urbanSTL

chaifetz10 wrote:I'm all for making a major SLU campus and growing it to strengthen Midtown, I just want to see what they have planned!

This future plan for the Grand Avenue corridor comes from a well-placed source:




-RBB

^ no fountain?

Roger Wyoming wrote:^ no fountain?

The Billiken statue will be replaced with a fountain at some point in the future in order to preserve green space.

EDIT - Oh, and thanks for the Tweet - I'm flattered.

-RBB

Alex Ihnen wrote:^^ I'm not so sure you can fault WU for its 1892 decision to find a new location for the campus. It's move wasn't a detriment to the city in nearly the way we think of today. The City of St. Louis flourished for another six decades. The school wasn't fleeing a dying city in order to save itself. It's also kept its medical campus firmly in the city.

The one that kind of bums me out is Maryville, which was originally located on the south side until the 1960s. It would be great to still have Maryville in the city.

Sorry, it's a long one.

RobbyD wrote:But move far out it did none the less...I would imagine that the schools location in the late 19th century was decidedly unurban

Both universities moved from downtown to more suburban locations; both campuses were, at the time the universities moved, in relatively sparsely populated parts of town. But what happened in the late 1800s isn't really relevant to the current situation. The urban environment around the schools was not a factor in either decision; schools looking to expand move where there is space and cheap land (or where a big chunk of land was donated to them) for them to do so.

RobbyD wrote:and that SLU has not fled should give it much credit...not a free pass to do whatever it wants, but let's not lose sight of the clear commitment to the city of st Louis SLU has made

The issue in question is also not SLU's or Wash U's commitment to St. Louis. Realistically, they are both reasonably large institutions who have significant investments in their current locations. These are highly specialized campuses, and it would be much harder and more expensive for either one to pack up and build new large hospitals, research buildings, etc.than it would be for a law firm to move into a new tower. It's good that they're in St. Louis still and are planning to expand within St. Louis, but let's not go overboard in our praise, or bend too far backwards to "keep them in the city."

RobbyD wrote:but a strong Catholic institution that hasn't bolted the city for greener pastures (Wash U) or lost its identity (USC) should benefit all St Louisans whether Catholic, Christian, or Magic-Plate-of-Spaghettians and their neighborhoods...

Not sure how religion got into this topic. For the purpose of the demolition of the Pevely complex, and the larger topic of SLU's campus planning, why is Catholicism relevant?

RobbyD wrote:I'm quite certain that SLU doesn't have it out for St. Louis...It may just be a function of funding and ability to spit into the wind of a what has been a dramatically declining urban scene over the past 50 years...

I, and probably most people on this thread when they stop to think about it, agree that SLU is a valuable asset to St. Louis and that SLU does not want to intentionally do something to harm St. Louis. That doesn't mean that when they propose to do something that you think will be detrimental to the larger environment, you should allow them to do so or let it pass. As far as funding goes, while SLU may not be as wealthy as WashU in terms of their endowment, neither university is struggling much (especially the medical end of things), and campus expansion is not something a university does if its lacking funding.

While some of the areas around WashU are currently nice, the Loop, Central West End, and Forest Park Southeast have all seen periods of significant decline. I wasn't here for the resurgence of the Loop and CWE (I've heard that for the CWE Wash U played a minor role in the redevelopment by funding various organizations and security initiatives), but for FPSE I think you can credit a lot of the last ten years of improvement to Wash U investing in the neighborhood. Not just in terms of sponsoring events, funding small local redevelopment agencies, and paying for additional security, but in literally paying employees (and formerly students) to buy houses there. They do that partially out of selfish reasons: the better the area around the campus is, the better the school looks, but regardless of the motivation it's a much better idea than demolishing the residential areas near your campus, or buying up land/properties to avoid them causing trouble, then spreading out your campus thinly to cover the space you have. I don't want to make Wash U out to be an angel, they have many instances of questionable demolitions (the old Stix school comes to mind) and poor planning (too many parking garages clustered on Taylor have turned Taylor into an alley, reflexive street closing, etc.), but they seem to have realized that investing in their neighborhoods and involving the community in the planning process (for the med school at least) are important things to do.

rbeedee wrote: Not just in terms of sponsoring events, funding small local redevelopment agencies, and paying for additional security, but in literally paying employees (and formerly students) to buy houses there. They do that partially out of selfish reasons: the better the area around the campus is, the better the school looks, but regardless of the motivation it's a much better idea than demolishing the residential

SLU actually does this too, to the tune of up to $10,000 in forgivable loans (or something like that. I'd have to check the numbers). Of course, apart from the Gate, there's almost no neighborhood left adjacent to SLU.

^2900 Meramec, which subsequently became Augustinian Academy.

And if you really want to tilt at windmills, you could also wish that Principia was still up on Page.

I am surprised that this hasn't gained the attention the Del Taco building did this summer. No Facebook page or anything to protest demo.

^Yes, there is a Facebook page, and they're up to 500 friends.

http://www.facebook.com/SavePevely

Doesn't SLU offer a Master or Arts in Urban Planning and Real Estate Development?

From their website:

The mission of the Urban Planning and Real Estate Development program is to provide a center for education, community dialogue, and research to support urban growth and revitalization in the St. Louis region and globally.

Why can't SLU consult this group about what makes for a successful, urban campus?

RobbyD, yes SLU does have substantial real estate development staff. I think the issue largely comes down to an aesthetic taste more than anything else; Biondi and SLU leadership have not joined the movement of urban campuses across the country in recent decades to physically embrace and integrate themselves into the urban form and community, SLU continues with the older aesthetic idea of campus as an island of green space and escape from the urban form... of course, the very term campus supported this classical vision, but unfortunately it is one that doesn't work very well for urban campuses. Biondi is more into fields and fountains than a well-executed building anchoring key intersections, e.g.

olvidarte wrote:Doesn't SLU offer a Master or Arts in Urban Planning and Real Estate Development?

From their website:

The mission of the Urban Planning and Real Estate Development program is to provide a center for education, community dialogue, and research to support urban growth and revitalization in the St. Louis region and globally.

Why can't SLU consult this group about what makes for a successful, urban campus?

That would make sense... But what makes sense doesn't often happen.

Roger Wyoming wrote:Biondi and SLU leadership have not joined the movement of urban campuses across the country in recent decades to physically embrace and integrate themselves into the urban form and community, SLU continues with the older aesthetic idea of campus as an island of green space and escape from the urban form... of course, the very term campus supported this classical vision, but unfortunately it is one that doesn't work very well for urban campuses. Biondi is more into fields and fountains than a well-executed building anchoring key intersections, e.g.

My email to Fr. Biondi focused primarily on this subject of integration with the surrounding community. A week has passed with no response. Maybe he's thinking...

Mayor Slay tweets:

The city's Cultural Resources Office will not approve an application to demolition the Pevely complex.

SLU can appeal that decision to the Preservation Board.