Sorry, I just caught this response while reading back.
JMedwick wrote:So back to the first question, what happens to the BPV in five years?
I think you are getting way ahead of yourself. But my answer would be....let the developers/owners and city decide just like they did with St. Louis Centre.
Period.
JMedwick wrote:
Now what about office space. As noted above, downtown office workers will play a role in both the long-term health of downtown and in the long-term success of the BPV. Thus far, while downtown has been moderately successful in adding some small firms to fill out office space, such as those mentioned in today’s Post article, clearly downtown has lost some heavy hitters.
I agree that downtown needs more workers. But the groundwork is being laid, IMO. Regardless, while downtown has lost some jobs, downtown has also gained and MAINTAINED some heavy hitters - AT&T, Jacobs/Sverdrup (from Maryland Heights), Deloitte, Macy's Midwest, Hardees plus government entities such as the DEA, Social Security Administration etc. Although I prefer gaining more workers,
maintaining workers is almost just as significant as gaining new ones - and downtown has been doing a fairly good job at retention lately. These workers will be instrumental in the sustaining of the BPV as well.
JMedwick wrote:
I am sure you would agree Arch, that even with the most positive spin on those small firms added, office growth downtown has been the laggard in this downtown revitalization in the same way that residential development was a laggard in the 1980’s
Again, I disagree. There have been much office space/workers created/added in recent years although I can't say with absolute certainty in terms of overall net gain or losses. It would be nice if the city and/or the DSTLP did an annual chart on downtown move-ins and move-outs. That way, we would have a bigger clue. I submit that when heavy hitters announce a relocation (Union Pacific) or downsizing (May) we get alarmed, which we should, but we don't seem to respect enough the smaller guys and start-ups that have been making a continuous impact on downtown over the last several years. I think people would be surprised by the numbers. They all have expressed a commitment to downtown and I think that bodes well for office expansion - and hopefully at the BPV.
"(and btw, you don’t think that residential occupancy was growing in buildings like Mansion House when STL Center opened, and frankly is that so dissimilar to the office growth seen since 2000?)."
Come on now, JMedwick. You are grasping. I worked in downtown St. Louis for years before moving away to Texas. In fact, I worked across the street from the Mansion House as a part of the Adam's Mark's inaugural staff when it first opened. Trust me, there was no impact at MH or Plaza Square for that matter. Keep in mind that the city was still emptying of residents. People were trying to get out of Dodge - including myself. Furthermore, turning (and keeping) one of the MH buildings into a hotel (whenever that happened) doesn't say much or it says a lot.
Frankly, the downtown office market needs a big positive shot in the arm. Adding small firms is very important no doubt, but downtown continues to have a finite and shrinking amount of downtown office space, cramping attempts to add new firms. Simply look at all the office space taken off the market with the residential boom.
Agreed 1000%. Since the mid-90's, Bosley's Administration, there has been a dire need for more Class A office space (1-million sq ft). Each mayor since has asked for more Class A space. Perhaps the BPV will get a new tower. Let's keep our fingers crossed.
For the sake of the health of downtown, to reduce the risk of this boom falling apart, it is important that growth in downtown be a balance as possible. This means office growth much catch up to residential and retail growth.
I hear you, but I don't think it is that dire. Again, recent development is more comprehensive - although more office space could be built as mayors have been pleading for.
Also, I think residential is catching up to office, actually. Yes, more office is definitely needed and I strongly believe it is coming. Let's keep in mind too that there is not quite an office boom going on around the country like in the 90's. A lot of the expansion nationally has been housing, except in the usual places - NYC and Atlanta for example. When the real office boom hits the nation and region - downtown St. Louis will see its share.
OK folks, posts only on BPV development/News from here on please.
