urbanSTL

^ zoning code doesn't apply to ballpark village...

chaifetz10 wrote:So really then the only hurdle is the 1% tax bill already filed. Got it. Hopefully this means we'll see some actual site movement within the year and it doesn't get pushed back or delayed.

That bill according to Alderman Joe Vaccaro could pass before January


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What do you think the viability of a market is at BPV?

Phase 2 now has its own website. This is probably where people can apply for a lease in the apartment Tower and see amenities that come with the development once is gets underway phase2.stlballparkvillage.com


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^ A thought I had about the market is the possibility of Dierbergs opening their first store inside city limits and/or moving their HQ from Chesterfield to the new office building. What are the odds of this happening?

FirSTLove wrote:^ A thought I had about the market is the possibility of Dierbergs opening their first store inside city limits and/or moving their HQ from Chesterfield to the new office building. What are the odds of this happening?

That's what I thought to. I think the Market may just be a independent store. It's a very small possibility.


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^ How about Schnucks relocating and changing up there downtown store. I just see BPV desiring a brand/chain name first and foremost.

shadrach wrote:Good question. I'm wondering if they're thinking of a model similar to the Foundry or—if any remembers—the short-lived, rather popular market at the Old Post Office in the late 80s/early 90s.

huh did not know there once was a market at OPO... as for BPV, I've raised that question before on whether it really would be a good location for broad downtown neighborhood services like a grocer or drug store; I'm just not convinced it is and think more regional draw stuff is what would be best down there. So maybe more of a marketplace than a standard grocer. But as you say that's getting a bit crowded with Foundry and Union Station, to a degree.

FirSTLove wrote:^ A thought I had about the market is the possibility of Dierbergs opening their first store inside city limits and/or moving their HQ from Chesterfield to the new office building. What are the odds of this happening?

I'd put the odds at around 0%.

If any local chain was to move to BPV it would likely be a Schnucks, as they are a sponsor of the Cardinals. While it may be unlikely, it definitely would be an interesting opportunity to build a flagship store, of similar quality to the one in Des Peres, in a high profile location across from Busch.

dredger wrote:^ How about Schnucks relocating and changing up there downtown store. I just see BPV desiring a brand/chain name first and foremost.

This would be a bad move. It would be moving the store away from the residential and convention base it serves most. Plus the store does just fine in that location.


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downtown2007 wrote:

dredger wrote:^ How about Schnucks relocating and changing up there downtown store. I just see BPV desiring a brand/chain name first and foremost.

This would be a bad move. It would be moving the store away from the residential and convention base it serves most. Plus the store does just fine in that location.


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Can see your points but also think GoHarvoGoHome also brings up some good points why Schnucks might think differently. Not as convenient location to Wash ave lofts but what 4-5 blocks difference while a short hop from Soulard, some decent office space/workers in between as well as more office & residential being proposed in the immediate area. At end of day, I don't see a grocery store but more along the idea of BPV floating a food stall idea like the Foundry.

dredger wrote:

downtown2007 wrote:

dredger wrote:^ How about Schnucks relocating and changing up there downtown store. I just see BPV desiring a brand/chain name first and foremost.

This would be a bad move. It would be moving the store away from the residential and convention base it serves most. Plus the store does just fine in that location.


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Can see your points but also think GoHarvoGoHome also brings up some good points why Schnucks might think differently. Not as convenient location to Wash ave lofts but what 4-5 blocks difference while a short hop from Soulard, some decent office space/workers in between as well as more office & residential being proposed in the immediate area. At end of day, I don't see a grocery store but more along the idea of BPV floating a food stall idea like the Foundry.

Furthermore, Culinaria is about as centrally located as a store can get and draws a lot of activity to the OPO district. By removing it, the area will become a dead zone and revert back to 2003 activity levels. And very few people from Soulard will come Downtown to shop for groceries. Too many other locations close to them. Most of the shoppers in the loft district visit Culinaria by foot. If you move it to BPV, they will have to hop in the car and may just go somewhere else. I can't believe someone actually mentioned this.


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I think the Market ill be similar to Consentinos Market in Kansas City. Now I am not implying that a KC Business will come over here but we can expect something similar out of this like that.

Downtown2007, what can't you believe? That a major business sponsor of the Cardinals might entertain new space or at least look at BPV that is about two blocks to the west and four blocks to south of their current location. Especially if it is a bigger footprint, gives more floor space and might offer better lease rates if the additional subsidy is added, BPV keeping 1% sales tax believe is the next request.

I don't give the idea much chance either but your last comment/sentence is pointless and pretty much defeats the purpose of even having this forum or discussion.

dredger wrote:Downtown2007, what can't you believe? That a major business sponsor of the Cardinals might entertain new space or at least look at BPV that is about two blocks to the west and four blocks to south of their current location. Especially if it is a bigger footprint, gives more floor space and might offer better lease rates if the additional subsidy is added, BPV keeping 1% sales tax believe is the next request.

I don't give the idea much chance either but your last comment/sentence is pointless and pretty much defeats the purpose of even having this forum or discussion.

So your going to subsidize them once to open in Culinaria and then again to move 4 blocks south? That, in my mind, is pointless.


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^ Agree, subsidies for Schnucks moving a few blocks is pointless because I don't think anyone on this thread can see how the city or downtown would gain anything. Much different then Cupples X IMO with legitimate gain in Class A space and the possibilities of a significant job gains of an expanding company for downtown, even if the company is downtown already.

But my point is that it is not too far fetched of an idea that Schnucks as a business would entertain the idea or crunch the numbers of relocating to BPV if they believe it would be financial gain for them. The scenario in my speculative mind is BPV/Cordish would actively peddle the space to Schnucks, Target small store format, or anyone else. while letting it be known indirectly who is interested or not and see what happens.

The vote on whether or not to pass the Ballpark Village subsidy and amendment has been pushed back to November 30th. It will be interesting to see what the vote will be out of the members of the board. I am sure they will vote in a area of 18-11 (Because Lewis Reed is involved) but we will see. I just hope that this is passed so constriction can begin sooner rather than later. I would also like to say that I read on the updated Hord Coplan Macht site that this phase still has a 220 room hotel. That hotel could be the leaked tower form earlier or included inside of the Office Building. But 220 rooms in a 10 floor building is a tight squeeze. I think they are still planning another building for this phase but trying to cover up the hotel tower and "put" it into the Office Building. Here is the project description

" The western-most block is a 10-story mixed-use building with 100,000 square feet of office space and a 200 key hotel, with additional retail in the base."