Scare Tactics
When, in the history of building things in phases, did "phase one" ever include "building the whole thing"? That's why there are phases. I love how the news media is always the last to board the clue train and catch on to the fact that the project has been planned to be built phases to begin with, and then, upon finally comprehending this and comparing it to their initially wrong impression, they consider it a "scaling back." Idiots.
So I caught the story as well. The whole thing is still planned to be built, and it is still over $600 million. The first phase will be over $300 million and include one of the towers. The two eastern most towers will be built in the second phase. I would assume they are doing this so they don't overbuild their demand. This will also give them time to do pre-sales and even scale up if more demand is there (of course the opposite could also happen, and this would also help Cordish not lose money). I really don't think it's a big deal. They just need to find $15 million more and they can get started. While I typically like Jaco, i think he did sensationalize it just a bit.
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Thanks MattnSTL, that's exactaly what I was expecting to hear.MattnSTL wrote:So I caught the story as well. The whole thing is still planned to be built, and it is still over $600 million. The first phase will be over $300 million and include one of the towers. The two eastern most towers will be built in the second phase. I would assume they are doing this so they don't overbuild their demand. This will also give them time to do pre-sales and even scale up if more demand is there (of course the opposite could also happen, and this would also help Cordish not lose money). I really don't think it's a big deal. They just need to find $15 million more and they can get started. While I typically like Jaco, i think he did sensationalize it just a bit.
Hey, babe, I'm with you. I want to see the renderings come to life. I'm just saying that the FACTS reported by the NEWS suggest that it may not proceed as planned.
I, too, saw the piece on FOX2. There were few "facts" and little "news"... more fluff and a "conversation" analysis than anything.
MattnSTL wrote it best above. It is still the same planning and stages... it is the money and TIF arrangments etc... that are the issue and topic(s) at this time.
10/26: MOVING ON...
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[quote="matguy70I, too, saw the piece on FOX2. There were few "facts" and little "news"... more fluff and a "conversation" analysis than anything.[/quote]
Yeah, there were some stories on a large project I know the facts for CERTAIN and what the media reported was literally only half true. Very disappointing to provide information to millions of people and not state where the information came from or if it is factual.
As you said, moving on!
Yeah, there were some stories on a large project I know the facts for CERTAIN and what the media reported was literally only half true. Very disappointing to provide information to millions of people and not state where the information came from or if it is factual.
As you said, moving on!
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I missed the story on Channel 2, but after reviewing it and the comments here, it sounds like it was much ado about nothing.
If all sides are just $15 million away from making an announcement, I'd say that's pretty good given the complexity of the deal. I'm confident the project will commence in the next few months, and since the project will be built in phases, I think the likelihood of other towers being built is strong (I really don't see demand drying up for those that want to live in this location- even if it drops off elsewhere in downtown at some point!).
I like and respect Jaco, but this borders on sensationalism.
If all sides are just $15 million away from making an announcement, I'd say that's pretty good given the complexity of the deal. I'm confident the project will commence in the next few months, and since the project will be built in phases, I think the likelihood of other towers being built is strong (I really don't see demand drying up for those that want to live in this location- even if it drops off elsewhere in downtown at some point!).
I like and respect Jaco, but this borders on sensationalism.
Fox just reported that the deal is done. They are going to talk about the condo prices and all the details very soon.
They just announced it in the middle of the first of the ballgame on KTRS. Details will follow tomorrow.
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Of course the tagline on the Fox preview was "we'll tell you exactly how much this will cost taxpayers, possibly in the 100's of millions." Darn them! Why can't someone get excited about a $600M+ development in downtown?! (and, of course, why can't anyone portray the TIF acurately?)
An anouncement of Ballpark Village and a possible World Series victory in the same day. How Sweet is that! 
. Louis, MO -- (KTVI) - After ten months of sometimes heated negotiations, an agreement to build the long-delay Ballpark Village on the site of the old Busch Stadium downtown has finally been reached.
Fox 2 News has learned the details of the agreement, which will be formally announced at a news conference Friday afternoon.
The agreement among the city, the Cardinals, and the Cordish Company developers of Baltimore, calls for a $387 million dollar project, including a 22 to 25 story condominium tower overlooking the new ballpark. Two more condo towers arer scheduled to be constructed in later phases.
The condomimium project will feature 250 units, and prices will start at around $300 thousand dollars for the smallest unit of 1,100 square feet.
Todd Swanstrom, urbanologist and professor of Urban Studies at St. Louis University, says the condos are the key to the entire development.
"Upscale housing will probably pull from suburban areas, not from the city and from the viewpoint of the city that would be a winner," said Swanstrom. "It would bring new residents into the city and we need new upscale housing in the city."
.....continued
-22-25 story condo tower w/ 250 units
-Minimum 1,100 sq ft and $300,000 start price
-Two more condo towers in later phases
-275,000 sq feet of enterainment & restaurant space
-90,000 retail sq ft
-100,000 office sq ft
-1,200 space parking garage
-Cordish: $271 million
-City: $56 TIF (from sales & taxes generated from Busch)
-MO: $29 TIF
-Construction start: April or May 2007
Please tell me that we will get a REAL sports bar in this thing (HINT, HINT...Rawlings.)
http://www.myfoxstl.com/myfox/pages/New ... geId=3.2.1
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The city is providing $56 million in tax increment financing, or tif. That $56 million will come from sales and other city taxes generated inside Ballpark Village. The same holds true for $29 million in state of Missouri tax financing. City officials emphasized that the only taxpayers who will be helping pay for Ballpark Village are those whom actually go there to shop, work, or purchase homes.
AHHHHHHHHHHHH - now that's better.
That's good news and that 387 million is just the amo unt for the first phase so roughly 2/3 of the money is in place. Maybe the demand increases the project above and beyond.
http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument
http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument
St.Louis UAB alumni wrote:. Louis, MO -- (KTVI) - After ten months of sometimes heated negotiations, an agreement to build the long-delay Ballpark Village on the site of the old Busch Stadium downtown has finally been reached.
Fox 2 News has learned the details of the agreement, which will be formally announced at a news conference Friday afternoon.
The agreement among the city, the Cardinals, and the Cordish Company developers of Baltimore, calls for a $387 million dollar project, including a 22 to 25 story condominium tower overlooking the new ballpark. Two more condo towers arer scheduled to be constructed in later phases.
The condomimium project will feature 250 units, and prices will start at around $300 thousand dollars for the smallest unit of 1,100 square feet.
Todd Swanstrom, urbanologist and professor of Urban Studies at St. Louis University, says the condos are the key to the entire development.
"Upscale housing will probably pull from suburban areas, not from the city and from the viewpoint of the city that would be a winner," said Swanstrom. "It would bring new residents into the city and we need new upscale housing in the city."
.....continued
-22-25 story condo tower w/ 250 units
-Minimum 1,100 sq ft and $300,000 start price
-Two more condo towers in later phases
-275,000 sq feet of enterainment & restaurant space
-90,000 retail sq ft
-100,000 office sq ft
-1,200 space parking garage
-Cordish: $271 million
-City: $56 TIF (from sales & taxes generated from Busch)
-MO: $29 TIF
-Construction start: April or May 2007![]()
![]()
Please tell me that we will get a REAL sports bar in this thing (HINT, HINT...Rawlings.)
http://www.myfoxstl.com/myfox/pages/New ... geId=3.2.1
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Unfortunately he didn't go into details about the future phases of the project. I'm assuming it would top 600 million if in fact they build the 2 other towers. I watched the story last night and I "think" he said that there would be 3 towers, with one coming in the first phase but I'm not 100% sure. Can anyone confirm this? Like someone said earlier, hopefully the demand for the first condo building will be off the charts, bringing the other two in later phases. I have a good feeling that will happen. New construction downtown . . . I see this working out nicely in the long run. Good night for the Cards and St. Louis.
Two more towers would be added as housing demand allows. Cost of all phases would be approximately $650 million.
STLtoday article: http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument
STLtoday article: http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument
STL_Rising wrote:Unfortunately he didn't go into details about the future phases of the project. I'm assuming it would top 600 million if in fact they build the 2 other towers. I watched the story last night and I "think" he said that there would be 3 towers, with one coming in the first phase but I'm not 100% sure. Can anyone confirm this? Like someone said earlier, hopefully the demand for the first condo building will be off the charts, bringing the other two in later phases. I have a good feeling that will happen. New construction downtown . . . I see this working out nicely in the long run. Good night for the Cards and St. Louis.
The first phase will include all of the ground-level retail and entertainment venues, plus 250 condos and 100,000 square feet of office space.
Seriously, I bet they sell these condos out within a week, especially if most have views into Busch. Hopefully once they are full, they can immediately start on another condo tower. I wish they would just bump the size of this tower to 35 or 40 stories, b/c I bet they sell them all.
a pair of "celebrity chef" restaurants
Any guesses for this before the announcement comes out this afternoon? I bet there will be a Wolfgang Puck restaurant and an Emeril restaurant. I'm not particularly excited about both, but that should draw a lot of suburban interests, which is what this project needs to succeed.
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metzgda wrote:a pair of "celebrity chef" restaurants
Any guesses for this before the announcement comes out this afternoon? I bet there will be a Wolfgang Puck restaurant and an Emeril restaurant. I'm not particularly excited about both, but that should draw a lot of suburban interests, which is what this project needs to succeed.
I've had dinner at 2 of Emeril's restaurants in NO. Both were very, very good. Would love to have one of those here. Or is this some sort of "Friday's family friendly" place where he just slaps his name on it?
Another great addition would be a Shula's Steak House.
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metzgda wrote:a pair of "celebrity chef" restaurants
Any guesses for this before the announcement comes out this afternoon? I bet there will be a Wolfgang Puck restaurant and an Emeril restaurant. I'm not particularly excited about both, but that should draw a lot of suburban interests, which is what this project needs to succeed.
How about a Hell's Kitchen?
This is great news, I was so excited about the Cards win, I forgot to watch the story on Fox last night. I'm most excited in that Cordish is going to build out the village with the anticipation that two condo towers can be built on top of the existing structures.
From today's P-D:
The first phase will include all of the ground-level retail and entertainment venues, plus 250 condos and 100,000 square feet of office space. The next two phases would add a pair of office and residential towers atop first-phase buildings. When those are built will depend on demand in the market.
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so this is a go yes yes? Or do we still have to go through a big push to convince the legislature?
First how can we be sure this project will be a success?
Second TIF's were originally intended for urban blight and not corporate subsidy.
Third the stadium will only be around for 35 years. Assuming this project is a success, do you think residents living adjacent will appreciate the demolition?
Second TIF's were originally intended for urban blight and not corporate subsidy.
Third the stadium will only be around for 35 years. Assuming this project is a success, do you think residents living adjacent will appreciate the demolition?







