Certainly leaves some options for the Pine/20th/Olive/22nd block.chriss752 wrote: Yellow is the stadium.
Green is parking garage.
Blue is a retail development
Red is Clark Street connection.
This drawing was sent to me by someone familiar with the plans.
![]()
Well its not the site plan it is someones 1 minute scribble based on what they think or remember the site plan to be - we won't know till Tuesday or whenever they feel the plan is ready to be presented.urbanitas wrote: That stadium site plan has to be very preliminary, because little about that would make sense.
By the way, those ramps in 22nd Street Interchange Valley are still in use are they not? They were as of early this year, and I don't recall seeing any ramp closures last time I went by. I know that a 2-year LCRA purchase option for 30 acres of MODOT property was discussed a few years ago, but I don't think the agreement was ever finalized, and would have expired by now anyway.
A north-of-Market stadium site could allow for construction to begin without any immediate need for MODOT property, so I thought that might be what was driving the new location, but an east-west pitch orientation, parallel to Market, would preclude that possibility.
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#MLS4TheLou to make ‘special announcement’ with city leaders on Aug. 20
St. Louis Mayor Lyda Krewson, President of the Board of Aldermen Lewis Reed and additional guests will make a ‘special announcement’ at 11:30 a.m. on Aug. 20.
Author: Ashley Cole, Frank Cusumano
Published: 9:32 AM CDT August 15, 2019
Updated: 11:58 AM CDT August 15, 2019
ST. LOUIS — #MLS4TheLou, the group working to bring an MLS team to St. Louis will be joined by city leaders for an announcement on Aug. 20.
St. Louis Mayor Lyda Krewson, President of the Board of Aldermen Lewis Reed and additional guests will make a ‘special announcement’ at 11:30 a.m. on Aug. 20.
^^^UPDATE: Hearing the announcement is by invitation only, at the Palladium. The Happy Hour event, as previously posted, is at Urban Chestnut, is free and open to the public. MLS4thelou would like an idea of how many people are coming. RSVP at mls4thelou.com with your name and email.
They're expected to announce an MLS team is coming to St. Louis.
Jim Kavanaugh, one of the owners of the St. Louis group, wrote to 5 On Your Side Sports Director Frank Cusumano in a text, “All is good and moving forward. Still waiting on some final pieces from MLS.”
The team would begin play in the Spring of the 2022 season. The #MLS4TheLou group did their final presentation to the board of governors earlier this month. Kavanaugh said it lasted 45 minutes and everybody was impressed.
The MLS believes St. Louis has all the boxes checked. The group’s biggest strength is local ownership with Kavanaugh, the CEO of World Wide Technology and Carolyn Kindle Betz, the president of Enterprise Holdings Foundation.
The soccer history of our town and the plans for the quarter of a billion-dollar 25,000 seat state of the art stadium were also well received. When the announcement is made next week, details on stadium sponsorship, team names and colors could be released.
The team president could also be announced. Dan Flynn, who is the CEO, of the United States Soccer Federation, is a strong candidate. Flynn, who is from St. Louis, is highly respected in soccer circles around the country.
https://www.ksdk.com/article/sports/mls ... hPz4cn0Ai0
St. Louis Mayor Lyda Krewson, President of the Board of Aldermen Lewis Reed and additional guests will make a ‘special announcement’ at 11:30 a.m. on Aug. 20.
Author: Ashley Cole, Frank Cusumano
Published: 9:32 AM CDT August 15, 2019
Updated: 11:58 AM CDT August 15, 2019
ST. LOUIS — #MLS4TheLou, the group working to bring an MLS team to St. Louis will be joined by city leaders for an announcement on Aug. 20.
St. Louis Mayor Lyda Krewson, President of the Board of Aldermen Lewis Reed and additional guests will make a ‘special announcement’ at 11:30 a.m. on Aug. 20.
^^^UPDATE: Hearing the announcement is by invitation only, at the Palladium. The Happy Hour event, as previously posted, is at Urban Chestnut, is free and open to the public. MLS4thelou would like an idea of how many people are coming. RSVP at mls4thelou.com with your name and email.
They're expected to announce an MLS team is coming to St. Louis.
Jim Kavanaugh, one of the owners of the St. Louis group, wrote to 5 On Your Side Sports Director Frank Cusumano in a text, “All is good and moving forward. Still waiting on some final pieces from MLS.”
The team would begin play in the Spring of the 2022 season. The #MLS4TheLou group did their final presentation to the board of governors earlier this month. Kavanaugh said it lasted 45 minutes and everybody was impressed.
The MLS believes St. Louis has all the boxes checked. The group’s biggest strength is local ownership with Kavanaugh, the CEO of World Wide Technology and Carolyn Kindle Betz, the president of Enterprise Holdings Foundation.
The soccer history of our town and the plans for the quarter of a billion-dollar 25,000 seat state of the art stadium were also well received. When the announcement is made next week, details on stadium sponsorship, team names and colors could be released.
The team president could also be announced. Dan Flynn, who is the CEO, of the United States Soccer Federation, is a strong candidate. Flynn, who is from St. Louis, is highly respected in soccer circles around the country.
https://www.ksdk.com/article/sports/mls ... hPz4cn0Ai0
They would have to move on property acquisition and site preparation pretty quickly to have this stadium open by March 2022, but I suppose they could play out in Fenton for part of the first season.
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The whole project itself is reported to cost upwards to $650 million. If the stadium only takes $250 million of that, that still leaves $400 million which certainly won't all be spent on the thin retail section shown on the map made by Chris. Some other developments must be included in the master plan that are still being negotiated. Hopefully urban conscious low/ mid-rise apartments with lots of ground-level retail. Possibly a high-rise? $400 million is a lot of money believe it or not.frequentflyer wrote: The soccer history of our town and the plans for the quarter of a billion-dollar 25,000 seat state of the art stadium were also well received. When the announcement is made next week, details on stadium sponsorship, team names and colors could be released.
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I got too excited and didn't think about that. I was told there was supposed to be a district and what I envisioned is much different than two thin strips of retail. Hopefully, there's more. I like the move to the new lot though!urbanitas wrote: ^That probably includes the franchise fee.
^ We all need to admit to ourselves that Soccer Village is coming in one form or another and the city will be giving up a chunk of real estate South of Market that they will get from the state. The other reality we need to admit too. Franchises want the to keep parking revenue in house so no one should be surprised at a new parking garage when you see a sea of surface already existing. For better or for worse I think it is the trade off that they need to make for ownership group to finance the stadium and bring MLS to come to downtown St. Louis. Real Estate is the one place where owner can get return on investment. Ticket fees are certainly not going to cover the players, employees, stadium and +200 million franchise fee when it all said and done.
What they come up with for Soccer Village will be interesting and the reality is that it will take a lot time. BPV is next to a storied very valuable franchise that draws +3 million people a year and even then it has taken a good deal of time just to get to BPV phase II. Maybe Enterprise and WWT entertaining some future expansion plans into Soccer Village as a way to kick off some office build out/component even though I would love to see Cupples X and Two Cardinal Way/a second BPV officer tower get built first before another big competing development is underway downtown.
What they come up with for Soccer Village will be interesting and the reality is that it will take a lot time. BPV is next to a storied very valuable franchise that draws +3 million people a year and even then it has taken a good deal of time just to get to BPV phase II. Maybe Enterprise and WWT entertaining some future expansion plans into Soccer Village as a way to kick off some office build out/component even though I would love to see Cupples X and Two Cardinal Way/a second BPV officer tower get built first before another big competing development is underway downtown.
Every currently-empty retail space and Build-a-Ble spot under and south of the trainshed at Union Station had better be full before the city even thinks about giving incentives for more retail construction to the west. Otherwise, it's just the same mistake all over again.
By the way, those new, one-story retail strips west of Union Station that we are talking about would be 20 feet below Market Street at the north end of the strip.
By the way, those new, one-story retail strips west of Union Station that we are talking about would be 20 feet below Market Street at the north end of the strip.
Rumors!! So fun.
I'd think what we can expect is a stadium and, as dredger pointed out, some revenue maximizing parking concept.
Maybe villages, districts, retail strips, multi-use and/or entirely new neighborhoods are part of some grand vision, but if a team is going to be playing footy on Market Street in 2022 it seems those projects will be secondary to getting people parked and in seats with beers in their hands.
I'd think what we can expect is a stadium and, as dredger pointed out, some revenue maximizing parking concept.
Maybe villages, districts, retail strips, multi-use and/or entirely new neighborhoods are part of some grand vision, but if a team is going to be playing footy on Market Street in 2022 it seems those projects will be secondary to getting people parked and in seats with beers in their hands.
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So i can definitely see speed of land acquisition being a motivating factor in the choice to go North of Market. I was wondering how they work with Drury and Fairfield to find a workable solution for a new stadium. A couple things confuse me a bit.
The site seems a bit narrow. It is approximately 75 ft narrower than BBVA Compass in Houston. I can't see them closing Pine St. but its kind of hard to imagine squeezing something in that width. It would be tight...
The east west orientation is surprising. Sun in the goalies eyes seems like it would be a big negative.
The land that is currently Aloe Plaza West Extension is city owned park property. Will this have to put before voters. Will they do a land exchange and add green space somewhere else. If so where...?
The strip mall of blue above is horrible. I hope that is not really what they are proposing. Any redevelopment should have a significant residential component.
The site seems a bit narrow. It is approximately 75 ft narrower than BBVA Compass in Houston. I can't see them closing Pine St. but its kind of hard to imagine squeezing something in that width. It would be tight...
The east west orientation is surprising. Sun in the goalies eyes seems like it would be a big negative.
The land that is currently Aloe Plaza West Extension is city owned park property. Will this have to put before voters. Will they do a land exchange and add green space somewhere else. If so where...?
The strip mall of blue above is horrible. I hope that is not really what they are proposing. Any redevelopment should have a significant residential component.
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BenFred updated article
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Ben Frederickson
You can celebrate, St. Louis.
Raise a glass.
In fact, it's encouraged.
After Major League Soccer officially announces St. Louis as an expansion city during Tuesday's festivities at The Palladium, fans can toast the effort that made it happen during a happy hour with the MLS4TheLou ownership group at Urban Chestnut in The Grove. The attendance of "special guests" are emphasized for both events. Beer won't be required to catch a buzz.
The ownership group's Thursday announcement of the Tuesday morning event and subsequent happy hour confirmed what the Post-Dispatch reported Wednesday. MLS is coming to town to plant its expansion flag beneath The Arch. More than 10 months of the ownership group's dogged work paid off. Cheers are in order.
This city's effort to secure an MLS expansion team has experienced ups and downs for years. They always ended on a down. But none of the previous attempts were better prepared to finally pull it off than this ownership group. In multiple meetings and presentations to MLS decision-makers, the group presented a plan that offered a primarily privately funded stadium in the downtown setting MLS desires, a locally-sourced ownership group with deep pockets and a refreshing, progressive approach that offered the league its first female majority owned team, and a prime opportunity to capture the soccer-rich St. Louis market after the NFL left town.
If MLS was serious about adding St. Louis to its roster, it was not going to find a better team than Carolyn Kindle Betz, Jim Kavanaugh and their crew. MLS commissioner Don Garber took his time. He did his due diligence. His questions and concerns were answered, one after another.
Fans did their part, too. They clamored for a team. They bought scarves and hats to show their support, raising an impressive amount of money for inner-city soccer programs in the process.
The St. Louis business community wowed Garber during his visit, calming any uncertainty he had about sponsorship with a show of force. If he was impressed then, wait until the energy he feels Tuesday. Wait until he feels the rush of game No. 1 in 2022. Tuesday is another step toward it. A big one. It's a milestone worth celebrating. Just don't mistake it for a finish line.
There are some items on the agenda that will need to be finalized before the St. Louis MLS team — no word yet on the name — begins play.
• Stadium financing. This is the big one. The city Board of Aldermen passed a Major League Soccer tax incentive plan in November 2018. That was an important hurdle cleared for the ownership group, especially when the proposal passed by vote of 26-2. The resolution set a framework of expectations for the agreements that would need to be finalized if MLS awarded an expansion team.
Now that MLS is awarding that team, the finalization of a financial package must occur. Alderman Joseph Vollmer said in November that St. Louis had to "woo" MLS before it does anything else. You might remember his quote. “Once you get married, things change," said Vollmer, who represents the 10th Ward. "Let’s get married, then the fighting starts." Avoiding fighting during the completion of the stadium financing's fine details will be a goal of the ownership group moving forward.
The positive reaction to the previous proposal and the comfort MLS has in announcing the expansion team now points toward a prediction of relatively smooth sailing. Laws required to secure tax incentives for the ownership group would require the board to vote, Mayor Lyda Krewson said in November. Mayor Krewson and Aldermanic President Lewis Reed have both been outspoken supporters of the ownership group. Both are schedule to attend Tuesday's announcement.
• Stadium details. So far, the public has only viewed the stadium renderings released in April. Those images of the 22,000-seat venue were described by the ownership group as conceptual. It's natural for conceptual designs to go through certain tweaks before plans become construction. Before the cranes get to work, the land has to pass through the right hoops to make building possible. The stadium and team uniform also need sponsors. The ownership group has fish on those lines. Time to reel them in.
• Team details. This is the fun one. Name. Colors. (I don't mind St. Louis United, but I would not put money on that option. (My Edit: Heard the team WON'T be called St. Louis FC or St. Louis United <<< MLS doesn't want this) Branding is just the beginning. Now that the ownership group has a commitment from MLS, it can begin to move forward on the soccer operations side. President, general manager, coach. All of the above.
It will be interesting to see if retiring United States Soccer Federation CEO Dan Flynn takes on some sort of role. He has been advising the ownership group in an unofficial capacity.
And what happens to St. Louis' United Soccer League team? Kavanaugh is an owner of St. Louis FC. Sometimes, MLS expansion teams treat their new team like a graduation of their USL team. Sometimes not. The answer does not need to cater to the established St. Louis FC fan base, but alienating it should be avoided if possible.
More will become known Tuesday. It's a party. Then, it's time to finish.
https://www.stltoday.com/sports/columns ... Dh0fUqKY#1
^^^ Video included in linked article.
Ben Frederickson
You can celebrate, St. Louis.
Raise a glass.
In fact, it's encouraged.
After Major League Soccer officially announces St. Louis as an expansion city during Tuesday's festivities at The Palladium, fans can toast the effort that made it happen during a happy hour with the MLS4TheLou ownership group at Urban Chestnut in The Grove. The attendance of "special guests" are emphasized for both events. Beer won't be required to catch a buzz.
The ownership group's Thursday announcement of the Tuesday morning event and subsequent happy hour confirmed what the Post-Dispatch reported Wednesday. MLS is coming to town to plant its expansion flag beneath The Arch. More than 10 months of the ownership group's dogged work paid off. Cheers are in order.
This city's effort to secure an MLS expansion team has experienced ups and downs for years. They always ended on a down. But none of the previous attempts were better prepared to finally pull it off than this ownership group. In multiple meetings and presentations to MLS decision-makers, the group presented a plan that offered a primarily privately funded stadium in the downtown setting MLS desires, a locally-sourced ownership group with deep pockets and a refreshing, progressive approach that offered the league its first female majority owned team, and a prime opportunity to capture the soccer-rich St. Louis market after the NFL left town.
If MLS was serious about adding St. Louis to its roster, it was not going to find a better team than Carolyn Kindle Betz, Jim Kavanaugh and their crew. MLS commissioner Don Garber took his time. He did his due diligence. His questions and concerns were answered, one after another.
Fans did their part, too. They clamored for a team. They bought scarves and hats to show their support, raising an impressive amount of money for inner-city soccer programs in the process.
The St. Louis business community wowed Garber during his visit, calming any uncertainty he had about sponsorship with a show of force. If he was impressed then, wait until the energy he feels Tuesday. Wait until he feels the rush of game No. 1 in 2022. Tuesday is another step toward it. A big one. It's a milestone worth celebrating. Just don't mistake it for a finish line.
There are some items on the agenda that will need to be finalized before the St. Louis MLS team — no word yet on the name — begins play.
• Stadium financing. This is the big one. The city Board of Aldermen passed a Major League Soccer tax incentive plan in November 2018. That was an important hurdle cleared for the ownership group, especially when the proposal passed by vote of 26-2. The resolution set a framework of expectations for the agreements that would need to be finalized if MLS awarded an expansion team.
Now that MLS is awarding that team, the finalization of a financial package must occur. Alderman Joseph Vollmer said in November that St. Louis had to "woo" MLS before it does anything else. You might remember his quote. “Once you get married, things change," said Vollmer, who represents the 10th Ward. "Let’s get married, then the fighting starts." Avoiding fighting during the completion of the stadium financing's fine details will be a goal of the ownership group moving forward.
The positive reaction to the previous proposal and the comfort MLS has in announcing the expansion team now points toward a prediction of relatively smooth sailing. Laws required to secure tax incentives for the ownership group would require the board to vote, Mayor Lyda Krewson said in November. Mayor Krewson and Aldermanic President Lewis Reed have both been outspoken supporters of the ownership group. Both are schedule to attend Tuesday's announcement.
• Stadium details. So far, the public has only viewed the stadium renderings released in April. Those images of the 22,000-seat venue were described by the ownership group as conceptual. It's natural for conceptual designs to go through certain tweaks before plans become construction. Before the cranes get to work, the land has to pass through the right hoops to make building possible. The stadium and team uniform also need sponsors. The ownership group has fish on those lines. Time to reel them in.
• Team details. This is the fun one. Name. Colors. (I don't mind St. Louis United, but I would not put money on that option. (My Edit: Heard the team WON'T be called St. Louis FC or St. Louis United <<< MLS doesn't want this) Branding is just the beginning. Now that the ownership group has a commitment from MLS, it can begin to move forward on the soccer operations side. President, general manager, coach. All of the above.
It will be interesting to see if retiring United States Soccer Federation CEO Dan Flynn takes on some sort of role. He has been advising the ownership group in an unofficial capacity.
And what happens to St. Louis' United Soccer League team? Kavanaugh is an owner of St. Louis FC. Sometimes, MLS expansion teams treat their new team like a graduation of their USL team. Sometimes not. The answer does not need to cater to the established St. Louis FC fan base, but alienating it should be avoided if possible.
More will become known Tuesday. It's a party. Then, it's time to finish.
https://www.stltoday.com/sports/columns ... Dh0fUqKY#1
^^^ Video included in linked article.
I think the Bi-State Union Station land transfer may have something to do with Pg 88. Nothing exciting.
https://www.bistatedev.org/wp-content/u ... mation.pdf
https://www.bistatedev.org/wp-content/u ... mation.pdf
I’m with you. I feel like a big superblock type development like a stadium is better suited next to the interstate. Then some sort of “village” or residential/office/retail development could fill in the surrounding blocks and weave itself into the downtown fabric.debaliviere wrote: Not sure what I think of having the stadium north of Market.
With the stadium north of Market any new development on reclaimed land after the Jefferson/22nd interchange project is going to have the Union Station superblock to the east, the stadium superblock to the north, the Wells Fargo superblocks to the west and the interstate to the south. Maybe it’s just me, but I feel like that’s pretty isolated. A prime opportunity for a developer to turn it into a parking paradise for the Aquarium and stadium. On top of all that, north of Market is even further from MetroLink (though very much still within walking distance).
I also think potential issues with the sun on an east/west oriented field is a valid concern too.
I’m going to hold out until I see the official plans...but so far I think I’d still rather see it on the land south of Market.
I looked at most of the current MLS stadiums. I didn't see any with an East-West pitch orientation. All are either N-S or NE-SW. A N-S oriented stadium could possibly fit between Olive St. and Aloe Park West, so that could stay (although a lot of police would have to find someplace else to park). But, its only 450' between Market and Pine St., so I don't see how Pine could remain where it is, with any stadium orientation.STLEnginerd wrote: The site seems a bit narrow. It is approximately 75 ft narrower than BBVA Compass in Houston. I can't see them closing Pine St. but its kind of hard to imagine squeezing something in that width. It would be tight...
The east west orientation is surprising. Sun in the goalies eyes seems like it would be a big negative.
The land that is currently Aloe Plaza West Extension is city owned park property. Will this have to put before voters. Will they do a land exchange and add green space somewhere else. If so where...?
A N-S oriented stadium would fit quite nicely between Market St. and the Drury buildings, however, assuming they can acquire and demo that one-story Police Retirement Association office...which is one of many reasons the stadium south of Market makes so much more sense.
I wonder if LHM (Union Station developer) would give up that west parking lot, though. I could see them being very inflexible about that.
- 2,637
They should just build it in Chesterfield! Free Parking! /s
I don’t think the sun is going to be that much of an issue. Downtown steets have a decent NW-SE slant on them.
I play softball at Lyon park and those fields are the worst possible sun field (sun right behind pitcher) and they are about straight W.
I play softball at Lyon park and those fields are the worst possible sun field (sun right behind pitcher) and they are about straight W.
- 337
Definitely a no to this suggestion. LOL. There is free parking at some MetroLink stations and you are always welcome to use them! The stadium built north or south of Market will still be within walking distance from the Union Station stop.GoHarvOrGoHome wrote: They should just build it in Chesterfield! Free Parking! /s
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Oh good, I was hoping it was sarcasm but after reading comments from news articles the past day I was questioning it. Seems like there are some people that actually believe a stadium in the county is a good idea.
- 1,864
if you ever see "/s" after a statement that sounds like someone is trolling, that means' they're identifying their statement as sarcasm.
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Martin Kilcoyne
@martinkilcoyne2
35 mins
Stadium naming rights in #MLS are around $2 million per year, but DC United got $4 million and LA Galaxy is around $7 million.
@DrPatSportsBiz made a good point about STL MLS stadium should have added value with proximity to HWY 64. Good visibility.
@martinkilcoyne2
35 mins
Stadium naming rights in #MLS are around $2 million per year, but DC United got $4 million and LA Galaxy is around $7 million.
@DrPatSportsBiz made a good point about STL MLS stadium should have added value with proximity to HWY 64. Good visibility.
^ Interesting. Thanks. Wonder if the high visibility would overcome the smaller metro area/media market to get you to naming right dollars comparable to larger/bigger media markets? Maybe not as much as will you would ever get for being in LA but maybe gets you to the $4 million DC mark?
But one more reason for my case on why I think south of market site is still better. Closer to the freeway the better the visibility and maybe a few more dollars in the owners pocket.
But one more reason for my case on why I think south of market site is still better. Closer to the freeway the better the visibility and maybe a few more dollars in the owners pocket.
So not to be a downer but did they have to have the event at the exact same time XFL already said they will have theirs at. I would love to be at both but now I'm going to have to choose which teams history I want to be a part of, and I can't make up my mind. If we want to be a productive region, and something as important as two major league sports teams announcing their teams in STL in the SAME year is happening, we have to coordinate better