urbanSTL

If you care about the passage of this bill (or any other), you should ask if your alderperson is supporting it.

innov8ion wrote:
That's not what I said in the least, bprop.

Sorry, I misunderstood your comment about him expanding his viewer base in order to collect donation checks.

Ask yourself why he's been veritably black-listed in the homeless services arena.

Now talk about a pretty crummy club to belong to. What does this mean? That homeless people are staying away from NLEC? Seriously, I don't know. Are St. Patricks Center and others publicly denouncing Rice's efforts? I don't stay on top of it enough to know.

What kind of environment does he provide when two homeless men are murdered at his establishments in the same quarter? Shouldn't he be concerned with providing security for the homeless at his establishments? His missteps have gone too far and now the homeless are suffering from his own hands. Enough is enough.

.

All well and good, but I was responding to the attacks on Rice based on his motives. Call them misguided, I agree with you. Call them enabling the problem, I agree with you. But call them self-centered and self-aggrandizing for his own, and it just doesn't add up.

bprop wrote:

Ask yourself why he's been veritably black-listed in the homeless services arena.

Now talk about a pretty crummy club to belong to. What does this mean? That homeless people are staying away from NLEC? Seriously, I don't know. Are St. Patricks Center and others publicly denouncing Rice's efforts? I don't stay on top of it enough to know.

One must be careful in addressing this situation, because at the end of the day he still is supplying beds. That's why I think it's critical for a similar supply of beds to be created in the area by a competing service. And, I wouldn't say another homeless service would publicly denounce his efforts. I think "distance" is more apt.

bprop wrote:

What kind of environment does he provide when two homeless men are murdered at his establishments in the same quarter? Shouldn't he be concerned with providing security for the homeless at his establishments? His missteps have gone too far and now the homeless are suffering from his own hands. Enough is enough.

All well and good, but I was responding to the attacks on Rice based on his motives. Call them misguided, I agree with you. Call them enabling the problem, I agree with you. But call them self-centered and self-aggrandizing for his own, and it just doesn't add up.

If you agree his motives may be misguided, in what ways? No, I'm not implying his motives are to increase his personal wealth. Put simply, the desires to increase the power of his crusade come at the expense of the homeless themselves. I won't go into examples right now as they've been hashed over but I consider that to be both self-centered and self-aggrandizing. Does that makes sense?

TheWayoftheArch wrote:Now about enforcing it...



Collecting Fines from beggars is hysterical.

Here is how you do it.

Employ them to beg at min wage. Then take the "rake" from them as a fine. That will regulate the begging industry, as well as create an extra revenue stream for the city. I think collectively, we can make this work.

Aldermen OK panhandling bill.



http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument

^Does the bill exclude alderpersons?

this is a response from an Alderman.





All in All, Email the Mayor's office.





"I believe there are many interested parties who would like Larry Rice to move and may perhaps may be trying to create some incentive for him to do so. At this time, I am not aware of Mr. Rice's interest to do so. I have been encouraging the Mayor's office to put forth some plan that would be beneficial for all parties, as Rev. Rice does provide a service to the city and to the homeless population but probably not in the most efficient way, as the newer models of homelessness address permanent housing (as opposed to the warehousing/one night shelter stays etc which occurs through NLEC.)



Just as you have sent me this email, I encourage you to also send an email and/or letter to the Mayors office about your concern with the NLEC building. I am the recipient of numerous emails/calls about this building but it is important that the Mayors office recv these calls as well, as he has the ultimately authority to enforce code violations on the NLEC building and facilitate/expedite a legitimate move of the NLEC building.



Should you have any questions just let me know.



Thank you for contacting me."

The more Citizen's Service Bureau complaints, the more ammunition there is. Complain here: http://stlcin.missouri.org/csb/



And to email the Mayor: http://stlcin.missouri.org/index/contactelect.cfm?ID=1

It's sad that people who aren't in the "know" still think Larry Rice is essentially helping these people. In fact, he's created a flophouse that does little but exploit these people for LR's own personal gain, power, visibility, etc. This "center" is a HUGE albatross around the neck of downtowns revival, especially near Locust/14th/Washington.

Yea, the first things I think of when I see Larry Rice are power and personal gain.



For those of us not "in the know", which other, more desirable places can chronically homeless, mentally unstable individuals -- particularly men -- go to spend the night and get long-term help as well? Harbor Light? Sunshine?

Rice is a very wealthy televangelist. His "center" provides a 3rd world-like bare minimum form of shelter while he rakes in millions.



I don't know what the answer is to helping the chronic homeless, but Larry Rice does little but profit from them. I'm sure other facilities could handle the 60 or so people he allows to sleep there every night.

Just to piss you guys off, I gave a guy on DeBaliviere 75 cents.

AvantStL wrote:Rice is a very wealthy televangelist. His "center" provides a 3rd world-like bare minimum form of shelter while he rakes in millions.



I don't know what the answer is to helping the chronic homeless, but Larry Rice does little but profit from them. I'm sure other facilities could handle the 60 or so people he allows to sleep there every night.

What does he do with his untold millions? Can you prove your claims of Rice's personal wealth? Because you said he rakes in millions, I assume you mean he lives in the lap of luxury. Seriously? Have you seen the guy?



And why are you so sure that the residents of his third-world flophouse could easily be absorbed into somewhere else? Why don't you think the people who sleep in such dire conditions haven't gone to the brighter, better centers of which you speak? (P.S. his shelter sleeps 110+ men and 75 women, not "60 or so people". Sixty is more people than available beds for men in any other shelter in St. Louis except Harbor Light).



Sounds like you're doing a whole lot of speculation based in your own distaste of Larry Rice. Again, I just don't understand why people so tightly couple their distaste of Rice's approach with personal vitriol against his motives and lifestyle.

We often talk about St. Patrick Center's efforts. Read about Places for People: http://www.placesforpeople.org/homeless.html

It sounds like a wonderful organization.

Places for People also offers a facility that provides immediate housing options for homeless individuals that enter our program. Approximately 12 people a year go through the emergency apartments.

and

In 2004, PfP opened CJ’s Place to offer safe housing for people who have been struggling with chronic homelessness and untreated mental illness, addiction disorders and/or HIV/AIDS. The building houses 18 single-unit apartments with a combined living room/bedroom and a private kitchen and bath. Laundry facilities are also available on-site.

As great as St. Patrick's Center is, they don't run a homeless shelter, do they?

Somewhat interesting article. Specifically, regarding the parallels between Atlanta's shelter on Peachtree Street and NLEC. And additionally, the technology utilized to disperse drug dealers and prostitutes from gathering outside an individual's bar.



Ref: http://www.latimes.com/technology/la-na ... 9185.story

Bum Stories:

The Gay Out-Of-Towner and the Pizza Girl



This last winter, I was walking into my building along Wash Ave, near some of the bars, when a man walked up to ask if he could tell me his story, in that quick way to grab your attention like a sleazed-out car salesman uses, and in doing so panhandle. Oh crap, here we go.



Dressed in clean clothes, and in an effeminately airy voice with mostly proper care for the English language, he begins:



1. He told me that he just got into Saint Louis, but he has no place to stay.

2. He told me that he is HIV Positive.

3. He told me that he doesn’t have a picture ID, which is keeping him out of the shelter.

4. He asked me to give him money so he could get a place to stay.

5. He didn’t know where the shelters were, and he didn't care to, but could I spare a couple dollars?



Right about that time, a woman approaches delivering a pizza to my neighbor. She starts shouting at me, “Don’t give that man any money! Don’t anybody give him money! He’s just a bum begging! Me? I’m poor, I’ve got three kids to take care of, and I’m on my own, but I’m working for my money, I’ve got a job, delivering pizzas. And him? He’s just a bum! Get out of here!”



He sheepishly walked away, backwards, west on Washington, and she delivered her pizza. I almost left her a tip, not out of any pity or empathy, but out of respect.

Bum Stories:

Chicago



When I lived in Chicago, a bum out in front of my apartment tried to steal my pizza... He approached the pizza dude and said that he was the one that ordered it. He even tried to sign for it and everything... Of course the pizza dude caught on..... The next day I was walking down the sidewalk and the neighbor politely asked, "Do you know anything about the naked dude hanging upside down on the back fence?" That same guy was hanging upside down on a fence with his pants around his ankles, completly exposed.... Apparently he had tried to climb over and his pants got caught and he couldn't get himself down..... The cops assisted him at that point.



Edit: pt. 2... Upon my parents first visit to Chicago, I took them downtown via the Redline.... Not 5 minutes into the train ride, a drunk bum comes walkin up the center aisle hitting everyone over the head with a newspaper until he exited

Gone Corporate wrote:I almost left her a tip, not out of any pity or empathy, but out of respect.

I liked your story.

^^^^



But it wasn't his pizza.

^^I'm insulted you enjoyed his story. Next stop insult thread.

What are you guys talking about?