urbanSTL

Big Shark moved out last week.
$1.9M permit for Delmar Hall approved last Monday

Between the Clayco apartments, Delmar Hall, and a possible Wash. U. reuse of Wabash Station, East Loop is seeing a lot of love these days.

It's not getting them. Just a vision rendering - like the buildings in the background and trolley (which is different from the ones that will actually be put into service).


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The rear of Delmar Hall is gone. Might as well have started over.

Marching, marching, marching east on Delmar. . . Wash U purchased the Wabash Station on Delmar as previously reported in an article on NextSTL. Additionally, Wash U has purchased 5967-5977 Delmar, which are properties east of the Wabash Station. I'm very interested to see Wash U's future development plans for these parcels and other surrounding properties.

I'd expect it to resemble the SD neighborhood and TOD plans.

CWESTL wrote:Marching, marching, marching east on Delmar. . . Wash U purchased the Wabash Station on Delmar as previously reported in an article on NextSTL. Additionally, Wash U has purchased 5967-5977 Delmar, which are properties east of the Wabash Station. I'm very interested to see Wash U's future development plans for these parcels and other surrounding properties.

Hope Wash U isn't going into the land bank business. They seem to be assembling quite a few parcels along or near Delmar as well as their FPSE holdings (which I believe they have it under a different name) and they haven't started on phase II of their loop/grad residence project and the north campus vision seems like a long ways off.

dredger wrote:Hope Wash U isn't going into the land bank business. They seem to be assembling quite a few parcels along or near Delmar as well as their FPSE holdings (which I believe they have it under a different name) and they haven't started on phase II of their loop/grad residence project and the north campus vision seems like a long ways off.

Why not? There's very few institutional players around this metro area with all of the following: 1) the financial capital to make this succeed if they want to, 2) the political capital to make this succeed if they want to, 3) the ideological and political bent to make productive, urban use of these, 4) a self-interest that would be well-served from the successful development of such. WUSTL is trying very hard to become nationally-recognized as an elite university, but they will privately acknowledge that their biggest burden is not the University itself, but the City of St. Louis. This city has a lot of festering problems that make it hard to recruit top students and professors (crime, lack of investment, political nonsense, etc.). Not that New Haven, Ithaca, Hanover NH, or Philadelphia don't have their own share of undesirable traits, but making the Delmar corridor into a world-class area is definitely in their interest.

Like it or not, urban redevelopment is a crucial component of left-wing political power. Urbanized areas create less demand for oil (a major financier of right-wing politics), living in a diverse area makes you less susceptible to dog-whistle politics, the jobs it creates are more likely to be union jobs, and it generally gives more power to Democrats.

This is one of the reasons I was pleasantly surprised to find out that the AFL-CIO is helping finance McKee's redevelopment.

Universities and unions stand to benefit from this increase in power. It's refreshing to see this coalition of special interests actually working together instead of just narrowly focused on themselves.

^ Yes, you can also argue that SLU's land banking south of Hwy 40 around the hospital and medical school hasn't necessarily been gang busters for the city or development or the tax base. No sure on political part, can go there but more inclined to argue if that demand is not there for five years, a decade or longer then is a non-profit institution holding property as if a bank or is tax delinquent property eventually falling into a city supported development agency who should be inclined to find ways to get or sell back into the tax base better situation?
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I certainly understand the Wash U resource part as well as their self interest for a premium neighborhood along with the world class park along with Clayton. But they also develop based on the bottom line and demand. Getting too far ahead of the demand because they can is my point and concern.

Well, the development/demand question is kind of a chicken/egg scenario. Each one creates the other, so which comes first?

Ultimately, it's a collective action problem. Nobody wants to do it unless they know others are on board, because development only really works on a neighborhood level, and generally one developer can't create a neighborhood. The key to breaking the ice on the collective action problem is concrete signals from institutional stakeholders that they are committed to the area, so you know if you build or rehab one building, other actors will follow, and it will be a desirable place to live instead of just one lot among tumbleweeds you're trying to market for however much per month just to break even.

The city can show its own commitment through TIF districts and tax abatements. Investors large enough and committed enough to develop more than just a few parcels can do the same. But even both of these together may not convince lenders that the demand and political commitment is there (see McKee, Paul, Northside Regeneration, 2005-present). It took the NGA investment plus a non-traditional financial backer with more than just a straight-up profit/loss motive to get the ball rolling on that.

I'm not really all that concerned about land banking if it's done by an institutional stakeholder that's committed to seeing things through. None of that land would have been developed without McKee's ownership, so I don't see the harm in it sitting around until things come together. Same with the SLU land. I just don't know who else would be building there otherwise. The fact that one owner owns it all makes the collective action problem less of an issue, actually.

^ Goes back to the cliché of having all your eggs in one basket. Don't know the best answer but the history doesn't favor the one large collective model or for St. Louis the last couple of decades. Wash U is by far a different beast and by far the wealthiest of the group and has built more then the others. Can't deny that fact

dredger wrote:^ Goes back to the cliché of having all your eggs in one basket. Don't know the best answer but the history doesn't favor the one large collective model or for St. Louis the last couple of decades. Wash U is by far a different beast and by far the wealthiest of the group and has built more then the others. Can't deny that fact

I don't think history favors a lot of individuals owning vacant lots, either. The Northside area before McKee wasn't being developed as it was. In other words, I don't think the land-banking is actually causing the stagnation in the area--that would be happening anyway. The fact that one person bought it up just makes it easier to use that person as a scapegoat.

If the perceived demand were there, the financing will usually follow. I think it would make all the parties involved very very happy if they were forced to build sooner. I doubt McKee is thrilled to sit on his property for 10+ years without it being put to productive economic use. I'm a little more skeptical of SLU, because they may be looking super long-term with their land. But there's plenty of vacant land along that Chouteau corridor that's not being developed either.

WUSTL's history with redevelopment and turnaround speed seems better. They really want to turn the Loop and SDB into successful neighborhoods surrounding campus. Quick and effective development of the loop trolley corridor really is in their interest. If banks are too scared to finance this kind of development, I'm happy WUSTL will step in, cause not many other people or organization have the capacity to make it work.

Part of the parking lot around the blighting, boarded-up, former fast food building at Delmar and Skinker is being dug up. Word is they are removing gas tanks.

Looks like there were three traditional buildings there until at least 1958. By 1971 it was a gas station. Then not long later the crap shack we know today.

Wonder who's paying for it. Does this portend good things?

Were there really two gas stations at that corner for a time? Wish we had Google Streetview from then. As we know the damage to the urban fabric for gas stations continues today.

quincunx wrote:Were there really two gas stations at that corner for a time? Wish we had Google Streetview from then. As we know the damage to the urban fabric for gas stations continues today.

We don't have Streetview, but there is http://historicaerials.com/. You can see the building on the SE corner of the intersection in the 1958 image was replaced by the gas station in the 1971 aerial image, then the fast food joint appears in the 1996 collection.

And from the Missouri Digital Heritage collection, click the link for a picture of the Peppermint Club from 1960 on the Northwest corner of Delmar and Skinker. Here's a second picture from the same year.

I'm still looking for pictures of the SE corner.

-RBB

Historic aerials is a great resource to see what was, from above at least. That's where I got the info cited above. The crap shack came not long after 1971.

U City library webpage also has a lot of images of the Loop from street level. They have ones of the buildings that used to be on the ATT parking lot, but I don't recall one of the SE corner

First set of shows announced for Delmar Hall... opening Sept. 30.

http://www.stltoday.com/entertainment/m ... 4fe53.html

Delmar Hall

I didn't realize until the P-D posted this little nostalgia piece recently that a theater named The Pageant used to exist at 5851 Delmar (where Big Jake's BBQ used to be, and McDonald's before that):



Hopefully The Loop Trolley helps get this now empty lot back on line. Something like the old Loop Center proposal or Gotham project would be great:


I look forward to the day the street wall extends from Rosedale to Goodfellow.

The current Pageant is a fairly clear reference to that structure. Yes, I'm excited by the streetcar. It's a small step, but with a little luck it will help connect the West End with the Loop more directly and maybe fill in some of those holes.

The lot is owned by the history Museum. Google to see the controversy over that. It'll need environmental remediation for certain uses. I suspect the most viable use will be for structured parking. Biz owner's already complain about not enough.

I wonder why the environmental remediation if it was a theater, then McDonalds, then BBQ joint. Maybe there was something in between.

Interesting point about the parking. There is a ton of parking supporting (what is now) the western end of the Loop. A bit heartbreaking to prioritize parking in what will soon be one of the most transit served commercial stretches in the Midwest, but if development starts to take off east of the tracks parking is sure to be a hot topic. Hmmm, I wonder how many cars could fit where the southern 2/3 of the bus garage is.....

The was a dry cleaners way back when. It came up over the controversy over the museum pruchase and the amount they paid.