It’s not a magic bullet in lowering crime but it is a magic bullet in taking all the negative pressure off so that we can focus on growth which itself would help reduce crime.
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^^ Absolutely. And it also allows you to market the city much better/easier for new residents/businesses/etc.
So, turns out this was all a scam on some level.STLrainbow wrote: ↑May 02, 2017Indianapolis got the tech news we've been hoping for as Infosys will be bringing 2,000 tech jobs to the region
Will new tech center land in Indy or Carmel
http://www.indystar.com/story/news/poli ... 101173890/
It appears the India-based company plans on announcing a couple more tech hubs in the US... I'm thinking One ATT Center would be perfect for them!
https://www.axios.com/local/indianapoli ... polis-jobs
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Speaking of Indianapolis, here is a good thread on their sprawl. Unigov in action.
Best States for Working from Home
https://wallethub.com/edu/best-states-for-working-from-home/72801
https://wallethub.com/edu/best-states-for-working-from-home/72801
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https://www.ewgateway.org/research-cent ... -we-stand/
8th edition has many updates in the updates section.
8th edition has many updates in the updates section.
Overall for STL (and the region as a whole), really we are our own worst enemies. We are highly segmented and not unified, so we spend our energy fighting with each other instead of competing with other cities.
We are perfectly situated in the middle of the country for transportation, we have a fair amount of natural beauty with the hills and rivers (and we're the only place in the US with 3 globally known rivers coming together). Blessed with beautiful architecture and world class cultural institutions competitive with America's largest cities, but with a good size: we're small enough to get around easily, yet big enough to have all big city amenities. Yet here we are, afraid to do bold things due to our collective inferiority complex, while squeezing the life out of our heart, our tiny central city. Our crime overall is average, yet we're widely considered America's most dangerous city because our central city contains only the innermost urban core that is high crime in almost every large city. If our central city were average-sized compared to other cities, it would encompass most of the county and have an average crime rate and lower taxes. Instead we fight with each other rather than work together to address our challenges. Our state's TIF and local sales tax structure mean we fight with each other to lavish million dollar incentives on Walmarts.
A good analogy is if we were on the Titanic: the St Louisans would be all standing knee deep in ocean water, fighting with each other over the stale buffet leftovers, completely oblivious of today's reality as the Nashvilles and Minneapolises of the world are helping each other get on the lifeboats to take themselves to a better place.
We need to wake up, quit blaming each other, take advantage of our amazing, under-utilized assets, and move ahead, instead of trying to figure out how to drive forward with our eyes glued to the rearview mirror. We have to stop buying into a false inferiority complex that we'll never again make any progress forward, rather than realizing we could ONCE AGAIN be a dynamic, growing metro area because we have so much going for us. Most fast-growing metro areas today are mid-sized, like us. Many growing places like Minneapolis, Indianapolis, Columbus, OH, etc. certainly don't have better weather than us, nor do they have beaches or mountains. We have to stop assuming we need tropical weather or beaches in order to grow, it's simply not true and is a rather poor excuse we're using to justify the supposedly "safe" choice: doing nothing. Doing nothing is not safe, it only guarantees we'll continue to fall behind everyone else. Too many of us here are content with the status quo, smugly resisting change because their little part of the STL area is "just fine as it is."
But are we really "just find as we are?" Your little street might seem just fine...yet is it? Our children, neighbor friends, invariably move away. Why do we have to assume this is just inevitable. People in other growing metro areas get to enjoy seeing their children become adults staying in town rather than moving away. Isn't this a huge cost for us to bear, seeing our children move away? Meanwhile, businesses serving the locals tread water due to lack of growth, and job opportunities abundant in growing metro areas are absent here. We're all fighting for a piece of a shrinking pie. If the STL area had simply kept all the people we had in 1970, and their children also stayed here, today we'd have 3.2 million instead of 2.8 million people. Those extra 400,000 would fill those empty homes in STL city and the inner suburbs, fixing issues with declining population that about half of STL metro area's cities suffer from. So instead, we make due with it all, just because we'd prefer to cling to the miserable status quo rather than push for real, positive change long ago made in cities that compete with us for our jobs...and competing also for our friends, neighbors and younger family members. It's time, STL. It's time to finally move into the 21st century and into a brighter future! But we have to join together for it to happen. We have to realize the incredible costs we're facing just because we have been more divided than most metro areas. We have to work together: St Charles, STL county, STL city, and Illinois. We all benefit if the area grows once again.
We are perfectly situated in the middle of the country for transportation, we have a fair amount of natural beauty with the hills and rivers (and we're the only place in the US with 3 globally known rivers coming together). Blessed with beautiful architecture and world class cultural institutions competitive with America's largest cities, but with a good size: we're small enough to get around easily, yet big enough to have all big city amenities. Yet here we are, afraid to do bold things due to our collective inferiority complex, while squeezing the life out of our heart, our tiny central city. Our crime overall is average, yet we're widely considered America's most dangerous city because our central city contains only the innermost urban core that is high crime in almost every large city. If our central city were average-sized compared to other cities, it would encompass most of the county and have an average crime rate and lower taxes. Instead we fight with each other rather than work together to address our challenges. Our state's TIF and local sales tax structure mean we fight with each other to lavish million dollar incentives on Walmarts.
A good analogy is if we were on the Titanic: the St Louisans would be all standing knee deep in ocean water, fighting with each other over the stale buffet leftovers, completely oblivious of today's reality as the Nashvilles and Minneapolises of the world are helping each other get on the lifeboats to take themselves to a better place.
We need to wake up, quit blaming each other, take advantage of our amazing, under-utilized assets, and move ahead, instead of trying to figure out how to drive forward with our eyes glued to the rearview mirror. We have to stop buying into a false inferiority complex that we'll never again make any progress forward, rather than realizing we could ONCE AGAIN be a dynamic, growing metro area because we have so much going for us. Most fast-growing metro areas today are mid-sized, like us. Many growing places like Minneapolis, Indianapolis, Columbus, OH, etc. certainly don't have better weather than us, nor do they have beaches or mountains. We have to stop assuming we need tropical weather or beaches in order to grow, it's simply not true and is a rather poor excuse we're using to justify the supposedly "safe" choice: doing nothing. Doing nothing is not safe, it only guarantees we'll continue to fall behind everyone else. Too many of us here are content with the status quo, smugly resisting change because their little part of the STL area is "just fine as it is."
But are we really "just find as we are?" Your little street might seem just fine...yet is it? Our children, neighbor friends, invariably move away. Why do we have to assume this is just inevitable. People in other growing metro areas get to enjoy seeing their children become adults staying in town rather than moving away. Isn't this a huge cost for us to bear, seeing our children move away? Meanwhile, businesses serving the locals tread water due to lack of growth, and job opportunities abundant in growing metro areas are absent here. We're all fighting for a piece of a shrinking pie. If the STL area had simply kept all the people we had in 1970, and their children also stayed here, today we'd have 3.2 million instead of 2.8 million people. Those extra 400,000 would fill those empty homes in STL city and the inner suburbs, fixing issues with declining population that about half of STL metro area's cities suffer from. So instead, we make due with it all, just because we'd prefer to cling to the miserable status quo rather than push for real, positive change long ago made in cities that compete with us for our jobs...and competing also for our friends, neighbors and younger family members. It's time, STL. It's time to finally move into the 21st century and into a brighter future! But we have to join together for it to happen. We have to realize the incredible costs we're facing just because we have been more divided than most metro areas. We have to work together: St Charles, STL county, STL city, and Illinois. We all benefit if the area grows once again.
^Agree 100%.
(although, a few paragraph breaks would make your post easier to read).
(although, a few paragraph breaks would make your post easier to read).
Agreed and fixed! That's what I get for typing my post too late at night!framer wrote: ↑Apr 21, 2023^Agree 100%.
(although, a few paragraph breaks would make your post easier to read).
Certainly crime IS an issue, and it's a self-reinforcing, downward spiral. Perception is reality. People think STL area is high crime, because they see the regular headlines naming us the murder capital. This hurts our perceived appeal, leads to lack of stagnation, which boosts poverty, which further boosts crime. Something major is needed to break out of this vicious cycle. Our metro crime rate is normal. The main problem is geographic: unlike most metro areas, our central city encompasses only the tiny, high-crime urban core all cities have.dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑Oct 01, 2021It’s not a magic bullet in lowering crime but it is a magic bullet in taking all the negative pressure off so that we can focus on growth which itself would help reduce crime.
Those living in the suburbs with jobs think they are just find: but they face income stagnation because the companies serving our stagnant area just tread water. Our children, friends and neighbors move away to greener pastures. Property values are billions below what they should be, which leads the housing stock to rot because people know renovations won't pay off like they do in other cities.
Rather than unite, we've become one of the most urban sprawl-suffering metro areas, leading to unsustainable infrastructure costs we'll pay down the road. We prefer to bulldoze, run away from, or simply ignore our problems. Therefore, we suffer more than we could ever realize, all because, unlike all the other cities competing with us for jobs and growth, we would rather fight with and blame each other than be unified and reap incredible benefits.
St. Louis doesn't have a problem with being a bad place; we have a problem with our divisiveness and narrow minded thinking, which leads to a host of other problems, despite all the wonderful things we have going for us otherwise. We need change, but this wlll be a challenge because St. Louisans don't like change.
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That last part you said about change is so true. I regularly attend meetings for developments, city planning, etc and there’s residents that’s show up just to state “we don’t like change”. It’s complacency at its finest. As that same person will most likely comment on crime a day later.ScottSED wrote:Certainly crime IS an issue, and it's a self-reinforcing, downward spiral. Perception is reality. People think STL area is high crime, because they see the regular headlines naming us the murder capital. This hurts our perceived appeal, leads to lack of stagnation, which boosts poverty, which further boosts crime. Something major is needed to break out of this vicious cycle. Our metro crime rate is normal. The main problem is geographic: unlike most metro areas, our central city encompasses only the tiny, high-crime urban core all cities have.dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑Oct 01, 2021It’s not a magic bullet in lowering crime but it is a magic bullet in taking all the negative pressure off so that we can focus on growth which itself would help reduce crime.
Those living in the suburbs with jobs think they are just find: but they face income stagnation because the companies serving our stagnant area just tread water. Our children, friends and neighbors move away to greener pastures. Property values are billions below what they should be, which leads the housing stock to rot because people know renovations won't pay off like they do in other cities.
Rather than unite, we've become one of the most urban sprawl-suffering metro areas, leading to unsustainable infrastructure costs we'll pay down the road. We prefer to bulldoze, run away from, or simply ignore our problems. Therefore, we suffer more than we could ever realize, all because, unlike all the other cities competing with us for jobs and growth, we would rather fight with and blame each other than be unified and reap incredible benefits.
St. Louis doesn't have a problem with being a bad place; we have a problem with our divisiveness and narrow minded thinking, which leads to a host of other problems, despite all the wonderful things we have going for us otherwise. We need change, but this wlll be a challenge because St. Louisans don't like change.
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I had a thought is that most of the powers that be and large sections of the metro area have been wanting things to largely stay in a 1950s stasis. The differencies in parties in large part was about which parts they wanted to focus on most for staying in the 50s, either in social culture or in employment and job markets.LArchitecture wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023That last part you said about change is so true. I regularly attend meetings for developments, city planning, etc and there’s residents that’s show up just to state “we don’t like change”. It’s complacency at its finest. As that same person will most likely comment on crime a day later.ScottSED wrote:Certainly crime IS an issue, and it's a self-reinforcing, downward spiral. Perception is reality. People think STL area is high crime, because they see the regular headlines naming us the murder capital. This hurts our perceived appeal, leads to lack of stagnation, which boosts poverty, which further boosts crime. Something major is needed to break out of this vicious cycle. Our metro crime rate is normal. The main problem is geographic: unlike most metro areas, our central city encompasses only the tiny, high-crime urban core all cities have.dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑Oct 01, 2021It’s not a magic bullet in lowering crime but it is a magic bullet in taking all the negative pressure off so that we can focus on growth which itself would help reduce crime.
Those living in the suburbs with jobs think they are just find: but they face income stagnation because the companies serving our stagnant area just tread water. Our children, friends and neighbors move away to greener pastures. Property values are billions below what they should be, which leads the housing stock to rot because people know renovations won't pay off like they do in other cities.
Rather than unite, we've become one of the most urban sprawl-suffering metro areas, leading to unsustainable infrastructure costs we'll pay down the road. We prefer to bulldoze, run away from, or simply ignore our problems. Therefore, we suffer more than we could ever realize, all because, unlike all the other cities competing with us for jobs and growth, we would rather fight with and blame each other than be unified and reap incredible benefits.
St. Louis doesn't have a problem with being a bad place; we have a problem with our divisiveness and narrow minded thinking, which leads to a host of other problems, despite all the wonderful things we have going for us otherwise. We need change, but this wlll be a challenge because St. Louisans don't like change.
I would agree with this. When you travel around the country, coming back to St. Louis is like going back atleast 20-30 years in the past.imperialmog wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023I had a thought is that most of the powers that be and large sections of the metro area have been wanting things to largely stay in a 1950s stasis. The differencies in parties in large part was about which parts they wanted to focus on most for staying in the 50s, either in social culture or in employment and job markets.LArchitecture wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023That last part you said about change is so true. I regularly attend meetings for developments, city planning, etc and there’s residents that’s show up just to state “we don’t like change”. It’s complacency at its finest. As that same person will most likely comment on crime a day later.ScottSED wrote: Certainly crime IS an issue, and it's a self-reinforcing, downward spiral. Perception is reality. People think STL area is high crime, because they see the regular headlines naming us the murder capital. This hurts our perceived appeal, leads to lack of stagnation, which boosts poverty, which further boosts crime. Something major is needed to break out of this vicious cycle. Our metro crime rate is normal. The main problem is geographic: unlike most metro areas, our central city encompasses only the tiny, high-crime urban core all cities have.
Those living in the suburbs with jobs think they are just find: but they face income stagnation because the companies serving our stagnant area just tread water. Our children, friends and neighbors move away to greener pastures. Property values are billions below what they should be, which leads the housing stock to rot because people know renovations won't pay off like they do in other cities.
Rather than unite, we've become one of the most urban sprawl-suffering metro areas, leading to unsustainable infrastructure costs we'll pay down the road. We prefer to bulldoze, run away from, or simply ignore our problems. Therefore, we suffer more than we could ever realize, all because, unlike all the other cities competing with us for jobs and growth, we would rather fight with and blame each other than be unified and reap incredible benefits.
St. Louis doesn't have a problem with being a bad place; we have a problem with our divisiveness and narrow minded thinking, which leads to a host of other problems, despite all the wonderful things we have going for us otherwise. We need change, but this wlll be a challenge because St. Louisans don't like change.
pair this with a state government MAGA super majority who literally wants 2023 Missouri to be 1950 Missouri and we have quite a few challenges.goat314 wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023I would agree with this. When you travel around the country, coming back to St. Louis is like going back atleast 20-30 years in the past.imperialmog wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023I had a thought is that most of the powers that be and large sections of the metro area have been wanting things to largely stay in a 1950s stasis. The differencies in parties in large part was about which parts they wanted to focus on most for staying in the 50s, either in social culture or in employment and job markets.LArchitecture wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023That last part you said about change is so true. I regularly attend meetings for developments, city planning, etc and there’s residents that’s show up just to state “we don’t like change”. It’s complacency at its finest. As that same person will most likely comment on crime a day later.
What's sad is that Medicaid Expansion and Legal Marijuana shows that the average Missourian is probably considerably more moderate than their state representative. I don't know what can be done, but something has to change. I was recently in Mississippi and Louisiana. We do not want to be in the same conversation as those two states.soulardx wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023pair this with a state government MAGA super majority who literally wants 2023 Missouri to be 1950 Missouri and we have quite a few challenges.goat314 wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023I would agree with this. When you travel around the country, coming back to St. Louis is like going back atleast 20-30 years in the past.imperialmog wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023I had a thought is that most of the powers that be and large sections of the metro area have been wanting things to largely stay in a 1950s stasis. The differencies in parties in large part was about which parts they wanted to focus on most for staying in the 50s, either in social culture or in employment and job markets.
We played two games on the drive down to Destin;goat314 wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023What's sad is that Medicaid Expansion and Legal Marijuana shows that the average Missourian is probably considerably more moderate than their state representative. I don't know what can be done, but something has to change. I was recently in Mississippi and Louisiana. We do not want to be in the same conversation as those two states.soulardx wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023pair this with a state government MAGA super majority who literally wants 2023 Missouri to be 1950 Missouri and we have quite a few challenges.goat314 wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023
I would agree with this. When you travel around the country, coming back to St. Louis is like going back atleast 20-30 years in the past.
-license plate game
-count the confederate flags in front of people's houses/trailers or on their truck
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I've been on this forum for nearly 20 years. I've also written a couple of articles for this site. I can speak on whatever I'd like.JaneJacobsGhost wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023You are the most useless poster on here. I hope you have a terrible day in the oh-so-advanced city you live in.
going on record - i like, appreciate, agree with and relate to most of Goat's post. Keep em coming!goat314 wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023I've been on this forum for nearly 20 years. I've also written a couple of articles for this site. I can speak on whatever I'd like.JaneJacobsGhost wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023You are the most useless poster on here. I hope you have a terrible day in the oh-so-advanced city you live in.goat314 wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023
I would agree with this. When you travel around the country, coming back to St. Louis is like going back atleast 20-30 years in the past.
I agree. Most Missourians are much more moderate, and the recent lurch to the far right by state Republicans has pushed me out of being a Republican and into the middle where I can’t relate to either party.goat314 wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023What's sad is that Medicaid Expansion and Legal Marijuana shows that the average Missourian is probably considerably more moderate than their state representative. I don't know what can be done, but something has to change. I was recently in Mississippi and Louisiana. We do not want to be in the same conversation as those two states.soulardx wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023pair this with a state government MAGA super majority who literally wants 2023 Missouri to be 1950 Missouri and we have quite a few challenges.goat314 wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023
I would agree with this. When you travel around the country, coming back to St. Louis is like going back atleast 20-30 years in the past.
For what it’s worth, Louisiana has a split government like Kansas. I don’t think they’re anywhere as far right as Missouri or Mississippi. Alabama is pretty up there.
As far as St. Louis goes, it has its challenges to face (both city and state) but it can be attractive as people start to leave the Southwest and coastal areas. Just fix the perception of crime, have decent city services, and invest in the schools and you have a winner. I know, easier said than done but still.
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I love goat’s posts. The intolerance of “other” points on this forum sucks.
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No it didn’t. I’ve called GOAT out in other threads for his trash talk. And I’ll keep doing it when I see it.framer wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023That shot at goat came out of nowhere. Completely uncalled-for.
You typically share his loathsome perspective so I’m not surprised you’re in his corner. Where’s SC4Mayor? I’m sure he’ll back you both up.
And all that you’d like to speak on is how you think St Louis sucks. We really don’t need more clowns like you who hate this place. We already have plenty.goat314 wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023I've been on this forum for nearly 20 years. I've also written a couple of articles for this site. I can speak on whatever I'd like.JaneJacobsGhost wrote: ↑Apr 24, 2023You are the most useless poster on here. I hope you have a terrible day in the oh-so-advanced city you live in.