Sure chief, whatever you say.newstl2020 wrote:^There's no reason to go OT on this thread, so unless you would like to explain how stating you wouldn't want to associate with someone who chose to live in a development with this low of architectural standards has anything to do with a comment regarding regionalized infighting between city and county residents, you can probably go ahead and move on.
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Well, that should be enough. You're both about to be put in the nextCORNER, and you don't want that.
A pic of Adventura in background of Tower Grove interchange construction from WUMCRC. I think I threw up a little.
Wow! now that is some impressive design! (said someone circa 1998 off Butler Hill in SOCO) ugh............ 
SOCO! Thanks for the shout-out!ntbpo wrote:...said someone circa 1998 off Butler Hill in SOCO...
But seriously, who's praying for a 3949 on this place? Too soon? My bad...
100 posts! Sure does seem excessive to graduate from 'New Member'...
Exactly.geoffksu wrote:But seriously, who's praying for a 3949 on this place? Too soon? My bad...
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^^Off topic ... but congrats on the member-status upgrade, I think. Personally, I feel awkward with the words *junior member* under my name. 
My strategy is to keep postng until that goes away.
Ahem.
Carrying on now. Back to the Aventura...
I feel like they should punctuate the name just to make it even better. "The Aventura! offers the very best in Central Corridor livng. All residents of The Aventura! get two free parkng pads. Refer a friend to The Aventura! and receive half off your next month's rent..."
Just an idea.
My strategy is to keep postng until that goes away.Ahem.
Carrying on now. Back to the Aventura...
I feel like they should punctuate the name just to make it even better. "The Aventura! offers the very best in Central Corridor livng. All residents of The Aventura! get two free parkng pads. Refer a friend to The Aventura! and receive half off your next month's rent..."
Just an idea.
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You may have already read this, but their real marketing reads like the Onion of urban St. Louis: http://nextstl.com/central-corridor/ave ... ummer-2013
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I drive by this every day on the way to work, and its ugliness makes me sick. I would personally give up my Saturdays to help build a 30' brick wall fronting this thing from 64/40 so that others can be spared this disgrace. I'm kind of serious here.
Couldn't these idiot builders at least have used brick-red vinyl siding?
To muffle their shame of being so damn cheap?
The marketing of this building should really be "My Friends Say I've Got A Really Nice Personality".
Think about it. They can show pictures of the apartments' solid interiors, the brand new kitchens, the great views from the top story's windows, all the amenities... And show the outside of the building maybe with a porkchop tied to its neck, so at least the dog will play in their dogpark.
They can show a picture of the outside with a brown bag over the top two floors, with smiling bricks hastily drawn on it. "The Aventura: When There's No Other Option."
Couldn't these idiot builders at least have used brick-red vinyl siding?
To muffle their shame of being so damn cheap?
The marketing of this building should really be "My Friends Say I've Got A Really Nice Personality".
Think about it. They can show pictures of the apartments' solid interiors, the brand new kitchens, the great views from the top story's windows, all the amenities... And show the outside of the building maybe with a porkchop tied to its neck, so at least the dog will play in their dogpark.
They can show a picture of the outside with a brown bag over the top two floors, with smiling bricks hastily drawn on it. "The Aventura: When There's No Other Option."
Ha! Someone please Photoshop that!gone corporate wrote:They can show a picture of the outside with a brown bag over the top two floors, with smiling bricks hastily drawn on it. "The Aventura: When There's No Other Option."
I am not a fan of the Adventura, though it could have been worse (think parking in front)gone corporate wrote:I drive by this every day on the way to work, and its ugliness makes me sick. I would personally give up my Saturdays to help build a 30' brick wall fronting this thing from 64/40 so that others can be spared this disgrace. I'm kind of serious here.
Couldn't these idiot builders at least have used brick-red vinyl siding?
To muffle their shame of being so damn cheap?
The marketing of this building should really be "My Friends Say I've Got A Really Nice Personality".
Think about it. They can show pictures of the apartments' solid interiors, the brand new kitchens, the great views from the top story's windows, all the amenities... And show the outside of the building maybe with a porkchop tied to its neck, so at least the dog will play in their dogpark.
They can show a picture of the outside with a brown bag over the top two floors, with smiling bricks hastily drawn on it. "The Aventura: When There's No Other Option."
Aventura is not clad in vinyl, it is cement board- it is not as cheap as vinyl
guys - the way this looks like it does is about culture - not money
One saving grace - it actually might appeal to a certain type of tenant - that may not have thought about city living in the past
remember to us brick houses packed in tightly signifies a great (or potentially great) urban neighborhood. - for someone moving here to work at BJC who grew up in say suburban Pheonix - those tightly packed brick houses say ghetto - no matter what the shape.
That being said - of course I would want it to look cooler
So the upside is that it will appeal to people from suburban Phoenix? That's digging pretty hard to find the diamond in the very rough. 9 North and Metro Lofts should do the same, but in a much better way. The new Mills/Whole Foods Apartment complex can't come soon enough. It will obviously be better than Aventura, but hopefully there's some pressure on them to come up with a cool, contemporary design.
I believe that anyone who wants to live in the suburbs is going to live in the suburbs, no matter what the apartments in the city look like. Just because it looks like a development in St. Charles county (or suburban Phoenix), it doesn't mean that those people will want to live there. Why should I have to live next to it?
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There isn't. The building has been designed for several years and isn't going to change at this point.wabash wrote:hopefully there's some pressure on them to come up with a cool, contemporary design.
Is phase II for sure going to happen? Is there still hope for the corner of Taylor and Chouteau? The city property lookup says it's owned by WashU.
I'm sure you're right. But maybe there's some hope that Whole Foods will have certain layout, signage, and even facade specs that require the original design to be changed? And therefore, maybe, possibly, going back to the drawing board on the rest of the exterior.....? I know. Unrealistic. At least the Aventura is so bad it will make the current design seem like Haussmann's work.Alex Ihnen wrote:There isn't. The building has been designed for several years and isn't going to change at this point.
^Would the neighborhood be supportive of Phase II without some basic design changes? As they've presented it, Phase II would just be more crappy buildings and a whole lot more surface parking.
Phase II in Red
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^ Good Q. I'd contact WUMCRC and Park Central Development and ask. Phase II is slated to be exactly like Phase I, but with yots more parking.
Come on, guys, its really not THAT bad. There's plenty of room in this city for all styles of architecture. You find this kind of design in cities all over the country.
IMO, it's impact on the area should outweigh our (biassed) desire for that perfect urban infill. To the average Joe Citizen driving by on the highway, this appears as a bright new addition to a rather bleak looking neighborhood.
IMO, it's impact on the area should outweigh our (biassed) desire for that perfect urban infill. To the average Joe Citizen driving by on the highway, this appears as a bright new addition to a rather bleak looking neighborhood.
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My mother-in-law from suburban Cincinnati loved it. I panned Aventura to a group of urban-minded SLU Law students and more than one asked why in the world I didn't think the development was great. We need to be clear on our criticism - which is (I think), the potential for this site was HUGE and what we got could be (and is) seen in Wentzville. It's the failure to fulfill potential. That's doesn't mean anyone (?) really thinks 200 new (relatively wealthy) residents is worse than a vacant lot. It means it could have, should have been sooooooooooooo much better. Easily.
^ My thoughts exactly. Although this development is very mediocre at best, I think some people on here are totally overreacting. FPSE is still a neighborhood in transition and I'm confident that that future infill will be more thoughtful as the neighborhood progresses. I've also seen these type of apartment buildings in urban meccas like Chicago and New York....GASP! 
Not every building in any city is of great architectural clout and just because a building is brick and old doesn't make it quality. Nobody is going to be driving down the highway and say "WOW...St. Louis City has a bland apartment complex next to old brick homes....this place lacks class!" If anything people who haven't been down to the city in a while are going to say "WOW....look at that new apartment building, look at the new highway change, is that a Shriners Hospital? Oh so that's CORTEX....the city has come along way!". That's just reality.
If anything we need to be pushing for city wide form based code. The district plan presented at the board of alderman is cute, but lets be real.....St. Louis City is only 60+ square miles and could really benefit from adopting 100% urban policies. There has been some good new infill around the city, but its a shame many new buildings are still built with little context to the urban neighborhood around it. I think we can all agree that new buildings just look more attractive and complement older buildings when they create a nice, neat street wall. That could go a long way in knitting together some of our more intact urban districts.
Not every building in any city is of great architectural clout and just because a building is brick and old doesn't make it quality. Nobody is going to be driving down the highway and say "WOW...St. Louis City has a bland apartment complex next to old brick homes....this place lacks class!" If anything people who haven't been down to the city in a while are going to say "WOW....look at that new apartment building, look at the new highway change, is that a Shriners Hospital? Oh so that's CORTEX....the city has come along way!". That's just reality. If anything we need to be pushing for city wide form based code. The district plan presented at the board of alderman is cute, but lets be real.....St. Louis City is only 60+ square miles and could really benefit from adopting 100% urban policies. There has been some good new infill around the city, but its a shame many new buildings are still built with little context to the urban neighborhood around it. I think we can all agree that new buildings just look more attractive and complement older buildings when they create a nice, neat street wall. That could go a long way in knitting together some of our more intact urban districts.
Sorry guys, I know I'm beating a dead horse, but considering this development quite literally is the gateway to BJC and the CWE in the fast-emerging FPSE/Grove neighborhood, it is positively awful and embarrassing. This is such a prime spot with prominent highway visibility, and it's so hopelessly ugly and cheap. I feel like it cheapens the entire neighborhood, devalues the gorgeous and historic Laclede Gas building which it essentially envelops, and takes the bar for new development to a new low. Could you imagine Boston or San Francisco or Seattle or even Minneapolis allowing this crap to be built? In some cases, nothing is better than anything. A vacant lot at least presents opportunity. This sh*tbox completely squanders it. Great cities do not accept just any development out of desperation. I think we should demand better results for Phase 2. If there are any public meetings, I will be there.
^Actually, re Minneapolis....
There is to my recollection a big group of similarly cruddy apartments near the "weave" (where 35W and 62 merge) just off Nicollet. They are advertised with signage that reads "You could be home now!" Granted they are older buildings, but it's totally what I imagine something like this to become as it ages. There is a pretty atrocious development that basically walls off an entire side of a block of Colfax Ave S or Bryant Ave S between 35th and 36th. The difference is none of these are new and in a high profile location. The ones in MPLS have been there since at least the '80s I'd guess.
There is to my recollection a big group of similarly cruddy apartments near the "weave" (where 35W and 62 merge) just off Nicollet. They are advertised with signage that reads "You could be home now!" Granted they are older buildings, but it's totally what I imagine something like this to become as it ages. There is a pretty atrocious development that basically walls off an entire side of a block of Colfax Ave S or Bryant Ave S between 35th and 36th. The difference is none of these are new and in a high profile location. The ones in MPLS have been there since at least the '80s I'd guess.