urbanSTL

http://youtu.be/D2MHPiDzotU A recap of Ferguson's events on 8/13/14

at 0:54 "Can we eliminate some of these municipalities? Can we consolidate them? Why do we need Velda City, Velda Village, Pine Lawn?"

The will is there... How do we get the ball rolling and when is the right time? How would a vote have to happen to consolidate all of North County into one muni?

Wow. I can't believe the information Anonymous can dig up. That there is a random picture of that guy with that flag in the room only inflames this situation. Is that his room? Could he have gone somewhere else where there was a confederate flag? Does it matter? Unfortunately, I feel like it takes away from the larger conversation.

As i gathered my thoughts about all these events going on in Ferguson & parts of the city is WOW!
Thugs at their best destroying a city apart continuing to kill each other yet demand justice. No respect for the community nor anyone around them let alone for each other ...

No Moral Equivalency!

As messed up as everything in Ferguson is, can we agree on one thing?

There is absolutely no moral equivalency in the comparison of black on black crime and police brutality.

Every time there is outrage when a cop kills a black man, you hear the defenders of the cops immediately question why there is not the same outrage over violent black on black street crime.

Hello? The two are completely different issues.

arch city wrote:In response to robertn42,

"I have to respectfully disagree."
Answer: That's okay. You are entitled to your opinion.

"A) He is not a reporter nor employed by the county. He is an elected public servant of the city in a leadership role."
Answer: However, he likely does have leave, flex, vacation and other kinds of leave time that you are unaware. Further, I am quite sure he knows he is a public servant in a leadership role and as long as HIS constituents are getting their needs met through his representation and don't have any complaints, why do you? What is your ward representative doing in light of all this calamity in the Gateway City?

"B) He is picking and choosing what he reports based on his own agenda/viewpoint."
Answer: Big deal. It is his camera and his lenses. He can pick and choose his subject matter as he sees fit. If you are unhappy with his viewpoint, buy your own camera and go take Vines, videos and images of what you desire then post them on social media.

"C) He chose not to speak up when 30-40 people looted a store in the city he represents last night."
Answer: First, that did not happen in his ward. Second, I am sure he was not thrilled that looting occurred in the city. Third, he doesn't have to speak on subjects or issues that he doesn't want to. Fourth, when the time comes, he'll make that decision and he'll probably bring his camera along.

"D) It is obtuse to think that he is not using this tragedy as a vehicle for his own benefit."
Answer: You are acting obtuse for trying to control an alderman who has the right to film, shoot and discuss subject matters that he sees are important to him and his constituency. You don't own him.

Further, when was the last time you've taken advantage of something to benefit you? Regardless of his motivations, which neither you nor I know, you need to stay in your lane and let him do what he does. You don't own him - nobody does - just because he is a city alderman.

"I have no doubt Alderman French cares about the city and his ward but his public actions especially via social media are often childish and counter-productive. His constant "everything is the mayor's fault" rants are a prime example of this."
Answer: You have your opinion. No offense intended, but he - not you - was elected to public office by his constituents. Ultimately, they are who he must be accountable to. If they feel he has been childish and counterproductive, they'll let him know, I'm sure. He can blame and point fingers - JUST LIKE YOU.

By the way, what has YOUR ward representative been doing while all of this sh*t has been unfolding? Likely nothing. I haven't heard sh*t from the any of the city's leadership except Antonio French, Mayor Slay and Lewis Reed - yet this is a REGIONAL CRISIS. Even the BUSTERS on the Illinois-side haven't made any comments that I'm aware.

I am not anti Alderman French by any means and the only reason I single him out is because he is so vocal on social media, not just in this case but all of the time. The discussions on this forum typically center around us striving for things that are positive and productive for the city and region. Alderman French has made himself a focal point in this crisis and I believe it is fair to question whether his actions are positive or productive. It is also fair to question his motives, which I am. When you put yourself in the spotlight you open yourself up to that.

In my opinion, it spoke volumes last night when as there were 2 more shootings in Ferguson (1 a drive-by, and 2 and officer involved shooting) Alderman French was retweeting compliments people were sending him. Retweeting compliments sent to you screams of self-serving. I feel that way about anyone on social media.

I've been a city resident for 9 years. I convinced my wife to move to the city, our 2 kids were born in the city, and we plan on raising them here. I own property in the city across 3 wards, not because it is a great business model, but because I believe I can make a real difference as a good landlord and property owner. I don't like the city, I love it. There is no place in the region I would rather live. That said I have a deeply vested interest in city politics. Whether he is my alderman or not Antonio French's decisions and actions have an effect on my life as do all of our elected officials in the city/region.

In the end none of this matters. What matters is a young man is dead, our region is in turmoil, and more people are in harms way. I can't wrap my brain around it. It hurts my heart.

What % of African-Americans in Ferfuson vote? Seems like it may be low. Hopefully this will be an awakening, "get-out-the-vote" moment for them in future elections.

Police Officers in his ward must feel great when they see an elected official from their area publicizing these kinds of things

robertn42 wrote:In the end none of this matters. What matters is a young man is dead, our region is in turmoil, and more people are in harms way. I can't wrap my brain around it. It hurts my heart.

Agreed. Antonio French's harmless social media postings need to be the least of St. Louis' concerns.

There's no emotion or agenda in that tweet from French. He's just tweeting some graffiti he saw. Maybe you are reading too much into it.

QUOTED: While I have shifted duties, I used to prosecute (administratively) the peace officer licenses of police in Missouri (for the purpose of either having them revoked or placed on probation/suspended, etc). There was nothing at all surprising about the manner in which the Ferguson cop reportedly behaved. St. Louis Metropolitan Police and surrounding departments are absolutely full of bad apples and terrible police officers. Even though I'm a white guy in his 30s, I'm leery of traveling in St. Louis City/County because of the things I've or my coworkers have encountered in our cases dealing with the police, chief among them is a terrible lack of judgment on how to conduct themselves in and out of uniform.

Since this has started, I've been continually oscillating between being impressed by the community response and dismayed by the community response. A few thoughts.

1) We will continue to see day-time protests and evening dissent until Ferguson PD releases the name of the involved officer. They need to be more forthright with certain details, as withholding this info will only enforce the "cover-up" dialogue developing. It doesn't console Michael Brown's family, but it at least will satiate his supporters. I don't believe a retaliatory attempt will occur if this name is released -- everybody recognizes the need for justice and due process is crucial in this instance.

2) I feel that the police presence has been -- on the whole -- properly coordinated and executed. While the use of tear gas, rubber bullets, flashbangs is likely overkill, their job is still to protect the peace. The late-night gatherings, while not necessarily antagonistic, does represent a public safety issue, whether those protesting recognize it as such or not. Especially in light of the disgusting Sunday night looting.

3) I actually think the national narrative has been very reasonable and even-handed in covering these events. I basically flipped through the major three cable news networks all day on Monday (was sick) and their coverage didn't sensationalize the situation or the St. Louis region. It recognized racial divides and responses while keeping the story fully-focused on the suspected civil infractions. I was also surprised to see the networks properly frame the story geographically, rather than simply casting the "St. Louis" net over it (as, frustratingly, our own local media does too often).

4) Going with the above point, nationally, I don't think this has cast St. Louis in a particularly negative light. The excesses of the police response are on full display, of course, but the overarching narrative has displayed a City and region with its very real issues, yes, but also its ability to overcome. Basically, it hasn't tried to sway anyone's opinion, one way or the other, which is kind of the point of true journalism.

5) I'm with arch city here -- why the hate for Ald. French's actions? He, like all of us, is allowed to do what he wants. As a public figure, it's his decision how to reconcile his personal views with his public role. He's opted to take an active role in the developments, and more power to him for it. Very odd response from some here. It's like the sports pro quandary -- people complain about the cliched "taking it one game at a time" responses, then rake a player over the coals when they actually express their opinion. Can't win for losing!

arch_genesis wrote:http://youtu.be/D2MHPiDzotU A recap of Ferguson's events on 8/13/14

at 0:54 "Can we eliminate some of these municipalities? Can we consolidate them? Why do we need Velda City, Velda Village, Pine Lawn?"

The will is there... How do we get the ball rolling and when is the right time? How would a vote have to happen to consolidate all of North County into one muni?

Uplands Park had disincorporation on the ballot last year and it failed. To put that on the ballot I think you have to get enough signatures and petition the County Council to put it on the ballot then it has to pass with 60%.

It'll probably take something grander to muster enough interest in voting and eventual real change.

At least one way to do it is the Board of Freeholders.

Merging two munis takes petitions and then concurrent approving votes of the two entities. Perhaps more than two can be included.

Can the state legislature do it by themselves or put it on the ballot?

Kevin B wrote: 5) I'm with arch city here -- why the hate for Ald. French's actions? He, like all of us, is allowed to do what he wants. As a public figure, it's his decision how to reconcile his personal views with his public role. He's opted to take an active role in the developments, and more power to him for it. Very odd response from some here. It's like the sports pro quandary -- people complain about the cliched "taking it one game at a time" responses, then rake a player over the coals when they actually express their opinion. Can't win for losing!

I'm torn about Alderman French's actions. I appreciate the information he's provided from a fairly clear reporter-like point of view.

But it still doesn't reconcile with the fact he's a City of St. Louis alderman who's active in the affairs of the City of Ferguson in St. Louis County. Yes, I know that just reinforces the whole city/county separation chasm and the issues it causes. (We're all in this boat together.) But if the shooting had occurred in the city and French was a county councilman or mayor of a suburban town and he was doing this in the city, I can't help to think that city residents would be all types of angry.

Perception of the region in this case is largely based on your ideology. I've heard some people say St. Louis is full of looters, thugs, and racist cops. I've heard other say St. Louis is a liberal battleground for activist against an oppressive police state. I think perspective is really shaped by where you stand on all this.

This isn't a criticism of what French HAS done in this situation, just something I'd like to see him additionally do...

He's a guy that's very active on social media and very willing to express opinions. And in this case he hasn't. And I'd like to see him compliment his reporting with some of the guidance (whether I agree with the stance or not) that he's known for expressing.

Again, he's free to do what he wants, and I'm not angry over what he's done. But since we're discussing him, that's what I think he could do a little more of in this time.

everything north of 64 in the county should be annexed city of CHAMP!

Champs current 12 residents live in 6 houses (circled in red) next to what will be a landfill


close up

How do we get more black young people interested in being police officers? Then motivated to get the education and training required? Then get hired on?

Seems very difficult given how negative an experience most have had with the police.

goat314 wrote: I've heard other say St. Louis is a liberal battleground for activist against an oppressive police state..

dbInSouthCity wrote:

goat314 wrote: I've heard other say St. Louis is a liberal battleground for activist against an oppressive police state..

I'm not saying I agree, I'm just showing you the range of the commentary lmao.

How do we get more black young people interested in being police officers? Then motivated to get the education and training required? Then get hired on?

Seems very difficult given how negative an experience most have had with the police.

I don't know the actual statistics, but anecdotally, based on black men and women you see in uniform, there are a lot of black police officers in the city at least.

In fact, before Dotson, wasn't the last chief of police in St. Louis African-American? I think he was.

And then going back a few years, there was Clarence Harmon, another black police officer, turned police chief, elected mayor.

So the issue is how do you get more blacks hired onto the police depts in STL County?

The excuse you often hear is that the SLMPD is the training ground for suburban districts, where experienced city officers go to find a cush job for good pay.

So maybe more black officers in the city just need to start applying for those county jobs?

arch city wrote:I'm perplexed.........why attack French when THOUSANDS of local publicly-elected officials metro-wide have not commented, Vined, tweeted, you-tubed, conferenced or ANYTHING. At least he's doing something - including interacting with and calming CITY RESIDENTS in Ferguson.

Sure he is still a public figure.....and he's a public figure who is doing a hellavu a lot more than these other cowardly-assed politicians in the metro who have done NOTHING. NOTHING. Raise up off him. I don't agree with him always, but in this instance you guy's really do need to raise up. I wonder what's really going on here. What's up with the double-standards and thinly-veiled attacks?

Where's Scott, Phyllis, Dionne, Lyda, Joe, Tammika etc. CRICKETS. Talk about and criticize them. St. Louis City is pushing regionalism and mergers, well, this is an opportunity to talk about regional and racial tolerance (and unity) for the betterment and healing of St. Louis.

First, there is a difference between constructively criticizing someone's actions and personally attacking them. I have nothing against French and no desire to attack him. In fact, I think he's a good person who really cares about Greater St. Louis. I am aware of his work with North Campus, his efforts to rehab homes in his ward, etc., and I commend him for that. If anything, he shows hands-on leadership that a lot of our so-called leaders could learn from in my opinion.

I also think he is providing a rather unique perspective of the happenings in Ferguson, approaching it from an angle that even the local and national television stations cannot capture.

I just find some of his statements to be questionable at best, and a little irresponsible at worst. One example, he said the white community shouldn't consider the violence 'thuggery'? Why not? Also, why shouldn't the African-American community view it similarly? When the rioting and looting began, this ceased being about outrage over the questionable circumstances surrounding the death of an unarmed African-American teenager. Those who chose to act illegally showed him and his loved ones no respect. To say that looting dozens of businesses and making thousands of law-abiding Ferguson residents feel unsafe isn't thuggery seems like tacit approval of these tactics in my opinion. That is, again, just my opinion. That said, Alderman French has since made statements calling for peace. I am willing to give him the benefit of the doubt based on his more recent statements, and also because of all of the good that he does for north St. Louis.

I do agree with you about the deafening silence from other area leaders. Where are they, exactly? I think it speaks volumes about the overall lack of leadership in our region. And with that in mind, I wonder how we as a community can truly recover.