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PostMay 18, 2007#1526

bonwich wrote:
Grover wrote:Please tell me you're thinking of the Bottle District. [-o<


Nope, BPV. KMOX reported it, attributing it to the BJ. Clayco pulled out because the project "appeared stalled."



Welcome to St. Louis!


There's an article about it in the Business Journal today. DeWitt says a decision on the new contractor will be made in "about a month."

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PostMay 18, 2007#1527

I can't wait. I have been dreaming of the day when I would be able to go to the baseball game, and then buy some dishes on the way home. Ooooh, maybe curtains too. Gee, I never thought of that. But, what color? Oh dear. Bronzeberry Frost would go so well with my couch, but Champagne will really lighten up the room.


Funny, but an all too real dilemma. I went with Bronzeberry Frost in my living room to lend a formal touch - though I'm not too happy with the lack of ambient light I receive through my north facing windows. So when it cam time to purchase curtains for the upstairs guest bedroom I went with Champagne - fabulous! They let in a ton of great light, but are opaque enough to provide privacy - ahhhh, the best of both worlds!

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PostMay 18, 2007#1528

^ Which means that the ugly hole will probably greet visitors to new Busch until at least next season. And you can kiss any concept of having it done by the All-Star Game g'bye.

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PostMay 18, 2007#1529

Out with Clayco, in with Fiasco.

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PostMay 18, 2007#1530

^Which means forget the local constructor stuck with the local mentality.



Ideally, I'd like to see BPV construction benefit local firms, but if they're all Doubting Lou's, then hire someone else.

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PostMay 18, 2007#1531

^

The article makes it sound more like it's Cordish's fault than Clayco's. Clayco says that Cordish hadn't been communicating with them and that no decisions had been made since taking proposals two months ago.

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PostMay 18, 2007#1532

Clayco pulling out as GC may not be the worst thing in the world. This could mean that they don't want to get in over their heads because (hint hint) other large-scale downtown projects might be taking their attention now.



Regardless if Clayco is GC or not, this thing will break ground this year. The land is too valuable to hold out any longer, all the finances will have gone through, obviously tenants are very interested, and they have real financial incentives to have this thing ready for the All Star game 2009. Not to mention the city can penalize them if part of it's not built by end of 2009 I think was the timeframe.

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PostMay 18, 2007#1533

I think it is a good thing for this project to have a new G.C. I find it funny that Clayco would state that they are pulling out of the project because it is "stalling" but they still hang on to TBD - more than a bit of hypocrisy here. Maybe Cordish actually called some references and found out about Clayco's M.O. (again ask anyone at Trammell Crow or THF if you want to know how about their practice).

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PostMay 18, 2007#1534

metzgda wrote:Clayco pulling out as GC may not be the worst thing in the world. This could mean that they don't want to get in over their heads because (hint hint) other large-scale downtown projects might be taking their attention now.
Exactly. Clayco is now involved in a "competing" downtown development.



When I first read the story, this is what immediately came to mind. Clayco hardly if ever turns down projects - especially one's of this magnitude.

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PostMay 18, 2007#1535

Um, er, Clayco was the contractor of record for BPV. Did they forget that when they signed up as contractor for TBD? Or could it be that there's a whole lot of sleazy behavior -- not to mention smoke-and-mirrors development "plans" -- that characterize the current state of downtown?

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PostMay 18, 2007#1536

bonwich wrote:Um, er, Clayco was the contractor of record for BPV. Did they forget that when they signed up as contractor for TBD? Or could it be that there's a whole lot of sleazy behavior -- not to mention smoke-and-mirrors development "plans" -- that characterize the current state of downtown?


I'm sure the lawyers will sort it out! :wink:

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PostMay 18, 2007#1537

The Central Scrutinizer wrote:
I'm sure the lawyers will sort it out! :wink:
Exactly, and that's where the "appeared stalled" proposition comes in. Perhaps it's their legal "out".

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PostMay 18, 2007#1538

does anyone remember the specifics of the fines the cardinals will face if they don't have something built by such and such date... if so can you re-post...gracias

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PostMay 18, 2007#1539

jambalaya wrote:I think it is a good thing for this project to have a new G.C.


But there is no new GC. If one was lined up I would agree, but since everything is now up in the air............

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PostMay 18, 2007#1540

How hard can it be to get another general contractor? I'm guessing they'd be tripping over themselves to get this project.

PostMay 18, 2007#1541

Clayco won’t be working on Ballpark Village

By Riddhi Trivedi-St. Clair

05/18/2007 2:39 pm




Clayco has pulled its application to be general contractor on the Ballpark Village project, days after the Post-Dispatch reported that the company had taken an expanded role in another high-profile downtown development, the Bottle District.



“We just have our hands full. We had to pick one or the other,” said Bob Clark, president and chief executive of the Clayton-based firm. “We have the chance to have an equity position in Bottle District and be a part of the development team.”



Baltimore-based Cordish Cos. is the Ballpark Village developer.



St. Louis based Clayco also is involved in a partnership to develop NorthPark, a 550-acre mixed-use office and industrial project underway near Lambert Field.



Clark said that the Ballpark Village and Bottle Works projects would compete with each other.



The Post-Dispatch reported Tuesday that Clayco assumed a more prominent role in Bottle Works in recent weeks after the departure of a co-developer, Charlotte, N.C.-based Ghazi Co. The lead developer is Dan McGuire, president of McGuire Moving & Storage Co. of St. Louis.



Clayco, which was the project manager on the construction of the new Busch Stadium, also is involved in a partnership to develop NorthPark, a 550-acre mixed-use office and industrial project underway near Lambert Field.



“We felt compelled to be very clear with Cordish that we didn’t see ourselves as contenders for the (Ballpark Village) job anymore,” Clark said.





Chase Martin, Cordish’s director of development for Ballpark Village, said that his company is interviewing several contractors for the project. He said Cordish is looking at hiring one firm to be general contractor, or several companies that could share the responsibility.



He downplayed the significance of Clayco dropping out.



“When you have a project of this size and scale, it’s typical to have contractors coming late in the process, or dropping out early,” Martin said.



Martin also said the Ballpark Village is on track to open on time.



“We have hit our goals and are moving forward accordingly,” he said.



Cordish is seeking to build six blocks of signature restaurants, specialty stores, entertainment venues and offices on the crater of land that hosted the old Busch Stadium. Cordish, which has built similar projects around the country, is partnering with the Cardinals organization, which owns the land. Though the team has yet to break ground — or even announce a date for groundbreaking — the Cardinals are hoping to have the project open by midsummer 2009, when Busch will host its first Major League All-Star game.



In February, the city’s Board of Aldermen backed providing $115 million in tax subsidies to the project. The state Department of Economic Development, which must also approve parts of the incentive package, is reviewing the proposal.



After the department reviews the incentives, the deal will go to the Missouri Development Finance Board for final approval. A spokesman for the Economic Development Department said this week staff there are still looking at the project. He did not know when it would be submitted to the finance board, which is chaired by Lt. Gov. Peter Kinder.



Executives from the Cordish Co. — which has already received state endorsement of a similar project in Kansas City — could not be immediately reached for comment on Friday.



Plans for the $290 million Bottle District call for a 16-acre mixed-use project that could include a high-rise condominium tower as well as retail and office space.



Post-Dispatch reporter Jake Wagman contributed to this story.



Source

PostMay 18, 2007#1542

Bottle Works??!!??

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PostMay 18, 2007#1543

So who's the nitwit that reported they dropped the project thinking it had stalled?... or were they talking about their own Bottle Works project?

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PostMay 18, 2007#1544

TGE-ATW wrote:

But there is no new GC. If one was lined up I would agree, but since everything is now up in the air............[/quote]



I would not be too worried about the qualified general contractors standing in line for this project. The reason I said earlier that Clayco being out is a good thing, is with all the qualified contractors we have in this city, Clayco was the least qualified to build a large mixed-use development like BPV (Clayco builds cheap big boxes very well, but ususally when they venture away from the tilt-up distribution center it turns out poorly for the owner - Clayco gets their money but recently the owner ends up suing them). We have some world-class general contractors in this town and I have a lot more confidence in a handful of contractors who aren't Clayco. And the line about them being too busy - what a load of garbage! Clayco has been a construction prostitute for the last 20 years - my guess is either Cordish or the Cardinals owners did not them as a g.c.[/b]

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PostMay 18, 2007#1545

If Clayco is so bad, and there are all these other great general contractors locally, why was Clayco chosen for a signature, very high-visibility project?

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PostMay 18, 2007#1546

Because they are great at marketing and some potential clients do not invest the time to check their references. Oh and by the way, they also hired Mark Lamping's brother to run their athletic facilities division in an attempt to land all the Cardinals work (they were successful getting all the maintenance work on old Busch Stadium because of this nepotism, but they were really shooting for the new Busch Stadium which thankfully they only had a very small part in). They are the definition of flash over substance and I only wish more developers would take the time to check references, because they would be suprised by what they hear.

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PostMay 18, 2007#1547

Perhaps even more interesting -- can anyone document that Clayco was ever the general contractor to begin with? I just searched P-D and BJ archives, and I can't find anything that links Clayco to the project, other than a 2005 BJ article where Clayco says it won't be involved in BPV.

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PostMay 19, 2007#1548

^ True, per the BJ article "Clayco has drawn it's two month old proposal to the stl birds and cordish to be considered as the GC on the 387 mill bpv development dt."

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PostMay 23, 2007#1549

Uh oh is all I can say.


Ballpark Village is not home free yet

By Jake Wagman

ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH

Wednesday, May. 23 2007



ST. LOUIS — The Cardinals insist their ambitious Ballpark Village is still on

track to break ground later this year, but some potential obstacles are looming.



— The state still must sign off on millions of dollars in public subsidies.



— Other downtown projects could emerge as competition.



— And then there's the question of where to put 5,000 years of bowling history.



The vision for the $387 million entertainment district calls for most of it to

be built on the crater that was the old Busch Stadium — property owned by the

team. The rest of the site is held by the International Bowling Museum and Hall

of Fame, a tenpins shrine that traces the sport as far back as ancient Egypt.



Obtaining the museum property is a key step for Ballpark Village, a

long-awaited project that, despite millions in pledged public financing and

years of discussion, has yet to show any physical signs of progress.



Even so, Bill DeWitt III, the team's senior vice president for business

development, said construction will begin as planned — in late summer or early

fall.



And the 2009 opening, in time for the stadium's first Major League All-Star

Game, is on target, DeWitt said.



He said the team and its development partner, Baltimore-based Cordish Co., are

"full steam ahead" on design, financing and negotiating with potential tenants,

whom he declined to identify.



DeWitt acknowledged that until backhoes hit the soil, it might be hard for the

public to picture Ballpark Village rising up from the rumble of a demolished

stadium.



"We understand," DeWitt said, "people are going to be wondering if this is for

real."



Sewing up the money



Earlier this year, the city's Board of Aldermen approved up to $115 million in

public incentives for the project. The money would come from a variety of

sources: $59 million in city tax incentives, $27 million in state tax breaks,

$25 million from two special taxing districts and $5 million in public bonds

bought by the Cardinals and Cordish.



But some of that money must be approved by the state Department of Economic

Development, which still is reviewing the project. After that, the project goes

to the Missouri Development Finance Board, headed by Lt. Gov. Peter Kinder.



Spence Jackson, a spokesman for the Department of Economic Development, said

there is no timetable for staff there to move on Ballpark Village's

application. The Cardinals are hoping to have the bonds needed to raise money

for the project in place by early August.



Cordish has a good track record of getting funding on similar projects. The

Development Finance Board previously approved more than $100 million for

Cordish's project on the other side of the state, the Kansas City Power and

Light District.



But timing on the deal is critical. If the finance board does not issue its

endorsement in the next three months, it could jeopardize the project from

breaking ground by the fall. City officials, though, are not worried.



"From what we can see," said Jeff Rainford, Mayor Francis Slay's chief of

staff, "the project is moving forward as planned."



Rising competition



Ballpark Village is emerging as several other downtown projects are in the

works. Pinnacle Entertainment is building a casino and 19-story hotel tower on

the riverfront. South of the stadium, another nightlife spot, the Icehouse

District, is in the works.



Plans at the Bottle District, targeted for a site next to the Edward Jones

Dome, include a bowling alley and a Cabo Wabo Cantina nightclub.



All those projects promise to offer some of the same attractions as Ballpark

Village: restaurants, retail shops and recreation.



Signs of the competition already may be showing. Last week, Clayco, one of the

area's largest builders, withdrew its proposal to be general contractor for

Ballpark Village to focus instead on the Bottle District.



Some question whether downtown can attract enough people and dollars to sustain

all of the proposed destinations.



"That is exactly the essence — crowded out," said Don Woehle, a first vice

president at the realty firm CB Richard Ellis who has been working downtown for

over 20 years. "Unless this becomes the Six Flags or Disney World Mecca of the

Midwest, this doesn't make sense."



While Woehle predicts Ballpark Village has a better shot of success than the

other developments, even something as fickle as the Cardinals' place in the

standings could affect whether people patronize shops and restaurants next to

the stadium.



"People stay downtown when they win," Woehle said. "They don't stay downtown

when they lose."



Patrick J. Welch, an economics professor at St. Louis University, said that

although the growing population of downtown could help Ballpark Village,

staying afloat in any market with renewed competition is difficult.



"The fact of the matter is, with any new business, a lot of them don't

survive," Welch said.



Bowling hall's future



For the bowling museum, it's also a question of survival — sell and relocate,

or be pushed out by the Cardinals, their longtime neighbor.



The museum has long enjoyed a mutually beneficial relationship with the

Cardinals since opening next to the old stadium in 1984. For about the past 10

years, the Cardinals have rented space in the museum for the team's own Hall of

Fame.



The Cardinals, though, don't plan on using that space for much longer. A spiffy

new Redbird Hall of Fame, with a restaurant that overlooks the outfield, is a

key part of Ballpark Village aspirations.



What the Cardinals do covet, however, is the land beneath the bowling museum,

which sits on the northwest corner of the Ballpark Village site.



The development agreement signed earlier this year with Mayor Slay's office

lays out a process in which the city would "initiate eminent domain

proceedings" on behalf of the Cardinals if "good faith efforts" to buy the

property are unsuccessful.



"I guess we are waiting for those good faith negotiations to begin," said Bill

Scheid, chairman of the Bowling Hall of Fame's Board of Trustees and president

of the bowling ball manufacturer Ebonite Inc. "We've only heard discussion

through intermediaries. Everything we know to this date is secondhand."



DeWitt offered a different description of the negotiations, saying the vice

president of Cordish has been in touch with Scheid on a "fairly regular basis."



Either way, the museum's trustees will discuss the future of the hall at their

annual meeting next month in Las Vegas. At least one already has firm views on

the possibility of eminent domain.



"I think it stinks," said John Sommer, head of Don Carter Lanes Inc. in

Rockford, Ill.



Eminent domain, Sommer said, "is wrong for just about everything I can think

of. Everything I know about it is totally wrong."



Even if the Cardinals acquired the land by eminent domain, it would be far from

a victory. If the sale price is set by the courts, the land might cost more

than if the team bought it outright. The long legal process also could

jeopardize the team's hopes of opening on time.



Ideally, DeWitt said, the team would arrange for the bowling hall to relocate

to Ballpark Village.



"It's no secret that folding the bowling museum into the village and rebranding

them and souping it up is part of our vision," DeWitt said. "That's what we are

focused on."



jwagman@post-dispatch.com | 314-622-3580

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PostMay 23, 2007#1550

^ I don't get that same "UH OH" feeling

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