urbanSTL

bwcrow1s wrote: ↑

Aug 15, 2022

Does this not say that open carry is illegal in the City? If not, I stand corrected.  But I thought municipalities could enact their own open/concealed carry laws.

https://library.municode.com/mo/st._lou ... .040EXWHPA

City muni code is full of stuff that is no longer applicable. Every City cop i talk to says they cant stop someone for walking around with a gun 

'No longer applicable' does not mean 'no longer illegal', though, correct? If that is true, sounds like they're just not enforcing the laws.

bwcrow1s wrote: ↑

Aug 15, 2022

'No longer applicable' does not mean 'no longer illegal', though, correct? If that is true, sounds like they're just not enforcing the laws.

^id guess it means that the state passed a law that supersedes it. 

So local municipalities cannot have their own set of laws regarding firearms?

Which Missouri law supersedes St. Louis City's on open carry?

Genuinely curious, not trying to bicker, I'd just like to know whether a bunch of crap in our municipal codes are irrelevant.

bwcrow1s wrote: ↑

Aug 15, 2022

So local municipalities cannot have their own set of laws regarding firearms?

Which Missouri law supersedes St. Louis City's on open carry?

Genuinely curious, not trying to bicker, I'd just like to know whether a bunch of crap in our municipal codes are irrelevant.

A bunch of crap in municipal codes being irrelevant goes well beyond gun laws. When's the last time a streetcar operator called for the arrest of someone spitting on a theater step under their obligations per section 15.38.020?

bwcrow1s wrote: ↑

Aug 15, 2022

So local municipalities cannot have their own set of laws regarding firearms?

Which Missouri law supersedes St. Louis City's on open carry?

Genuinely curious, not trying to bicker, I'd just like to know whether a bunch of crap in our municipal codes are irrelevant.

Local governments in Missouri are quite constrained by the Missouri legislature in terms of regulating firearms.  People with conceal carry licenses may open carry in any city regardless of local ordinance, but I believe cities still have the authority to prohibit open carry for people who do not have a conceal carry permit.  As a practical matter, I suspect this makes enforcement difficult and police in most cases won't make a primary stop for open carry.  (Threatening brandishment is a different matter and is a crime regardless of whether a person has a permit or not.)

How Missouri and concealed carry permits work

https://www.ozarksfirst.com/local-news/ ... -missouri/

STLrainbow wrote: ↑

Aug 15, 2022

bwcrow1s wrote: ↑

Aug 15, 2022

So local municipalities cannot have their own set of laws regarding firearms?

Which Missouri law supersedes St. Louis City's on open carry?

Genuinely curious, not trying to bicker, I'd just like to know whether a bunch of crap in our municipal codes are irrelevant.

Local governments in Missouri are quite constrained by the Missouri legislature in terms of regulating firearms.  People with conceal carry licenses may open carry in any city regardless of local ordinance, but I believe cities still have the authority to prohibit open carry for people who do not have a conceal carry permit.  As a practical matter, I suspect this makes enforcement difficult and police in most cases won't make a primary stop for open carry.  (Threatening brandishment is a different matter and is a crime regardless of whether a person has a permit or not.)

Correct, as stated in the municipal codes, you can happily conceal carry.

So, in that sense, rifles are not 'conceal carry' firearms, and should automatically be a crime.  So, enforcement is an issue.

Not to mention you cannot purchase (basically, possess in this sense) a rifle unless you're 18, or a pistol unless over 21, correct? How is this different from a liquor store checking your ID to make sure you're old enough to purchase alcohol?

Apparently Kia and Hyundai cars have been getting stolen in high rates in St. Louis and across the nation after some Milwaukee gang calling themselves the "Kia Boyz" posted a video to TikTok about how to easily steal them. 

https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/acc ... 53f72.html

TikTok has to be the worst social media platform. Twitter and Facebook are bad too, but so many young kids are on TikTok making embarrassing videos of themselves and potentially watching videos that lead them do doing stupid sh*t (those “challenge” videos, car break ins, etc).

^^^ Missouri's Open Carry law does not restrict  the type of firearm... if the firearm type is legal under state law, it is legal to open carry it. So if you have a conceal carry permit (19+) you can open carry a rifle even in cities that restrict open carry for those who do not possess a concealed carry permit. 

^ correct, which also creates an issue for SLMPD when it comes to stopping people who open carry since its legal, so for them to stop someone and ask for their CCL it would have to be a secondary to the stop. 

RockChalkSTL wrote: ↑

Aug 16, 2022

Apparently Kia and Hyundai cars have been getting stolen in high rates in St. Louis and across the nation after some Milwaukee gang calling themselves the "Kia Boyz" posted a video to TikTok about how to easily steal them. 

https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/acc ... 53f72.html

Multiple Kia and Hyundai's have had the same window broken out on my street, multiple days this week. It's only been that brand. Extremely annoying for those owners.

^It's unfortunate to learn about how easy they are to steal. 

Kia and Hyundai are going to want to get this figured out quickly or they're going to lose a ton of American customers. 

U City residents can get a free Club from the U City Police Dept. if they own a Kia. I've always thought they were kinda dumb, but since this new trend started, I finally broke down and got one for mine. 

To start off, over the summer my dad got his Hyundai stolen off of our street, so I guess that gives me some kind of credit in this subject. I wouldn't really consider this a trend. As someone who is actually a person who uses TikTok and is a teenager. Most talking about "the KIA boys"  are lighthearted jokes. I don't think it's the "scary social media boogieman corrupting our youth" thing going on. I think that most of the people who are stealing these cars, who have learned how easy KIA and Hyundais are to steal,  are just low-income people struggling with the Pandemic; car theft is bound to go up. I think that people who get into car theft are not just random kids watching TikToks, it's people that struggle in their life likely with poverty, and eventually hear about how easy KIAs and Hyundais are to steal and turn to it naturally. These are the same kinds of people who have been falling into crime due to poverty for generations. This uptick in car theft should be expected and is a natural pattern. This isn't anything new and neither is the constant narrative of how this new fad (TikTok in this case)is going to ruin the next generation of kids.

alexstl wrote:To start off, over the summer my dad got his Hyundai stolen off of our street, so I guess that gives me some kind of credit in this subject. I wouldn't really consider this a trend. As someone who is actually a person who uses TikTok and is a teenager. Most talking about "the KIA boys"  are lighthearted jokes. I don't think it's the "scary social media boogieman corrupting our youth" thing going on. I think that most of the people who are stealing these cars, who have learned how easy KIA and Hyundais are to steal,  are just low-income people struggling with the Pandemic; car theft is bound to go up. I think that people who get into car theft are not just random kids watching TikToks, it's people that struggle in their life likely with poverty, and eventually hear about how easy KIAs and Hyundais are to steal and turn to it naturally. These are the same kinds of people who have been falling into crime due to poverty for generations. This uptick in car theft should be expected and is a natural pattern. This isn't anything new and neither is the constant narrative of how this new fad (TikTok in this case)is going to ruin the next generation of kids.

They aren’t hurting. They are prospering criminals. They know what they are doing is wrong. I have zero sympathy for them.

I understand where you're coming from. I'm not trying to act like criminals aren't in the wrong. What I really mean to say is that we should understand crime derives itself from many complex factors, and to point to TikTok as the one and only cause of this is just ridiculous.

They are committing them for fun and to committee other crimes. Not to drive to their job in the morning to make ends meet. It’s just wrong.

downtown2007 wrote: ↑

Aug 17, 2022

They aren’t hurting. They are prospering criminals. They know what they are doing is wrong. I have zero sympathy for them.

Genuinely thought for a second, "are you talking about the car thieves or the companies?" I guarantee that the Kia and Hyundai corporations have committed more harm themselves than the petty property damage perpetrated by these street criminals. Including their role in Global Capitalism that drives people to property crime, of course, but also the environmental damage, child labor, wage theft etc.

MarkHaversham wrote: ↑

Aug 17, 2022

downtown2007 wrote: ↑

Aug 17, 2022

They aren’t hurting. They are prospering criminals. They know what they are doing is wrong. I have zero sympathy for them.

Genuinely thought for a second, "are you talking about the car thieves or the companies?" I guarantee that the Kia and Hyundai corporations have committed more harm themselves than the petty property damage perpetrated by these street criminals. Including their role in Global Capitalism that drives people to property crime, of course, but also the environmental damage, child labor, wage theft etc.

This is wrong.

Criminals are bad. The criminals in this case are the people stealing cars. They should be punished. 

Nobody here tried to say that TikTok is the sole reason why Kias and Hyundais are being stolen.... but car theft numbers for these brands are up following an instructional TikTok video. 

I think a lot of the responsibility for this should go on the actual companies. Kia and Hyundai better be hard at work right now figuring out how to not be the easiest cars on the market to steal. TikTok or not, the word is out. 

Having been a happy Jeep Cherokee Sport owner in the early 2000s, I will tell you many cars have vulnerabilities to theft.  In that era it was the Chrysler makes, Jeep included, where they could pop a window and with a screw driver have your column cover off and ignition turned on in less than 30 seconds.  The difference between now and then is the rate at which information travels, so while the increase in jeep/chrysler thefts may have had a gradual increase due to slower information diaspora, the kia boyz assured and exponential increase in the rate of stolen Kias and Hyundais.