urbanSTL

MattnSTL wrote:^That was not originally in the article. If I were the Cardinals I would make sure there is an approximately $5 Million gap in the financing.

True, but I suspect it's going to be all they can manage just to get the financing gap down to within one order of magnitude of $5 million.

It looks better than it did.

jlblues wrote:

MattnSTL wrote:^That was not originally in the article. If I were the Cardinals I would make sure there is an approximately $5 Million gap in the financing.

True, but I suspect it's going to be all they can manage just to get the financing gap down to within one order of magnitude of $5 million.

That will certainly be easier with committed office tenants, but you may be right. They talked about having committed financing a month or so ago, but right now, that doesn't necessarily mean anything. I'd be interested in seeing their current pro forma for the project.

I'm I missing something. Wasn't an actual site plan/renderings suppose to be submitted as part of their approval today? or was the development agreement all that was required? I know they got some more approvals to go for all the state & local assistance, TIFS, etc. But, was hoping to see how they were going to incorporate the office space after they let it be known that tennants are suppose to be signing on.

It looks like that parking lot around the outer outfield has been growing along with the grass.

Dredger wrote:I'm I missing something. Wasn't an actual site plan/renderings suppose to be submitted as part of their approval today? or was the development agreement all that was required? I know they got some more approvals to go for all the state & local assistance, TIFS, etc. But, was hoping to see how they were going to incorporate the office space after they let it be known that tennants are suppose to be signing on.

I was under the same impression...I guess we won't see any renderings or site plan today What's another day we have been waiting for Ballpark Village for years now.......

Just saw it. I also noticed the sign so it was new. Only showed brief glimpses of it. It was the Jaco report so maybe the video will be on line.

You can watch the story here.



The Stifel and Polsinelli building will be in left to left center field. Looks like the parking will either be underground or in another building. The building appears to be around 17- 18 floors, maybe a couple more. It is all glass except for the first couple floors. THere is a 3 story brick building to the left, likely retail space. Besides that, it is tough to tell. Looks like there are still other tall buildings in the background, but except for the bases of buildings, I wouldn't expect much more height on the site for this phase.



The proposed building is short enough to allow for views from taller buildings, but it is certainly big enough to provide a good presence right outside the ballpark. I really want to see a revised site plan and more detailed renderings to check out the urban design qualities.

tm8951 wrote:Fox 2 on the 9pm news showed breifly a new rendering and site plan. I wish I could find somewhere where it is posted....they showed an office tower with Stifel Nicolaus sign on top of the building. Anyone else see it???

I saw it, but figured that it probably wasn't the final design. Maybe it is.



I paused my DVR to see if I could make out any of the tenants on the site plan they briefly flashed on the screen. The only one I could make out was Flying Saucer Draught Emporium. Lame.

^I thought that was a place holder joke name. I didn't realize it was an actual place.

MattnSTL wrote:^I thought that was a place holder joke name. I didn't realize it was an actual place.

It looked like one of the signs in the renderings had bowling pins - did you notice that? I could be wrong though - it was hard to tell from the pictures on the 2Fox. There better not be a bowling alley in BPV. We're already good with Flamingo Bowl.

In both the Fox 2 and KMOV report, they both had a mix of new and old renderings....so it is hard to decipher the full impact of the new site plan and rendering. I was hoping the business journal would have some more information this morning in the print edition....

I'm still surprised, even despite the economy, that they can't build a bigger Class A office building. It looks to be a 15 - 18 story office tower at I guess they said 325,000 sq. ft. With Stifel and Polsinelli that would seem to fill 75 - 100% of that tower. I was hoping they'd build as much as an additional 50% of speculative office space which would bring it up to around 500,000 sq. ft. and 25-30 stories.



I just don't see this development being successful long term without more office and obviously residential tenants. The city better make sure they build these structures with the ability to build vertical with all the necessary parking and lobby space set aside.

metzgda, I agree with yours thoughts. Here is a great opportunity to build in some speculative office space by means of a higher tower. I'm not sure on the technical aspects, but foundation costs for the most part are already accounted for. Commodity prices on steel and material are on a downward sprial. Finally, your construction infrascture costs such as a tower crane, lifts are already in place. Not to mention the fact that they are going to be able to negiotiate a very competitive agreement with a general contractor considering the construction commerical market. Now to convince a banker of that wisdom.



Residential will come in time. But, it will depend on a solid base to build towers on. In my mind, I have no doubt that above ground parking will be built and will spend an equivalent number of thread pages discussing when the condo towers will be built on them. I have zero confidence in underground parking (considering the cost and amount of parking that is already available - who would pay a premium for underground parking in St Lou?)

DeBaliviere wrote:I paused my DVR to see if I could make out any of the tenants on the site plan they briefly flashed on the screen. The only one I could make out was Flying Saucer Draught Emporium. Lame.

Like MattnSTL, I thought that was some sort of placeholder name that could indicate a microbrewery of some sort, I had no idea it was an actual place since I haven't been to any of the cities where it has a location in some time. The one in Kansas City is part of the Power and Light District- surprise surprise.



I'd rather see an Anheuser-Busch themed place in Ballpark Village. Yeah, I know a lot of people around here are too good for the local macrobrew, but I think there's potential to create a unique setting to showcase all A-B (or should I say A-B/InBev?) beers and merchandise. Out-of-towners wanting more will wind up at the main brewery and/or Grant's Farm anyway, so why not give them another opportunity to experience A-B before or after a Cardinals game?



I'm less excited about the cheesy retail and restaurants that will locate here and more hopeful about the potential for density on this site. I'm still skeptical about whether we'll see any action here anytime soon anyway given the precarious state of the economy and multiple previous delays, but hopefully things will finally work out this time.

ThreeOneFour wrote:

DeBaliviere wrote:I paused my DVR to see if I could make out any of the tenants on the site plan they briefly flashed on the screen. The only one I could make out was Flying Saucer Draught Emporium. Lame.

Like MattnSTL, I thought that was some sort of placeholder name that could indicate a microbrewery of some sort, I had no idea it was an actual place since I haven't been to any of the cities where it has a location in some time. The one in Kansas City is part of the Power and Light District- surprise surprise.



I'd rather see an Anheuser-Busch themed place in Ballpark Village. Yeah, I know a lot of people around here are too good for the local macrobrew, but I think there's potential to create a unique setting to showcase all A-B (or should I say A-B/InBev?) beers and merchandise. Out-of-towners wanting more will wind up at the main brewery and/or Grant's Farm anyway, so why not give them another opportunity to experience A-B before or after a Cardinals game?



I'm less excited about the cheesy retail and restaurants that will locate here and more hopeful about the potential for density on this site. I'm still skeptical about whether we'll see any action here anytime soon anyway given the precarious state of the economy and multiple previous delays, but hopefully things will finally work out this time.

I am pretty concerned that we are getting a “McUrban” district here.



Looking at the video from the Fox report the layout and images look a lot like (I mean almost a carbon copy of) the Power and Light district in KC. They even had the same large cowboy graphic that dominates the P and L. Same central covered “living room”. I would imagine that they would be signing the same tenants.



This is disturbing; from a marketing aspect you would think that Cordish would try to make the two areas distinct.



From a built environment aspect I am even more concerned, the P and L is pretty plain jane architecturally and dressed up with a ton of signage.



I will have to see a final plan to make a good judgment, but unfortunately I think we may be getting a “bar mall” here.

Beer City wrote:I will have to see a final plan to make a good judgment, but unfortunately I think we may be getting a “bar mall” here.

Since bars and mega-discount department stores are about the only segments of the retail industry currently not having a stroke, that may be the only way this project gets off the ground.



The Ballpark "Village" Wal-Mart Superstore announcement might be right around the corner...

I reserve the super walmart store announcement for the Bottle District a year before the new Mississippi River Bridge is completed and after the Ram's failed attempted to get another stadium built next to the Edwards Dome. Of course, the city will have to give them a twenty year tax abatement in the name of development.



A thought, you could make a multi-level Ikea store work in Ballpark Village. Central location next to the busiest freeway, plenty of parking, strong tenant to anchor a corner, heavy foot traffic as well as being near a strong loft/condo/apartment market. I would take it.

These are really the only new renderings they showed, all the other renderings are outdated and probably irrelevant.

I must say I was hoping for a taller office building, but if they get the office building that is shown above built, I will be happy....I like the design; has a modern look and will definately add to the skyline as we haven't had a new office building built since the late 80s.

From the Belleville News-Democrat...



(BTW, nice coverage, P-D)



Revised plan moves the Cardinals' Ballpark Village project forward

Associated Press



ST. LOUIS -- Ballpark Village took a step forward after a St. Louis board approved a revised plan for the district of offices, restaurants and shops planned for the area near Busch Stadium.



Cardinals president Bill DeWitt III said Friday that the new plan allows for development in phases, with the potential to adjust as needed.



DeWitt said he expects about a $300 million development will be built on site, including a 17-story office tower, space for stores and restaurants, and parking for 1,200 cars in the project's first phase. Ballpark Village will include an area with a glassed roof, intended to be a spot to hold special events and concerts.



Residential space may be added in the future, but will not be included in the first phase, DeWitt said.



"Busch Stadium is a great anchor. A lot of people are excited about this," he said.



A Ballpark Village plan previously received city and state approvals, but the project took a hit when the Centene Corp. decided not to build a new headquarters there and instead remained in the suburb of Clayton.



Tough economic times have been a factor, too.



"The changing market conditions have led us to go through this process again," DeWitt said. But he thinks the new plan's flexibility will help the project to progress.



On Thursday, the city's Missouri Downtown Economic Stimulus Authority approved the Ballpark Village development plan. It allows for the development of 325,000 to 1.1 million square feet of commercial space, which would include retail, office, restaurant and entertainment space.



The seven-block district must include the 1,200 parking spaces and improvements to infrastructure under the plan.



The plan needs to be approved by the St. Louis Board of Aldermen.



http://www.bnd.com/business/story/535485.html