urbanSTL

SLMPD traffic stops down 14.5% in 2024.
2024 - 23,717 (64% were of non-residents)
2023 - 27,742 (2/3 were of non-residents)
2022 - 32,586
2021 - 45,154
2020 - 30,222
2019 - 57,948
2013 - 67,984
https://ago.mo.gov/get-help/vehicle-stops-report/

^SLMPD does not by stop people for expired plates or torn temp tags. they see this as a issue/function of the incompetent state gov. 

dbInSouthCity wrote:^SLMPD does not by stop people for expired plates or torn temp tags. they see this as a issue/function of the incompetent state gov. 

I agree with their approach. Pulling over an otherwise safe driver just for plates or tags is a waste of police resources.

Though just about every one of the worst offenders of unsafe driving have plate or tag issues.

The problem with applying the Broken Windows Theory to the expired plates issue is that the state is the entity that ensures the windows remain inevitably broken. So, the police enforcing the law strictly becomes just as stupid and predatory as the police strictly enforcing jaywalking in a city that doesn't provide pedestrian infrastructure or littering in a homeless encampment.

Police enforcement will never fix the issue, just like how police breaking up homeless encampments doesn't actually fix homelessness.

In reality, outside of reactionary law and order fantasyland, all strict enforcement of expired plates would result in is increased police interactions, more victims of police brutality, more police chases (with some that will inevitably result in a crash and kill an innocent person), and more cops getting killed or seriously injured. Oh, people who are poor and marginalized being disproportionately affected by the enforcement because they are the people who disproportionately have expires tags.

On a final note, expired plates or temp tags themsleves pose zero threat to people on the roads. In a distinctly different way than a car with no plates does, as well. The police strictly enforcing expires tags would not have the same actual impact as stricter enforcement of active traffic laws, like running red lights, speeding, and reckless driving. The temp tag debate is just such a weird one that is had because these things don't affect you. Literally not at all. Nor does the existence of an expires tag inherently mean someone is a worse driver. Yet people act as if they face some serious physical injury everytime they see one. There's way bigger issues around driving that have much more negative affects than expires temp tags or plates, but the focus remains on the tags, so the actual issues will never be solved.

I do consider a vehicle that does not have a state plate with current sticker to have less accountability should the driver/owner  of that vehicle impact my vehicle and vice versa

Auggie wrote: ↑

May 31, 2025

The problem with applying the Broken Windows Theory to the expired plates issue is that the state is the entity that ensures the windows remain inevitably broken. So, the police enforcing the law strictly becomes just as stupid and predatory as the police strictly enforcing jaywalking in a city that doesn't provide pedestrian infrastructure or littering in a homeless encampment.

Police enforcement will never fix the issue, just like how police breaking up homeless encampments doesn't actually fix homelessness.

In reality, outside of reactionary law and order fantasyland, all strict enforcement of expired plates would result in is increased police interactions, more victims of police brutality, more police chases (with some that will inevitably result in a crash and kill an innocent person), and more cops getting killed or seriously injured. Oh, people who are poor and marginalized being disproportionately affected by the enforcement because they are the people who disproportionately have expires tags.

On a final note, expired plates or temp tags themsleves pose zero threat to people on the roads. In a distinctly different way than a car with no plates does, as well. The police strictly enforcing expires tags would not have the same actual impact as stricter enforcement of active traffic laws, like running red lights, speeding, and reckless driving. The temp tag debate is just such a weird one that is had because these things don't affect you. Literally not at all. Nor does the existence of an expires tag inherently mean someone is a worse driver. Yet people act as if they face some serious physical injury everytime they see one. There's way bigger issues around driving that have much more negative affects than expires temp tags or plates, but the focus remains on the tags, so the actual issues will never be solved.

By this logic, why would anyone ever pay sales tax or personal property tax on their car? I think I’ll stop paying them!!

Thank you Auggie!

Because in every other state you pay it at the dealer before you leave with the car.  Wild idea I know.

And technology can like plate readers can ID cars that didn’t pay property tax and a penalty is added. After a certain amount you get your take taken away

I think you can pay the tax at the dealer now?  But, yes.  I agree.  If you have expired tags you are demonstrating that you are more likely to also break other laws,

The Missouri legislature actually did something sensible last year, in spite of intense lobbying against it from the auto industry, and passed a bill where you have to pay your sales tax at the dealership.

46 States already do it this way and now people won’t be able to spend all of the loan they were approved for on the price of the car and then have nothing left to pay taxes and registration.

This will solve like 90% of the tags issues. So much more sensible than wasting our police resources on it. Goes into effect next year.

I've nearly been hit while walking by distracted drivers with current tags several times.  Pulling over someone simply for a temp tag issue while others speed by, etc. seems a foolish thing to prioritize, especially for an allegedly understaffed police force. Focus should be on the dangerous behavior, regardless of who is commiting it.

The issue with enforcement is solely due to the lack of police. Years of progressive policies in the city have diminished moral and caused many to not seek a law enforcement career or to move to a department with higher pay and less work. In addition the statistics of the number of police employed in the city don't take into account the number of them that can't patrol because they are white shirts, detectives and those who are on paid leave because of injury or internal investigation. 
Once again this week STL was again shown to have the highest homicide rate in the nation. In 2022 and 2023 our rate was 63.6 per capita while the next highest ranking city, New Orleans was 62.5 and then Baltimore at 52.6. I know our leaders like to take credit for the falling rates, but nationally the crime rates have been falling post covid.

southcitygent wrote:The issue with enforcement is solely due to the lack of police. Years of progressive policies in the city have diminished moral and caused many to not seek a law enforcement career or to move to a department with higher pay and less work. In addition the statistics of the number of police employed in the city don't take into account the number of them that can't patrol because they are white shirts, detectives and those who are on paid leave because of injury or internal investigation. 
Once again this week STL was again shown to have the highest homicide rate in the nation. In 2022 and 2023 our rate was 63.6 per capita while the next highest ranking city, New Orleans was 62.5 and then Baltimore at 52.6. I know our leaders like to take credit for the falling rates, but nationally the crime rates have been falling post covid.

Right so we should try to address our high murder rate ranking by having the police chase down expired plates. Makes sense.

Yes, the progressive policies like if you commit a crime as a law enforcement officer you will get held accountable and not get a free pass like in the past. What a wild concept.

southcitygent wrote: ↑

May 31, 2025

The issue with enforcement is solely due to the lack of police. Years of progressive policies in the city have diminished moral and caused many to not seek a law enforcement career or to move to a department with higher pay and less work. In addition the statistics of the number of police employed in the city don't take into account the number of them that can't patrol because they are white shirts, detectives and those who are on paid leave because of injury or internal investigation. 
Once again this week STL was again shown to have the highest homicide rate in the nation. In 2022 and 2023 our rate was 63.6 per capita while the next highest ranking city, New Orleans was 62.5 and then Baltimore at 52.6. I know our leaders like to take credit for the falling rates, but nationally the crime rates have been falling post covid.

You can say this all you want, but in America, police have it far easier than pretty much any other developed country. I am personally very pro police and I find myself defending them fairly often, but they should also be required to have something like a criminal justice degree or an equivalent before they are hired on. Having a more educated police force would go a long way in fixing many of our crime issues as a society and would reduce police abuse.

In reality, very few American cops would be hired on in countries like Britain, France, or Germany. So it's always very funny to me when cities are blamed for "progressive" policies as to why they lose officers when those policies are more strictly holding them to account and (unfortunately) paying them less because naturally cities don't have the luxary of dedicating a needlessly large part of their budget to police as suburbs do. It's a far more complicated issue than you care to consider. And before you wanna say that college costs money, SLMPD provides tuition reimbursement and the state is floating around a proposal to provide free college to all law enforcement in Missouri.

On a final note, police in America are used as a magical fix it tool for all issues when they simply are not that. Their core job is to make arrests and collect evidence for the prosecution. They can't fix the core causes of crime. They can reduce symptoms, sure, but it will always persist unless something is done about the root causes. This also applies with the tag issue. Also with the speeding and reckless driving issue. They can't fix these problems on their own, but they're the only solution being offered by politicians.

Tough month for homicides, 19.

It is crazy how bad a couple heinous multi-death homicides (that have little to do with the general safety in the city) can do to our perception to the outside world. There were two domestic events that will make a big impact in making our entire metro look like a war zone to many when every website/social media account picks up the 2025 numbers and spread them with headlines that include StL. Very sad on all accounts

and fentany once the main street drug aint what it used to be
https://archive.ph/6QXqI
k2 is back as the cheap drug choice

We should care about license employees taking bribes, in fact.

Citywide crime data through May 
Person 
2025: 2,862
 2024: 3,183 
Change: -10% 

Property 
2025: 8,494 
2024: 10,153 
Change: -16% 

Society 
2025: 3,163 
2024: 3,435 
Change: -8%

 Unspecified
 2025: 2,926
 2024: 3,131 
Change: -6.5%

 Total 
2025: 17,446 
2024: 19,902 
Change: -12.34%