i see a lot of grey hairs in that photo...leeharveyawesome wrote:Why "protesting" last night? Because they are millenials! and they are here to save the world, with or without facts or reality, one post, comment, link, tweet and protest at a time even when things are actually getting progressively worse but who cares we're millenials! and we're here to save the world!
Truth is, they were probably scared to be home alone last night.
I'm just kidding around. Move along....
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He definitely had purchased a sandwich... the question is whether he also had a gun. The market manager didn't think so.downtown2007 wrote:If the reports are accurate this kid had issues to begin with and by no means should anyone fire at the police. I cannot vouch for the victim in this instance and think the reports he had a sandwich are an absolute lie.
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wustl_eng wrote:Agree with this. That post made me feel a little nauseous.dbInSouthCity wrote:sirshankalot wrote:The cop did his job....They have the gun in evidence and 3 bullets. This kid is/was a thug and some liberal-minded judge lowered his bail from a previous violent crime because it was "too excessive." I'm not sorrry this man is dead, he was a menace to society. And I love how all his relatives come to his defense as if he were a model citizen...BS...Where were they when he first started hanging out with the wrong people...Probably living their own selfish lives of drugs, sex and violence.
Alright sympathizers, come to his aid and explain to me how this kids demise is:
1) whitey's fault
2) my fault
3) the cop's fault
it's all BS...
If things went down like the Dotson says, there is nothing to talk about...its done. you need to think about getting professional help tho.
good...
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ah, crap. the kid apparently wasn't wearing a sweatshirt at the store and didn't look like he had a gun. And may have been shot in the back of the head. I'm not saying the police account is wrong but this fogginess isn't going to help with trust.
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The white protestors are there defending their increasing interests, financial and otherwise, in South Grand just as the black protestors were defending their increasing interests in Ferguson. Race doesn't mean 'black.' Race means identity. Blacks are no more responsible for the construction of race than whites.
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getting shot in the back of the head seems possible if you are in a firing at the officer, your gun jams and you start to run.roger wyoming II wrote:ah, crap. the kid apparently wasn't wearing a sweatshirt at the store and didn't look like he had a gun. And may have been shot in the back of the head. I'm not saying the police account is wrong but this fogginess isn't going to help with trust.
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^ It just would have been extremely helpful to have had supportive witnesses/video like in the Powell case... the more fogginess out there will lead to more distrust. the market manager's doubt won't calm things in these fragile times.
It was a stolen gun of course.... good thing it didn't wound the officer or worse. I guess there is no crime for failure to secure a lawful firearm.
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I think we can all agree that there are key differences between this shooting and the death of Michael Brown in Ferguson two months ago. However, I'm saddened but not surprised to see an immediate and visceral reaction with heated protests that immediately followed the shooting. Media outlets reported and police confirmed that there were familiar faces from Ferguson among the crowd. Although the march along Shaw and Grand boulevards may have been relatively peaceful, there was video evidence that illustrated the tense moments, such as the unmarked Ford police car that drove away with a shattered rear window and the group of people that surrounded and kicked an unmarked SUV as a police officer got inside and drove away. There were also people pushing and shoving police- not exactly the peaceful protesters we hear about so often- but police handled it well in my opinion and defused what could have been a much worse scenario.
Two things trouble me about this specific case:
(1) Myers was free on $10,000 bail (specifically, a bond payment of $1,000) because a judge thought the original bail amount, set at $30,000, was too excessive. Do we really wonder why there are gun-related crimes in this city almost every day? Our city judicial system is a revolving door that puts dangerous people back on the streets time and time again. With enough time to do research, it would be not all that difficult to find many more examples of people who have been charged with violent crimes, only to be released so they could harm or even kill others. Who knows what would have happened if Myers' gun hadn't jammed, and if police hadn't used force once fired upon?
(2) How can we expect the police to keep us safe if their hands are tied (figuratively speaking) in matters like these? SLMPD deserves credit for handling this matter far better than the way in which Ferguson Police handled the Brown shooting, from the thoroughness of the statement, to the promise of an investigation, and also the handling of the protesters who quickly gathered in the area. If anything, I'm a bit disappointed no one was arrested, because it was clear that there was property damage, there were shots fired among the crowd at one point, and there were other minor disturbances as well.
I am all for holding police accountable, but now there seems to be a mob mentality in which police are always to blame. This will only undermine public safety further in my opinion. Police have to use kid gloves to deal with the protests that follow, even though more often than not, there seems to be at least a few troublemakers among the 'peaceful' crowds in these protests.
For every person who is fed up with crime and wants St. Louis to be a safer place, there seems to be at least another who is willing to appease criminal behavior. Like I said, I want police to be accountable and fair, but I am even more stunned by the reaction to the shooting last night than I am by anything that's transpired over the last two months since Michael Brown died.
Two things trouble me about this specific case:
(1) Myers was free on $10,000 bail (specifically, a bond payment of $1,000) because a judge thought the original bail amount, set at $30,000, was too excessive. Do we really wonder why there are gun-related crimes in this city almost every day? Our city judicial system is a revolving door that puts dangerous people back on the streets time and time again. With enough time to do research, it would be not all that difficult to find many more examples of people who have been charged with violent crimes, only to be released so they could harm or even kill others. Who knows what would have happened if Myers' gun hadn't jammed, and if police hadn't used force once fired upon?
(2) How can we expect the police to keep us safe if their hands are tied (figuratively speaking) in matters like these? SLMPD deserves credit for handling this matter far better than the way in which Ferguson Police handled the Brown shooting, from the thoroughness of the statement, to the promise of an investigation, and also the handling of the protesters who quickly gathered in the area. If anything, I'm a bit disappointed no one was arrested, because it was clear that there was property damage, there were shots fired among the crowd at one point, and there were other minor disturbances as well.
I am all for holding police accountable, but now there seems to be a mob mentality in which police are always to blame. This will only undermine public safety further in my opinion. Police have to use kid gloves to deal with the protests that follow, even though more often than not, there seems to be at least a few troublemakers among the 'peaceful' crowds in these protests.
For every person who is fed up with crime and wants St. Louis to be a safer place, there seems to be at least another who is willing to appease criminal behavior. Like I said, I want police to be accountable and fair, but I am even more stunned by the reaction to the shooting last night than I am by anything that's transpired over the last two months since Michael Brown died.
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An autopsy has shown that Vonderrit Myers Jr. was shot from five to seven times during a fatal encounter with an off-duty police officer Wednesday, police sources said.
Sen. Jamilah Nasheed suggested at a press conference earlier today that the teen had been shot in the back of the head, but medical examiners did not find any gunshots to the back of Myers' head, police sources said.
There were seven wounds to the teen's body, five of which are clearly bullet holes. Investigators still are trying to determine if the other wounds are exit wounds, sources said.
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Updated StlToday article states he was shot 5 times and none of them in the back on the head.roger wyoming II wrote:ah, crap. the kid apparently wasn't wearing a sweatshirt at the store and didn't look like he had a gun. And may have been shot in the back of the head. I'm not saying the police account is wrong but this fogginess isn't going to help with trust.
Your post was excellent from several angles. Thank you. You should post more. Also, I'm a white guy from Florissant; we should hang sometime. Maybe at the food trucks Friday? They'll be at the Valley of Flowers parade grounds. PM me.Trap8648 wrote:This particular case is really disheartening. I feel like he very well may have shot at that officer, however...the seeds of mistrust between Black people and the police (not just here but everywhere) and on the heels of the Mike Brown fiasco makes it so its hard to trust what comes out in not only the media but from law enforcement. The possibility that he fired at that cop is a real one...but when we've just seen law enforcement be not so transparent in Ferguson and using a fair amount of dirty pool tactics as well, it makes it hard to swallow. There was not a lot of outrage with the Kaijeme Powell case. We ALL saw what happened. While some may disagree with lethal force...it can be understood and justified.
I think what a lot of black people should probably realize is that the police are not here to protect and serve...they are here to enforce the law. They have families to go home too. They are here to enforce the law and make it home at the end of the night. They are going to use lethal force if they see fit. Now what counts as legitimate danger? I'm not sure...maybe THAT'S a debate worth having. Could they have sedated Kaijeme Powell without lethal force? Possibly...Mike Brown? From what I've seen/heard I feel like he was indeed killed. This one? IF he shot at the officer, okay. But I feel like this is just a continued reaction from the Mike Brown fallout.
The protestors have done their job in my opinion. They've made everyone well aware of the case. At this point they are not accomplishing anything. They are only antagonizing. The awareness has been accomplished, I truly believe nothing much would have been made of the case if protestors and social media would not have been around. They did some good work...but its time to cut out all the protests, especially when there seems to be no plan of action following it. They're simply making noise at this point. There are people in from out of town...people that dont even live here contributing to it...which on its face isn't necessarily bad...but ther are different agendas in this protest bunch and THAT is worrisome.
I'm a Black guy in Florissant if any of that matters...just my opinion. I been lurking the forum for years, but I just never post.
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Good to see things getting out quickly.... no back of the head shots and I take it no tazer.
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Local sous chef knocked off bicycle and mugged at gunpoint on the Mississippi Ave. overpass near Lafayette Square Tuesday night.
No link but trust me. Be safe ya'll and trust your instincts.
No link but trust me. Be safe ya'll and trust your instincts.
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Jamilah Nasheed isn't what St.Louis needs she just a instigator like some of the same tired names that encompass St.Louis politics..
Quit being a cater to these people who make false accusations without being there or knowing the facts..
Im sure the kids sandwich was fully loaded & seems like he was ready to shoot too kill..
Now if this young teen shot & killed this off duty police officer the officer happened to be white would these very same people be protesting would the ferguson protesters even been there ..
Quit being a cater to these people who make false accusations without being there or knowing the facts..
Im sure the kids sandwich was fully loaded & seems like he was ready to shoot too kill..
Now if this young teen shot & killed this off duty police officer the officer happened to be white would these very same people be protesting would the ferguson protesters even been there ..
I don't think anyone is trying to "appease criminal behavior"... there is a very real deficit of trust and understanding between law enforcement and black and poor communities in St. Louis, and they understandably react strongly when these things happen. Now of course this situation is different than Mike Brown (which is still VERY ambiguous and in my opinion likely a criminal act) but in the heat of the moment with little information confirmed it's easy for people who are naturally skeptical of the police story to get angry and protest.
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Good for you. I absolutely disagree. I could go into all of the reasons why, but it's all been done before in the Ferguson thread and no one's minds are going to be changed by either of us elaborating on this any further.wustl_eng wrote:I don't think anyone is trying to "appease criminal behavior"....
Meanwhile, Grand Boulevard is shut down between Lafayette Avenue and Shaw Boulevard so people can protest. So far, things are 'peaceful', at least by the media's definition of peace. Great- I hope it stays that way.
My primary concern tonight is about the potential consequences of shutting down a major thoroughfare on which many people depend for their everyday activities. I know these anti-police activists are hell-bent on making the 'comfortable uncomfortable', to use their parlance. I suppose they'd think I might be disingenuous to point out that Grand Boulevard is the busiest bus route in the city and many people depend on it to get to and from work. I'm sure Metro has a workaround, or at least I hope so. Bottom line, this still hampers people's ability to get wherever they need to be.
Worse yet, this blocks traffic to a major interstate interchange, and Saint Louis University Hospital and Cardinal Glennon Children's Medical Center are affected by this. What if ambulances cannot get to and from the hospitals? Yes, there are alternate routes, but if someone's life is on the line, every second counts. What if first responders are too late?
I support people's right to protest. I support police accountability. I also support the idea of waking up and realizing that the way in which these activities are being conducted comes with some potentially serious costs to our community.
The more we focus on our divisions, the harder it's going to be to reunite.
Good luck, Saint Louis.
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three one four, aren't you, by the very nature of your comments and questions, focusing on our "divisions"?
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Whatever. I expressed my opinion that people have the right to protest and hold police accountable. I also pointed out what I believe are very legitimate concerns about the potential and unforeseen impact of these activities on the community at large.Northside Neighbor wrote:three one four, aren't you, by the very nature of your comments and questions, focusing on our "divisions"?
I did not label or stereotype others, as you did in the Ferguson discussion toward people with whom you disagree. If you wish to accuse someone of being divisive, perhaps you should avoid remarks of your own that could be construed as divisive.
We see the issues surrounding these police actions from different perspectives, but we all care about Saint Louis. At some point, we as a group really need to agree to disagree on some of these comments and move forward.
Will anyone be protesting or burning the flag over the death at market and fourth downtown? Does that black life matter or do black lives only matter when killed by police? The shaw officer, from what I can tell was 100% justified in shooting and killing this criminal in self defense. What is there to protest here? And I agree, they shouldn't be allowed to shut down Grand.
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I'm very interested to see how the law of unintended consequences plays out with regard to these protests....
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Ferguson protests, i understand but this, this is just plain stupid.
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This is out of control. The victim here was clearly a seasoned felon and clearly had it coming. What do these protesters actually want? Should cops not be allowed to shoot armed and dangerous criminals? Or only not black armed and dangerous criminals?