
- 9,597
I dont think getting ready is any indication of what the outcome will be- they need to be ready for the trail too and possible not guiltywustl_eng wrote:. There was that Reuters story a few days ago about how multiple law enforcement agencies are meeting multiple times a week to plan for such a situation--which seems yet like another hint from officials that no one's really expecting it go to trial. We'll see I guess. All I can say is I hope they've got a better plan than last time.
what can really make this explode is if the grand jury comes up 8 in favor for charges and 4 no (9 is needed to charge)
- 1,644
It's crazy that the Federal Goverment picked St. Louis for their big initial test run of martial law. Get your Twitters ready St. Louis! 
Well, I agree that ordinarily that alone wouldn't be a sign that they're not expecting a trial--you're right, it's just prudent. But pretty much every other action of McCulloch's office seems to me to point that they're not very serious about taking this to trial.
- 5,433
Thank you for stating my point better than I did in my previous comments. This is EXACTLY what I mean.leeharveyawesome wrote:We are inadvertently creating a toxic environment where people who have no respect for the law, other people, the city, and criminals who fire stolen guns at cops are now gaining public support so in a sense we ARE "appeasing criminal behavior".
That has been my #1 concern since the protests began. My concern has only intensified in the last couple of days because, in my opinion, there is a LOT less ambiguity with the Myers shooting than with the Brown shooting.ImprovSTL wrote:Is the consensus among the angry and protesting people, that the police planted the gun and bullets? If so, this same situation is going to be popping up a lot with mistrust and "it's your word against ours". That to me is the scariest part of this all, with so much crime in STL, how do you deal with it if there is no trust in the community?
Hopefully someday there will be improved race relations in our area, and greater trust between cops and minorities. However, the actions of the agitators among the protesters seem to be making things even worse than they already were.
Exactly. Crime is a serious issue in this city, and I fear that the events of the last two days it will be even more difficult to fight it. That is only the beginning of what this activity is going to cost this city, I am afraid...leeharveyawesome wrote:The cops are in a no-win situation in the black community. If they don't solve the crime issues in North St. Louis it's because they don't care about the residents of North St. Louis and if they do their jobs (sometimes while getting shot at by very serious criminals) and something really bad happens then they are the enemy.
^ And this is exactly why there should not be a citizen review board for the STL PD. STL PD needs to be able to do their job independently without fear of reprisal from the misguided.
- 5,433
I agree. There should be checks and balances in place, but I believe there already are. I've been critical of Mayor Slay and Chief Dotson many times in the past, but they both seem committed to a full investigation. The call has already been made for federal investigators to examine the Myers shooting as well. Finally, Circuit Attorney Jennifer Joyce has pledged to conduct a thorough and independent investigation of the matter, and is not relying solely on the police department to gather information. As I said before, I think the circumstances that led to the Myers shooting are much less ambiguous than the Brown situation, and so are the police's actions following the shooting.onecity wrote:^ And this is exactly why there should not be a citizen review board for the STL PD. STL PD needs to be able to do their job independently without fear of reprisal from the misguided.
- 219
W-T-F is going on. Another shooting downtown.
http://www.kmov.com/news/Double-shootin ... 36401.html
http://www.kmov.com/news/Double-shootin ... 36401.html
After the Megan Boken murder and the other violence that summer the STL police, media, and mayor made visible attempts (hot spot policing, extra funds) and re-assured the public SOMETHING is being done to quell the violence. 2013 seemed much more peaceful, but 2014 has been pretty rough. I don't feel like anything reassuring has been said or done other than try to justify that certain types of crime are down...
- 8,155
^^ I really haven't heard much from them to be confident about either.... I think they have no clue what's going on and that's worrisome. btw, statistically speaking the sharp uptick in homicides began summer '13. At the end of June we were on pace to be below 100 for the year but we wound up with 120. On the other hand its still lower than just a few years ago even if not much solace.
- 2,093
Too many guns in general? Too many idiots with guns?
You're both right.
We are always going to have idiots. If guns were a lot rarer less chance an idiot gets their hands on one.
That said I'm not a gun control guy. Just stating facts. The love affair with the gun has cost us in this country.
You're both right.
We are always going to have idiots. If guns were a lot rarer less chance an idiot gets their hands on one.
That said I'm not a gun control guy. Just stating facts. The love affair with the gun has cost us in this country.
- 8,155
And for god's sake owners secure your freakin guns! I wish the media would find out who the owner of the gun was that could have killed a police officer.
I'm sure that police will attempt to discern the origin of the firearm as part of their investigation. If the owner was found to have sold it illegally, straw purchased it for the criminal, etc, they absolutely should be prosecuted and face the penalties.roger wyoming II wrote:And for god's sake owners secure your freakin guns! I wish the media would find out who the owner of the gun was that could have killed a police officer.
On the other hand, if the gun was stolen in a car break-in, burglary, etc - that person most certainly doesn't need to be dragged through the mud in the media. That sounds a whole lot like victim-blaming to me. That person's property was stolen, they are a victim in the whole thing as well.
- 8,155
^ I have no sympathy for gun owners who don't secure their guns. Almost everyday you read about guns that were stolen from autos, etc.... take some responsibility and lock 'em up!