urbanSTL

The Central West End has signs various places (at least along the Euclid corridor) titled "Real Change" which discourage people from giving money to homeless and instead encourage people to give money to agencies that help the homeless (hopefully the St. Patrick Center is a beneficiary of that). Here is some information about it:



http://www.cwemd.org/RealChangeCampaign_578.aspx



http://thecwe.com/realchange.htm



I wonder if this could be expanded to the Downtown/loft district and elsewhere in the city.

^ I wouldn’t mind if St. Patrick’s Center had some of those scattered downtown.

I almost never get pan handled downtown since that ordinance went in to effect. Of course I might see people sitting down with a can, but they never actually ask for anything. Ironically, though, I do get approached a lot in the Central West End. Just last week walking about 30 feet I had two separate people RUN to me asking for change. Does the CWE have the same ordinance?



And then again, it is probably just my odds. (So far they are pretty good when it comes to crime) ((CROSS FINGERS!))

The Central Scrutinizer wrote:

gopher wrote:Panhandlers want your money; advocates say don't give

From:

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument



Some choice quotes:

She pulled a bankroll from her pocket — mostly ones and some fives, more than $100 in all. "That's just from today, a couple hours," Martin said. "You watch me for 20 minutes, I can come back with $20, easy."



A good panhandler can average $40 an hour, some said. Of course, they rarely beg for more than a couple of hours a day.





— Dan Buck, chief executive of St. Patrick Center, puts the onus on the public: Stop giving your change and you'll stop people panhandling for it.



"It's supply and demand," Buck said. "Dry up the supply. Instead of giving, have a conversation with that person. Ask who he is. Maybe encourage him to get help."

And yet people will continue to give them money.



You can't fix stupid.

It's not necessarily stupid, it's naive and uninformed. The conversations on this forum as well as articles about panhandling and homelessness (like this article in the Post) were eye-openers for me. Honestly, I thought I was doing a good deed by helping someone in need when I handed someone a buck or two.



My kids are taught in school to help the less-fortunate. They have fundraisers benefiting St. Patricks Center, winter coat drives, "give your change to the homeless" days, etc etc etc. So when we encountered (quite a few) panhandlers in Chicago, the kids really wanted to help them out by giving them some money for "food" (their signs, after all, say "Hungry, Please Help."



It's tough to explain to a kid that the panhandler is likely an alcoholic who apparently makes more per hour (untaxed, no less!) than I do!

zink wrote:
I almost never get pan handled downtown since that ordinance went in to effect.

Serious?? I was going to comment (but wanted to wait a bit) that panhandling seems to have exploded downtown in the past month or two. This is in the area bound roughly by 6th/12th/Locust/Chestnut, so possibly some have been displaced from elsewhere. But on certain stretches the panhandlers are lined up several to a block. What I've noticed most is that it's not the usual suspects that I've seen on and off for years. They're still around, too, but this is a whole new set of faces.

The panhandling (aggressive and otherwise) has exploded downtown in the past few months. We have a new police captain in District 4 and I'm not sure where the homeless are coming from. From the Post Dispatch, they listed their residences as Illinois, Arkansas, North Carolina, and Creve Couer (West County). Rene Rowe (the panhandler from the Post Dispatch) was out sunning herself in Lucas Park drinking with a bunch of her "friends" most of the afternoon.



That being said, a sidewalk is not a "donation center" Saw a woman get out of her car, drop a whole load of clothes on the sidewalk of Lucas park, get back in and drive off. This was after picking up 7 or 8 tents that were littering the sidewalk and park.



I guess the "intentcity" of panhandling has risen.



but seriously, what kind of message does that type of "donation" send?

I spend most of my time east of Tucker, and have not noticed any increase in panhandling. I haven't been approached much recently.

The Central Scrutinizer wrote:

DeBaliviere wrote:I spend most of my time east of Tucker, and have not noticed any increase in panhandling. I haven't been approached much recently.

Same here.



Is this happening during the day perhaps? M-F days, I'm not down there, so I wouldn't notice.

Yep, during the day. On Pine between 10th and 8th this morning, there were four on one side of the street.

OMFG! Panhandlers! Quick, run for the County! (hope you never travel to Boston, Chicago or NYC, let along London, Rome or any other large city)



I never understood why a panhandler or two or five would ruin someone's day.

the two cities where I encountered the most panhandlers are Austin and Madison, WI.



That's right, the two cities that regularly make the "most liveable", "most hip", etc. lists.



Now don't get me wrong, Lucas Park needs to be taken back for the residents and no one should have to deal with aggressive and confrontational begging. But if you want a "city" free of panhandlers you need to go to some booming, cutting edge metropolis like Sioux Falls, SD or Topeka, KS.



Just two cities off the top of my head where I did not have anyone ask me for a buck.

Grover wrote:OMFG! Panhandlers! Quick, run for the County! (hope you never travel to Boston, Chicago or NYC, let along London, Rome or any other large city)



I never understood why a panhandler or two or five would ruin someone's day.

Doesn't ruin my day, but it's annoying and a little threatening when someone follows you trying to get money from you.



So this is another "that's living in the city, if you don't like it move" episode for you, right?

olvidarte wrote:

Grover wrote:OMFG! Panhandlers! Quick, run for the County! (hope you never travel to Boston, Chicago or NYC, let along London, Rome or any other large city)



I never understood why a panhandler or two or five would ruin someone's day.

Doesn't ruin my day, but it's annoying and a little threatening when someone follows you trying to get money from you.



So this is another "that's living in the city, if you don't like it move" episode for you, right?

Yes.



Less panhandling-good. Less aggressive panhandling-good. Zero panhandling-won't happen.

southsidepride wrote:
Just two cities off the top of my head where I did not have anyone ask me for a buck.

Just came back from Springfield MO and was not panhandled. That town has gotta be the strip mall capital of the midwest if not the country. Even in the down-at-the-heels downtown area, near a college campus, there were no panhandlers.



I don't like panhandlers, but I like strip mall towns even less.



You'd have to pay be a lotta money to live there, enough to jet off to places more interestined 8 - 9 months of the year.

I live on N Taylor near Maryland and encounter panhandlers often just going from the front door of my building to my car. They are usually folks heading somewhere I would guess to/from the metro station, not just hanging around.



I don't really think much about it anymore.

GelatinousEndive wrote:Just came back from Springfield MO and was not panhandled. That town has gotta be the strip mall capital of the midwest if not the country. Even in the down-at-the-heels downtown area, near a college campus, there were no panhandlers.



I don't like panhandlers, but I like strip mall towns even less.



You'd have to pay be a lotta money to live there, enough to jet off to places more interestined 8 - 9 months of the year.

Okay, I get it, you don't like Springfield!



Springfield has a lot of sprawl and the strip malls to go with it, but for a town its size, I don't think it's that bad. Of course its downtown cannot even compare to ours, but both downtowns are a work in progress, and like downtown St. Louis, a lot of progress has been made in downtown Springfield in recent years.



I like downtown Springfield and the potential for more redevelopment and new construction there. Walnut Street is charming and will eventually be at the center of a stronger link between downtown and Missouri State University. Commercial Street has the potential to become a second downtown. I also like the Rountree area and the mid-century homes around Phelps Grove Park. Of course it's a matter of perspective, but I don't think it's all a mess of strip malls. That's like judging St. Louis on the suburban mess that surrounds the city we love, or even dismissing all the city has to offer based on the amount of insipid suburban development that's occured within its borders in the last decade or so. Oh, and they have the AA Cardinals affiliate, Missouri State athletics and events, a small but nice zoo, a Japanese garden, and a park near downtown that reminds me a bit of Citygarden, although I'll admit the setting isn't quite as nice. And if you can't wait to get out of town, Springfield perenially ranks among the best cities in the nation for low cost of living.



On the downside, I'm not fond of the (social) conservatism there, but that's hardly unique to Springfield.



And then there are the naysayers. Say, that reminds me of a place...



I'm not dying to move there by any means. However, I did spend a couple of summers there back in the day, so I wouldn't die if I had to move there either.



BTW, to tie this back into the topic again, years ago I was accosted many times by panhandlers in Springfield at Park Central Square and by Heer's (once the city's leading department store- Kevin McGowan has plans to convert it into lofts/retail/restaurants when the economy rebounds) until pedestrian canopies surrounding the store and the rest of the square were torn down. Perhaps the panhandlers left for greener pastures...like the city's many strip malls.



/If anyone at the Springfield Area Chamber of Commerce is reading, please PM me so I can tell you where to send the check.

Wilmington, NC, implemented the city’s first “Make a Change” meter, recently installed near the city’s main Post Office.

The program is Wilmington’s “Ten Year Plan to End Chronic Homelessness and Reduce Homelessness” in North Carolina’s Cape Fear region.

The area around the main Post Office is one of 11 downtown locations where panhandling is prevalent. The city has installed the black-and-yellow meters to encourage residents to put their spare change in the meters rather than give it to panhandlers. The change deposited in the meters will help agencies that assist the homeless.

The city is “trying to make downtown safer for residents.” He says customers who want to help the homeless still can, “and they’ll feel more comfortable coming to the Post Office.”

Watcher wrote:Wilmington, NC, implemented the city’s first “Make a Change” meter, recently installed near the city’s main Post Office.

The program is Wilmington’s “Ten Year Plan to End Chronic Homelessness and Reduce Homelessness” in North Carolina’s Cape Fear region.

The area around the main Post Office is one of 11 downtown locations where panhandling is prevalent. The city has installed the black-and-yellow meters to encourage residents to put their spare change in the meters rather than give it to panhandlers. The change deposited in the meters will help agencies that assist the homeless.

The city is “trying to make downtown safer for residents.” He says customers who want to help the homeless still can, “and they’ll feel more comfortable coming to the Post Office.”

What a great idea!

streetsabby wrote:

Watcher wrote:Wilmington, NC, implemented the city’s first “Make a Change” meter, recently installed near the city’s main Post Office.

The program is Wilmington’s “Ten Year Plan to End Chronic Homelessness and Reduce Homelessness” in North Carolina’s Cape Fear region.

The area around the main Post Office is one of 11 downtown locations where panhandling is prevalent. The city has installed the black-and-yellow meters to encourage residents to put their spare change in the meters rather than give it to panhandlers. The change deposited in the meters will help agencies that assist the homeless.

The city is “trying to make downtown safer for residents.” He says customers who want to help the homeless still can, “and they’ll feel more comfortable coming to the Post Office.”

What a great idea!

Don't we already have this in the CWE?

Yes, we do. They call it "Real Change" here.

MattnSTL wrote:Yes, we do. They call it "Real Change" here.

I have seen signs posted in the CWE. Do they also have meters set up? How does "Real Change" work? Maybe that's something we could try to do Downtown?

streetsabby wrote:

MattnSTL wrote:Yes, we do. They call it "Real Change" here.

I have seen signs posted in the CWE. Do they also have meters set up? How does "Real Change" work? Maybe that's something we could try to do Downtown?

Thanks for the idea! Please contribute to the convo here: http://www.facebook.com/pages/Saint-Lou ... 298?ref=mf