Hes management, so not part of local 73
Btw, absolute chaos happening right now in the background. Tomorrow’s 9:00 am will be interesting.
Btw, absolute chaos happening right now in the background. Tomorrow’s 9:00 am will be interesting.
Why the FD's button isn't tested during the monthly tests, and wasn't tested on Thursday (when the sirens were going off all day) is also a major failure.addxb2 wrote: ↑May 21, 2025Ok, so am I following this correctly?
CEMA received the alert first. Typically CEMA would push the button but if unable they would call the fire department. That’s obviously rare since no one knew the Fire department button was broken. Strike one.
Sarah calls the fire department because CEMA staff are at a workshop with high risk of severe weather. Strike two.
The fire department has a breakdown in communication between phone and (broken) button. Strike three.
Sarah had a slim SOP that called for the FD to own the alarm. It was either not shared or implemented. Again, because the FD wouldn’t have a broken button and Sarah wouldn’t be calling the FD.
Just a big mess.
If there is any policy failure here, the fact the FD's button isn't regularly tested is the failure.
I’d be curious on the timestamp of this call. Not that it changes anything but I’d be curious how long after the warning went out it was made and how far along the tornado was at that point.dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑May 21, 2025
At the end
CEMA commissioner: you got the sirens?
Fire dept: yes, ma’am
Both say good bye.
I wonder how much of the Rams money will be used to rebuild these neigborhoods? The optics of not spending substantial amounts of that money on the Northside would be crazy, but then again this is St. Louis. I know a lot of people also fear that this tragedy is the precursor for significant gentrification to the neighborhoods just north of the central west end. Only time will tell.
Rams money should be used for things the state and feds don't usually cover. Let's not let them off the hook because the city has Rams money.
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Obviously, a tornado can destroy ANY structure if the situation is just right. I am a Midwesterner. I have a lifetime of tornado and storm stories. It's also basic knowledge that if a structure is in any way "unstable" to begin with then it is much more likely to be completely destroyed. I'm sure none of this will be taken into consideration. Obviously, this is a tragedy. The "recovery" and all the money thrown at it will likely end up being stuck in the regular St. Louis racial and bureaucratic things. Anything "transformational" is not likely. A handful of people will benefit, somehow.goat314 wrote: ↑May 21, 2025I wonder how much of the Rams money will be used to rebuild these neigborhoods? The optics of not spending substantial amounts of that money on the Northside would be crazy, but then again this is St. Louis. I know a lot of people also fear that this tragedy is the precursor for significant gentrification to the neighborhoods just north of the central west end. Only time will tell.
We need to watch out for another Paul McKee type and avoid their seduction.
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My takeaways from the latest update are this:
1)Sarah Russell’s protocol from 2021 is confusing and absolutely needs to be fixed. Cara was right about that and wasn’t lying as Denis accused her of on this forum and Reddit. The protocol says sirens should be activated during a tornado or sever storm warning. It also says CEMA can direct the FD to activate in case of other imminent threats. Does this mean the FD should’ve activated the sirens under this tornado warning without the direction of CEMA? Who knows because that isn’t clear in the document.
2) For all her faults, it doesn’t appear Sarah was lying as Denis accused her of when she said she initially wasn’t sure if the all/some of the sirens went off. She made the directive to the FD.
3) Sarah Russell absolutely has to go because of the protocol she apparently wrote and her ineffective communication to the fire department.
I’m glad Cara took the time to actually dig in and find root causes of what happened.
1)Sarah Russell’s protocol from 2021 is confusing and absolutely needs to be fixed. Cara was right about that and wasn’t lying as Denis accused her of on this forum and Reddit. The protocol says sirens should be activated during a tornado or sever storm warning. It also says CEMA can direct the FD to activate in case of other imminent threats. Does this mean the FD should’ve activated the sirens under this tornado warning without the direction of CEMA? Who knows because that isn’t clear in the document.
2) For all her faults, it doesn’t appear Sarah was lying as Denis accused her of when she said she initially wasn’t sure if the all/some of the sirens went off. She made the directive to the FD.
3) Sarah Russell absolutely has to go because of the protocol she apparently wrote and her ineffective communication to the fire department.
I’m glad Cara took the time to actually dig in and find root causes of what happened.
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Spencer was lying. Russell was lying. It’s some really strange devotion that you can’t see that
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I have nothing to say about the siren situation. One thing I would be interested in though. Does anyone know the topic of the workshop that CEMA was attending on that Friday?
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It’s not devotion. It’s important to understand root causes so it can be fixed next time. What did Spencer lie about?dbInSouthCity wrote:Spencer was lying. Russell was lying. It’s some really strange devotion that you can’t see that
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I'm glad we have a mayor that didn't leave town in our time of need.
I think Cara has been unsure and unclear as she tries to tightrope a very sensitive topic. She confirmed that concerns were valid immediately after and admitted a city failure in less than four days. Her messaging has gotten more confident as details have gotten clearer. I absolutely would’ve given Jones the same assessment at this point.
Russell is a straight up liar. “Decades long policy that CEMA was the secondary activation point” …… yeesh.
Russell is a straight up liar. “Decades long policy that CEMA was the secondary activation point” …… yeesh.
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^agreed.addxb2 wrote:I think Cara has been unsure and unclear as she tries to tightrope a very sensitive topic. She confirmed that concerns were valid immediately after and admitted a city failure in less than four days. Her messaging has gotten more confident as details have gotten clearer. I absolutely would’ve given Jones the same assessment at this point.
Russell is a straight up liar. “Decades long policy that CEMA was the secondary activation point” …… yeesh.
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Ameren reports less than 15,000 outages this morning. Glad it hasn't been hot. We would have had heat injjuries and deaths and a lot more strained tempers.
What are your demands? What would satisfy you? Spencer's impeachment and both the fire chief and safety commissioner fired? Is that what it's going to take?dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑May 21, 2025Spencer was lying. Russell was lying. It’s some really strange devotion that you can’t see that
Or do we need to chop their heads off and put them on pikes in front of city hall as a warning to the next people that hold those positions?
That 2006 straight line wind storm was that way. 95 degrees and ghastly humid for the next weekquincunx wrote: ↑May 21, 2025Ameren reports less than 15,000 outages this morning. Glad it hasn't been hot. We would have had heat injjuries and deaths and a lot more strained tempers.
Screenshot_20250521-074155.png
Part of me wonders if this situation was at play. Although I don’t have time to go through all the timelines of who said what when.
CEMA didn’t have anyone at their post. They call the FD to set off sirens. They push their button to set them off not knowing their button wasn’t working. So they think they set it off. Then come reports some people heard sirens some didn’t so they think at least some sirens went off which mean they think their button worked. That leads to a bunch of confusion on what actually happened until they figured out their button was broken.
Then the question who is responsible for checking the button. Was it FD since it’s their button or CEMA since I assume they are supposed to make sure the system works.
If that is the case there definitely would be confusion with what is said from “no one pushed the button” meaning it didn’t work.
But anyway, I wanted to throw that scenario out there.
CEMA didn’t have anyone at their post. They call the FD to set off sirens. They push their button to set them off not knowing their button wasn’t working. So they think they set it off. Then come reports some people heard sirens some didn’t so they think at least some sirens went off which mean they think their button worked. That leads to a bunch of confusion on what actually happened until they figured out their button was broken.
Then the question who is responsible for checking the button. Was it FD since it’s their button or CEMA since I assume they are supposed to make sure the system works.
If that is the case there definitely would be confusion with what is said from “no one pushed the button” meaning it didn’t work.
But anyway, I wanted to throw that scenario out there.
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Here's a story on the five Saint Louisans we lost.
https://www.ksdk.com/article/news/local ... 7457f273ab
As the days pass by and more harrowing stories come to light it's a blessing more people were not killed or seriously injured.
As for the siren issue, I'm unclear on whether the Fire Department button was broken or they didn't push it. Anyway, it's ultimately the responsibility of the Department of Public Safety to ensure the public's safety and I hope no one is scapegoated in an attempt to avoid accountability.
https://www.ksdk.com/article/news/local ... 7457f273ab
As the days pass by and more harrowing stories come to light it's a blessing more people were not killed or seriously injured.
As for the siren issue, I'm unclear on whether the Fire Department button was broken or they didn't push it. Anyway, it's ultimately the responsibility of the Department of Public Safety to ensure the public's safety and I hope no one is scapegoated in an attempt to avoid accountability.
Yes it was terrible, Over 1M power outages, IIRC, they made progress, then a normal thunderstorm two days later outages back up, then hot! 100F. I got so lucky during that storm, no power loss, and during the ice storm that December.dweebe wrote: ↑May 21, 2025That 2006 straight line wind storm was that way. 95 degrees and ghastly humid for the next weekquincunx wrote: ↑May 21, 2025Ameren reports less than 15,000 outages this morning. Glad it hasn't been hot. We would have had heat injjuries and deaths and a lot more strained tempers.
Screenshot_20250521-074155.png
Turns my gut. It’s too early in the process for this but I propose that Fountain Park be rebuilt as a memorial to the five lives lost. The business community and city should pay for it all.
That's not what I said, and you know it. Any loss of life is tragic.dbInSouthCity wrote: ↑May 21, 2025Yeah man, the families saying maybe their dead love ones would be alive if the sirens worked should be told to shut the ***** up and let’s focus on clean up
The contest to become the Jane Dueker for the Spencer administration is quite the horserace.
Sen, Hawley saying all the right things.