urbanSTL

wabash wrote: ↑

May 22, 2021

urbanitas wrote: ↑

May 21, 2021

You'd have to ask the national financial institutions which would be investing in, or financing, said tower(s). 

Fortunately right now they are awash in cash and desperate to put it to work. 

Desperate?  Why, because of inflation?

There's certainly no shortage of opportunities to put cash "to work" right now, if there ever was. Even just in the real estate business, there are properties, retailers, commercial property landlords, stalled developments, etc. which can be had for pennies on the dollar.  And the impact of all the delinquencies, defaults, and bankruptcies on smaller banks and overextended investment firms is still unknown.  There is a veritable orchard of potential low-hanging fruit. 


 

pdm_ad wrote: ↑

May 22, 2021

chriss752 wrote: ↑

May 21, 2021

For the record, One Cardinal Way is 100% leased right now.

Wow, great news! I made a (rather optimistic) prediction that 2CW would be announced this year and that may actually not be too far off the mark. It's clear they underestimated the demand and could have easily filled a 40 story tower.

It's more likely than not that 2CW will be announced this year and include the same design team as OCW (Hord Coplan Macht). A friendly, and trustworthy, source of mine says 2CW will be shorter than OCW and include design cues from OCW and 3 Light. My source, and another familiar with it, has competing information on the location. One says at the Northwest parking lot (where that 24-story building leaked after Phase 2 was revealed) and the other says directly behind OCW on the Northeast lot. We'll see what happens over the next few months. I'd say an announcement is imminent, but both of my sources say things are still being worked on and that preliminary renderings have been sent around to a select group of people. 

Another office building is also being contemplated for Ballpark Village, but that's just a thought right now with no indication that a second office building will be proposed in built.

chriss752 wrote: ↑

May 23, 2021

source of mine says 2CW will be shorter than OCW and include design cues from OCW and 3 Light. My source, and another familiar with it, has competing information on the location. One says at the Northwest parking lot (where that 24-story building leaked after Phase 2 was revealed) and the other says directly behind OCW on the Northeast lot. 

Another office building is also being contemplated for Ballpark Village, but that's just a thought right now with no indication that a second office building will be proposed in built.

Maybe, hopefully, they move forward with "shorter than OCW" residential buildings at both the northeast AND northwest corners and save the north central lot for potential future office.

chriss752 wrote: ↑

May 23, 2021

It's more likely than not that 2CW will be announced this year and include the same design team as OCW (Hord Coplan Macht). A friendly, and trustworthy, source of mine says 2CW will be shorter than OCW and include design cues from OCW and 3 Light. My source, and another familiar with it, has competing information on the location. One says at the Northwest parking lot (where that 24-story building leaked after Phase 2 was revealed) and the other says directly behind OCW on the Northeast lot. We'll see what happens over the next few months. I'd say an announcement is imminent, but both of my sources say things are still being worked on and that preliminary renderings have been sent around to a select group of people. 

Another office building is also being contemplated for Ballpark Village, but that's just a thought right now with no indication that a second office building will be proposed in built.

"The other" sounds more reliable...

Again, anything on the northeast corner would have most of it's ballpark views blocked. The best use under the circumstances going forward would be a shorter, more reasonably-priced residential building with a rooftop deck, and ground floor retail. So basically, expanding each of the current uses northward makes the most sense from a leasing and layout standpoint for the next phase.

A 10-15 story residential building on the northeast corner would allow them to bring something different to BPV, which will add to the non-game day activity and start to work on that "Village" concept. The cheaper building would test the market for smaller luxury - but more reasonably priced - units, to tap a different demographic and bring in more full time residents. It could also provide the opportunity for a larger retail space and perhaps offer something different than the current bar/restaurant/athletic wear "mix".

And the northwest corner will very likely be reserved for a slightly taller version of the Pennant Building, and will go up whenever they find another premium penthouse office space tenant who wants ballpark views and their name in lights, like PWC.

That leaves the central lot, to be reserved for the final signature element to Ballpark Village, incorporating whatever they've learned from all the previous phases...

There is only piece of real estate left that can offer good views into the ballpark: Stadium East Garage. 40 stories there would be incredible and you could still leave the northern half of the garage.

^ Not part of BPV and certainly wouldn't have the views but always thought a slender residential tower where Cupples X was once upon a time proposed would be a great fit for the immediate area.  Believe property would still be in KDG control after the respective developers merged.   Of course, having Cupples X come back to live and a second BPV office building would be a nice add to the mix.   

BellaVilla wrote: ↑

May 27, 2021

There is only piece of real estate left that can offer good views into the ballpark: Stadium East Garage. 40 stories there would be incredible and you could still leave the northern half of the garage.

That's not the only piece, especially if we are talking 40-story towers...

801 Poplar St. and the south end of 500 S. Broadway would have killer views of the field once you get above 15 floors or so.

urbanitas wrote: ↑

May 28, 2021

My pipedream, since Busch III was unveiled, is that someone will consolidate all those parcels, buy the air rights from Bi-State, and build a one-square-block garage and retail podium over the tracks, with a mixed-use tower along 8th Street overlooking the ballpark.

I like the way you think.

As long as we're dreaming, I'd really like to see something around 40 stories on the eastern-most site. That would make the most impact on the classic St. Louis Skyline image, giving balance to Met Square.

sc4mayor wrote: ↑

May 28, 2021

One Cardinal Way hits 100% leased
https://www.audacy.com/kmox/news/local/ ... 0YAMiJHgFE

According to Rogers, 70% of the lessees live at One Cardinal Way full-time. DeWitt says many are young professionals and empty nesters, but others belong to a market that, he says, most downtown properties elsewhere don't tap into.

So, does the success of One Cardinal Way clear the way for a second residential tower to be included in phase 3 of Ballpark Village?

"Certainly the preliminary verdict is in that we've created something special," says DeWitt. "Presumably more of it would be successful too, but we have to run through all the exercises of planning, financing and everything else first.

"We've already talked about some schematic design ideas for maybe another tower or whatever, but it's a little early to start talking about when we might break ground on something else."

From what I know, design is further along than Bill DeWitt makes it seem. Renderings have been produced and are in-hand with a select number of people just waiting to be revealed at this point. I'm sure they have some Pro Forma work left to do and iron out some specific details, but they've passed the schematic design phase and are on their way, or already underway, to crunching the numbers and other things. It's hard to know for 100% certainty though since may source doesn't want to admit too much.

What I will say though is 2 Cardinal Way is reportedly at 25-stories (1 retail, lobby and loading zone, 7 parking level, 17 residential floors). 250 apartments (+/- 5), estimated at this point. Specific design layout, as I said previously, is supposed to be a fusion of One Cardinal Way and Three Light, so look for an "L" shaped design on top of the podium with slanted roof and perhaps a cantilevered portion of the "L" held up by "W" supports like 3 Light. Glass color, I imagine, will be dark like One Cardinal Way. I wouldn't be surprised if we see another "sky screen" on 2 Cardinal Way considering that parts of it will be visible from within the stadium, highway, and areas South of the Stadium.

So not ti burst anyones bubble, but I highly doubt any future buildings at Ballpark Village exceed One Cardinal Way in height unless, under extraordinary circumstances, a single office tenant that needs a ton of Class A space chooses Ballpark Village and a tall office tower is built. I'm fine with the buildings being shorter than One Cardinal Way because, in my view, it could create a "spiral" design of the buildings (Phase 1 being the shortest, followed by OneLife, followed by Live! By Loews, followed by PwC Pennant Building, followed by Northwest Lot, Central Lot, 2 Cardinal Way (Northeast Lot) and capped with One Cardinal Way being the tallest).

Until 2 Cardinal Way is announced, OPUS and Bamboo Equity are going to try and capitalize off of the demand for residential near the stadium with 1014 Spruce and 300 South Broadway (combined adding over 220 apartments). While those properties wont be at the same luxury level as One Cardinal Way, they'll fill a demand zone. 

It drives my OCD self nuts that they haven't updated the flags for the minor league affiliates along the Busch rooftop. Seems like something that should've been done to start the season.

Doesn't even cost money, just remove the now-defunct teams and flip-flip Peoria and West Palm Beach.

I'll take 5 8-story buildings over one 40-story.  More density!

^Now starting to look like that Northwest Parcel office building may just go from conceptual thought to the drawing board (if it hasn’t already).

sc4mayor wrote: ↑

May 30, 2021

Pipe dream, but how great would it be if DeWitt could lure Brown Shoe down to BPV?

I don't think it is out of the realm of possibility considering you got a great spot for them to bring in people whether it is vendors, suppliers and own people for training with having signature hotel in Lowe's and the Cardinals/BPV at your doorstep.  I guess the question if they get just enough buy in with employees.   However, with flex WFH schedules it is probably less of an issue 

First post from me after probably reading for about 2-3 years. Finally decided to take the plunge and sign up.

The office aspect is the most interesting part to me and probably what concerns me above all. Obviously back in the day they were let down by Centene, and correct me if I'm wrong, other than Butcher Joseph, PWC and FSMW arrived from other Downtown Buildings, so it was essentially reshuffling of the deck chairs. They then went with the Spark coworking space as they couldn't fill the remaining vacancies. Theres plenty of companies and organisations they could pluck from the suburbs, but I suppose it all boils down to how well they can sell them on the vision.

I'm not concerned about the residential aspect and agree something a bit more affordable is a better fit for phase 3 and would do well.

Also as mentioned before, non bar/restaurant/athletic type uses. Starbucks was a good start. Maybe some additional fast casual places to eat. I'm not sure we'll get a full whack grocery store, but some sort of convenience option like say an On the Run, and additionally any sort of amenity stores which are useful to potential residents/workers would be welcome - i.e, Chipotle or even local names like Lions Choice looking for a "marquee" location, without wishing to sound corny. The entertainment side of things looks good between the two, soon to be three sports teams down there and the various other events they host. By the time phase 3 is ready to go the MLS stadium will be completed and in use I'd imagine.

Overall I'm cautiously optimistic.

^  Definitely agree on the fast casual places to eat should be a priority for retail.  I think Chipotle (or some nationally recognized brand) would do quite well.  I know Chipotle has been very slow to expand in the city from their Grand location, but it does look like a new Chipotle franchise is going in on Hampton.  I don't see why either of those locations would be any more successful than a location in a high foot traffic (and pretty tourist) area like BPV.

Trololzilla wrote: ↑

May 31, 2021

^^ Would love to see a Lion's Choice in BPV somewhere (or really just anywhere DT). Good exposure for a local chain.

Right? It's quick, affordable, solid protein delivery.  A signature location would be great, though the lack of a drive-thru might be a deal breaker for them.