But Cable TV is a necessity! Who are you to ask them to go without? If rich people have something, why can't poor people have it too?!?migueltejada wrote:In any case - WHY ARE POOR PEOPLE PAYING $40 A MONTH (OR MORE) FOR A LUXURY THEY DON'T NEED AND CAN'T AFFORD?
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It's amazing to me that 98% of this board has spent hours, days, and months in every dangerous, minority-majority neighborhood in the city, talking with residents and touring their homes, and studying their bills.
Random Internet Person #1: That area is dangerous
Random Internet Person #2: Well, 100% of my friends are from that area, and I talk to them daily. And I'm standing on a street corner in said area at this very moment typing this message. So I have a true understanding, whilst you do not.
Random Internet Person #1: That area is dangerous
Random Internet Person #2: Well, 100% of my friends are from that area, and I talk to them daily. And I'm standing on a street corner in said area at this very moment typing this message. So I have a true understanding, whilst you do not.
So is there only security at night? I never see anyone during the day.
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12:12 AM and the helicopter and its searchlight are all over Delmar Station; it's good to know that we have air superiority. 
Oooh; it just shined into the window; lightening.
Oooh; it just shined into the window; lightening.Huge article in this week's Riverfront Times about Metrolink and crime in U City as well at the Galleria.
http://www.riverfronttimes.com/2008-08- ... for-crime/
I find this passage interesting.
G*d f*cking d*mmit that p*sses me off! That sh*t needs to be fixed RIGHT NOW!
http://www.riverfronttimes.com/2008-08- ... for-crime/
I find this passage interesting.
As for the mall's Parental Guidance Required policy, Dorsett says it was designed to create a "family-friendly atmosphere" at the mall, not serve as a crime deterrent. "It lets everyone know the code of conduct we expect of our customers," says Dorsett. "It's not meant to suggest that crime was committed by any particular age group or anything like that."
Try telling that to twelve-year-old Dante and his friends Recee, sixteen, and Unique, nine. On a recent Friday evening the three friends from North St. Louis County are walking through the mall when they're stopped by Galleria security and escorted to the door.
As he leaves the mall property, Dante takes a moment to stomp the life from a begonia plant spouting from the Galleria's manicured flower beds. He hurls a traffic cone into the street and tosses a sandbag from a construction site onto the sidewalk. "I'm angry," concedes Dante. "How are they going to kick me out of the mall? It's racist."
As they wait on the MetroLink platform, a security guard approaches Dante and his friends and asks to see their tickets. Together the three youths can't scrounge up more than the two dollars required for a one-way fare. The guard briefly lectures them about the fines they could face for riding Metro without a valid ticket, but the warnings fail to cause the kids any concern.
State law prohibits Metro from fining anyone under seventeen caught riding the train without a ticket. As the train arrives at the station, Dante and his friends walk past the guard and climb aboard. The doors close, and they're gone.
G*d f*cking d*mmit that p*sses me off! That sh*t needs to be fixed RIGHT NOW!
I don't have the article in front of me, but it did highlight some very important questions in the whole debate.
First, 'projected' crime this year by youths at the Galleria is nearly at the level it was at in 1998. If the Cross-County extension opened up in 2006, what was the cause of the similar crime rate in 1998?
Anecdotal stories point to youths who were "going home" after committing crimes at the Galleria. One of their homes was cited as Jennings (the other was simply "St. Louis City"). As Metrolink doesn't travel to Jennings, how did youth #1 get home, and could Metrolink still be blamed for enabling him to cause trouble at the Galleria?
If it is indeed car-less city and ESL youths causing trouble at the Galleria, how did they get around before Metrolink? The obvious answer is other forms of public transit, such as buses, which have always been available to the Galleria.
Finally, the suggestions that youths who have been kicked out of the Galleria are now converging on the Loop instead, doesn't pass the smell test. The Loop has been accessible to Metrolink (and "the City" and ESL) for fourteen years. It doesn't seem right that these people would go out of their way to get kicked out of the Galleria, only to backtrack to the Loop, when the Loop's been there all along. Unless we're talking Shrewsbury and Maplewood punks (for whom the two are now more immediately accessible), then this accusation doesn't hold water.
First, 'projected' crime this year by youths at the Galleria is nearly at the level it was at in 1998. If the Cross-County extension opened up in 2006, what was the cause of the similar crime rate in 1998?
Anecdotal stories point to youths who were "going home" after committing crimes at the Galleria. One of their homes was cited as Jennings (the other was simply "St. Louis City"). As Metrolink doesn't travel to Jennings, how did youth #1 get home, and could Metrolink still be blamed for enabling him to cause trouble at the Galleria?
If it is indeed car-less city and ESL youths causing trouble at the Galleria, how did they get around before Metrolink? The obvious answer is other forms of public transit, such as buses, which have always been available to the Galleria.
Finally, the suggestions that youths who have been kicked out of the Galleria are now converging on the Loop instead, doesn't pass the smell test. The Loop has been accessible to Metrolink (and "the City" and ESL) for fourteen years. It doesn't seem right that these people would go out of their way to get kicked out of the Galleria, only to backtrack to the Loop, when the Loop's been there all along. Unless we're talking Shrewsbury and Maplewood punks (for whom the two are now more immediately accessible), then this accusation doesn't hold water.
What ticks me off to no end is that kids under 17 are not required to have a ticket. Why does Metro even bother with a childrens' fare?
dweebe wrote:What ticks me off to no end is that kids under 17 are not required to have a ticket. Why does Metro even bother with a childrens' fare?
Although Dante and his boys boarded the train without a ticket, technically it says the state law prevents fining the under-17s. Can they still kick you off, take you to your parent(s), etc? Not that they would, just curious what else is available.
twelve-year-old Dante
As he leaves the mall property, Dante takes a moment to stomp the life from a begonia plant spouting from the Galleria's manicured flower beds. He hurls a traffic cone into the street and tosses a sandbag from a construction site onto the sidewalk. "I'm angry," concedes Dante. "How are they going to kick me out of the mall? It's racist."
Twelve! Somebody needs to be whipped and sent to bed without dinner. If I would have stomped someone's flowers when I was twelve, I would have died.
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jlblues wrote:Me either.u2acro wrote:Sorry. I wouldn't date a guy, live with a guy or marry a guy who carried. It's just not happening.
It's "me neither."
bprop wrote:Anecdotal stories point to youths who were "going home" after committing crimes at the Galleria. One of their homes was cited as Jennings (the other was simply "St. Louis City"). As Metrolink doesn't travel to Jennings, how did youth #1 get home, and could Metrolink still be blamed for enabling him to cause trouble at the Galleria?
Not to nitpick, but the teens they're referring to in that article who were just "going home" weren't stirring up things at the Galleria, they were the ones who were part of the mob that jumped that family at the Metrolink station at Pershing and DeBaliviere.
Prove it.Moorlander wrote:jlblues wrote:Me either.u2acro wrote:Sorry. I wouldn't date a guy, live with a guy or marry a guy who carried. It's just not happening.
It's "me neither."
bsever wrote:
twelve-year-old Dante
As he leaves the mall property, Dante takes a moment to stomp the life from a begonia plant spouting from the Galleria's manicured flower beds. He hurls a traffic cone into the street and tosses a sandbag from a construction site onto the sidewalk. "I'm angry," concedes Dante. "How are they going to kick me out of the mall? It's racist."
Twelve! Somebody needs to be whipped and sent to bed without dinner. If I would have stomped someone's flowers when I was twelve, I would have died.
Only if your parents saw you.
I'm sure you did a lot of things when your parents weren't around that would have gotten you in a lot of trouble if they had seen you do it.
I know I did and so did every one of my friends.
As a 12-year-old, I don't recall having a lot of 16-year-old and 9-year-old friends >insert clever insult here< with whom I hung out in shopping malls. Then again, I don't recall going anyplace when I was 12, that I couldn't reach by bike or on foot, without an adult. I am fairly certain that that was not allowed.
But I guess I don't understand at all. Apparently, it is now considered some great flaw in society that a 12-year-old might be bored during the summer, and think they don't have anything to do!
So, we are now supposed to be understanding when they get in trouble. Ummm, ok.
Whatever happened to sports and other outdoor activities anyway?!? Y'know, a bunch of kids get together and play catch, football, baseball, basketball, army, whatever...what a concept!
But I guess I don't understand at all. Apparently, it is now considered some great flaw in society that a 12-year-old might be bored during the summer, and think they don't have anything to do!
So, we are now supposed to be understanding when they get in trouble. Ummm, ok. Whatever happened to sports and other outdoor activities anyway?!? Y'know, a bunch of kids get together and play catch, football, baseball, basketball, army, whatever...what a concept!
ben1040 wrote:Not to nitpick...
Please don't feel bad. Nitpicking is the glue that keeps this forum together.
Why are we having a lengthy discussion on the city's inability to control crime? Which is really all we're talking about here. Get the cops out there in full force and set a precedent.
On conceal and carry: While I advocate conceal and carry, people who are so-so on the issue should not buy a gun unless they're prepared to shoot someone. If you flash a piece on a gang of "youths and young men" (ha!) they're going to clock you in the head, steal your gun and shoot you in the face with it.
Metro: We'll spend more on security
By Ken Leiser
ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH
08/22/2008
ST. LOUIS - Metro is prepared to spend more than its current $10 million security budget if necessary to prevent future attacks near MetroLink stations, agency officials said today.
Metro President Robert Baer said the transit agency has been cooperating closely with St. Louis and St. Louis County police agencies since two attacks the night of July 26 -- one at the Delmar Loop MetroLink station and the other on the street next to the Forest Park-DeBaliviere station.
"The safety and security of our passengers is our highest priority," Baer told Metro’s governing board. "Not a priority, our highest priority. ... This is not a Metro issue or a city issue or a county issue. It is a community-wide issue."
^But wait, I thought it was just a problem of groups of young kids not having anything to do during the summer. So, the problem should go away now that school is back in session, right? And any additional money spent on security will just be wasted!
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^^ you're assuming these kids are going to actually go back to school .
Fix the schools and you'll fix this problem too bad no ones investing their time and energy in actually doing that. They'd rather just put more guns on the street. Conceal and carry, great idea. You create/promote guns but then you don't want to be shot by them. God Bless America!
. Fix the schools and you'll fix this problem too bad no ones investing their time and energy in actually doing that. They'd rather just put more guns on the street. Conceal and carry, great idea. You create/promote guns but then you don't want to be shot by them. God Bless America!
^ As Al Gore would say.....that is the inconvenient truth, but honestly if the Missouri legislature came out and passed an initiative that would put millions into rebuilding the inner city school systems in St. Louis and Kansas City they would be accused of giving out handouts and reverse racism. Not too many outstaters really want to help the City of St. Louis, Its easier just a lot easier to speed by on the new I-64 and say "man it sure looks dangerous down there" and then get on the Stltoday.com forum and claim that they were mugged last time they were in the city.
On the other hand, I think Metro saying they are putting in extra security is half PR and half because security is lacking, they NEED to pass that tax this Fall and will do what they feel necessary to do it.
On the other hand, I think Metro saying they are putting in extra security is half PR and half because security is lacking, they NEED to pass that tax this Fall and will do what they feel necessary to do it.
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goat314 wrote:^ As Al Gore would say.....that is the inconvenient truth, but honestly if the Missouri legislature came out and passed an initiative that would put millions into rebuilding the inner city school systems in St. Louis and Kansas City they would be accused of giving out handouts and reverse racism. Not too many outstaters really want to help the City of St. Louis, Its easier just a lot easier to speed by on the new I-64 and say "man it sure looks dangerous down there" and then get on the Stltoday.com forum and claim that they were mugged last time they were in the city.
On the other hand, I think Metro saying they are putting in extra security is half PR and half because security is lacking, they NEED to pass that tax this Fall and will do what they feel necessary to do it.
Fear of being accused of reverse racism is enough to deter necessary progress? That's pretty weak if that's the case, which it seems to be.
As for metro I hope they do get their tax passed and I agree I think the whole helicopter and the press conference is nothing more than hoopla to drum up positive PR.
ben1040 wrote:bprop wrote:Anecdotal stories point to youths who were "going home" after committing crimes at the Galleria. One of their homes was cited as Jennings (the other was simply "St. Louis City"). As Metrolink doesn't travel to Jennings, how did youth #1 get home, and could Metrolink still be blamed for enabling him to cause trouble at the Galleria?
Not to nitpick, but the teens they're referring to in that article who were just "going home" weren't stirring up things at the Galleria, they were the ones who were part of the mob that jumped that family at the Metrolink station at Pershing and DeBaliviere.
OK..thanks. It does make my point though. That branch of Metrolink has been there for about fifteen years. Did it take that long to breed the crime that has been recently happening at FP station? And how would they have gotten home to Jennings?
On the way home today, a loud, seemingly unstable guy was walking up and down the aisles, asking to use a phone. He occasionally punctuated this with some rapping and talking to himself. Between Sunnen and Shrewsbury, he pulled out a knife and walked up and down the aisle banging it around on the metal bars. He finally said "OK y'all, time for all y'all to ante up with the money."
We made sure he didn't move from there, and then got the guard a minute later as we pulled into Shrewsbury station. Guards called County cops. A few minutes later, the guy is free to go.
Why even bother?
We made sure he didn't move from there, and then got the guard a minute later as we pulled into Shrewsbury station. Guards called County cops. A few minutes later, the guy is free to go.
Why even bother?
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Call the police. Give a description of the perps and the current location of the train.drunkrusski wrote:What could I as a citizen do to stop this type of activity?
ETA: Ooops! I didn't realize I was answering a 3 year old question.
@bprop...well that's way more intimidating than a bunch of kids cussing in the loop...in my opinion at least.
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How does everyone feel about Metro Link safety? Do you think the platforms and trains need more security or do you think they are adequate? What about the installation of turnstiles? If installed do you think they could be useful in making the system safer? Just wondering.