urbanSTL

stlhistory wrote:^That sounds like a good way to make customers and businesses quite feisty about paying extra property and sales tax for the project.

Its called supply and demand. Besides, if it's convenient and fairly inexpensive to pay for parking, I wouldn't mind.

I sense that when the BPV lot opens up it will be such easy money for the Cardinals that they will not want to take on the risk of developing those sites. In which I guess the best case is that some of the lots and garages a little further away will become less profitable and perhaps cause those owners to look for a higher and better use. It would be great to see high rises looking down into the stadium from BPV but I don't think we'll ever see that unfortunately. What a shame too.

americancitizen wrote:I sense that when the BPV lot opens up it will be such easy money for the Cardinals that they will not want to take on the risk of developing those sites.

My fear as well. It's going to be interesting to see how it works out. The large lot directly across Broadway from the stadium seems full every game. IIRC those spots go for no less than $20. I would think the new spots at BPV will likely go for a $20 minimum as well. This will be a large number of additional $20 spots coming on the market. I recall $10 prices just a block or so south of the stadium at lots off of Gratiot. It would be interesting to track the stats on this as it happens: DT parking supply vs demand, price points, customer behavior, increased parking opportunities vs decrease ballgame Metrolink ridership, etc.

^ Marvelous. Although the design is meh, I do think it will have a positive effect on the area north of 64 and south of Market. It's great to finally see it moving along!

This should hopefully be a both/and addition to downtown, capturing St. Louis Countians, et al., who woulda come in right at game time or zipped back home right after the game. This beginning will also offer a piece of the St. Louis Cardinals to fans and visitors alike 365ish days a year.

^ I also see Ballpark Village being a successful development. Our answer to the Power and Light district, but with a more consistent and lucrative base in Cardinals fans. I imagine this place will be rocking when the Cards make the playoffs and future phases will come sooner than we think.

An attempt to put some of the official renderings in the context of the project area:
Ballpark Village Construction Underway

My expectations are extremely low. I expect to see a lot of parking lot for years to come. Even if they do build more, my expectations are that it will be something saccarin and suburban and not add very much to Downtown. If they ever do announce another office or residential tower, I'll greet it with a strong dose of Show Me State skepticism.

That being said, my expectations for downtown as a whole could not be higher.

My thoughts.

Ballpark Village has surely been a disappointment up to this point with so many delays and scale downs, but I'm rather optimistic moving forward. My view of Ballpark Village is one of missed opportunities and future potential.

missed opportunities:

1) Not immediately restoring the street grid.
2) A rather insular development with little context to the downtown as a whole.
3) Like #2, no incorporation of the hideous stadium garages into future plans.
4) A very passive development strategy, seems like there is little confidence in the downtown market despite explosive growth and demand.
5) No details or solid plans for future phases. No renderings of what the NEW completed project may look like.
6) No attempts at trying to pre-lease condos or office space, something that other cities do all the time. This should be some of the most valuable real estate in the region with arch view, close proximity to stadium, and a burgeoning downtown residential/start up scene. I think they would be surprised at how fast apartments and condos would be leased in this "baseball crazed" town.

future potential:

1)I believe the Ballpark Village is within the Civic Center/Ballpark TOD planning area. Maybe Cordish, the Cardinals, and Metro could partner on something unique and truly make it a village.
2) Downtown's nearly complete form based code may help guide future development.
3) Shovels in the ground may spark investment interest in and around Ballpark Village.
4) Proximity to Busch Stadium will obviously benefit this place and make it a money maker no mater how cheesy it is.
5) Changed perceptions of downtown for many suburbanites.
6) We will no longer have a huge crater in the middle of our downtown when Cardinal games are national syndicated.

Overall, the future potential outweighs the missed opportunities (IMHO). Missed opportunities also have the potential to be fixed.

the count wrote:^ I would love to hear the nextSTL forum members' take on phase one of Ballpark Village. What do you think will happen? Will it be built as is, with no changes for a decade? Or will investors and developers be energized by this first phase? I'm disappointed with current plans but if it leads to a quality development I guess I'd be willing to give it a (weak) thumbs up.

Actually, I have a feeling it will be very successful, and that we will see a residential tower or more mixed use in the area by 2020. Laugh as you will, but I seriously believe that.

goat314 wrote:If you dont mind me asking Count, what program do you use to do your renderings.

Photoshop.

What I'm worried about is the sea of parking surrounding it becoming permanent. Sure they say that they're going to develop it later, but I think people are going to get so used to having that convenient surface parking that if they try to develop it we'll hear suburbanites' typical "OMG where are we going to park there's nowhere to park downtown blah blah blah." I think it'd be better if they just left the dirt in place to avoid that temptation.