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PostSep 10, 2021#3251

Laife Fulk wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
The first sentence of the PD article kinda cuts through this whole debate over if they're SLMPD officers or not - forget which agency their security is from, this is egregious:
By the time city liquor control officers reached Reign Restaurant’s front door one Saturday in May, it was 1:50 a.m., way past closing time. They could see people still drinking inside, but when the officers tried to enter, a “very large” security officer blocked their path.

As the officers stood outside on Washington Avenue, for 22 minutes, patrons slipped out the back door, drinks still in their hands.
That alone should have been cause for their liquor license to be suspended for a few weeks at least.
Why are you so racist?

One time when I worked at a bar we had someone leaving the job. About a dozen of us (tops) stayed after to have drinks. We put down all the blinds and turned off a lot of the lights. We kept it chill and were smart about when leaving. The next day the chief of police and city manager dropped a fine on our place and warned of future repercussions. We all had to chip in like $20 to cover the fine.

But I guess Reign doesn't have to observe closing time and liquor laws.

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PostSep 10, 2021#3252

^lol.  Have you ever been to a south city bar?  18 year olds are drinking. 1:30 am bars are open til past 2:00.

I worked in the zoning dept for 2 years and worked with the liquor control agents on daily bases.  It’s ridiculous to pretend that race has nothing to do with it.  The south city bars were left alone because they didn’t cause trouble.  Now you can move the goal posts and say well they didn’t cause trouble but that’s not what you’re saying.  I agree. We either enforce the laws or we don’t and we clearly do it selectively.

Underage drinking literally happens every single day knowingly at the Wheelhouse, a “sports bar” on its permit and a nightclub on all their social
Media properties

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PostSep 10, 2021#3253

Wow I don't know if anyone else is watching the Reign excise hearings. They showed footage of an incident that happened on December 2020 at the door
- SD cards were removed from the cameras inside Reign
- Owner refused to produce camera footage from these cameras
- There is a security guard carrying an assault rifle
- Said security guard hides a gun used in the shoot out before cops arrived

I haven't said anything about Reign so far because I don't live Downtown, don't care about what happens there at night (I work Downtown but am out of there before 8pm most days), and was waiting to "hear both sides", but this is absolutely ridiculous.

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PostSep 10, 2021#3254

You're right - this is a city wide issue. The Excise commission should have more authority to sanction Reign, Wheelhouse, and any other bar in the city that's serving alcohol to minors, serving after hours, or causing public disturbances.  This isn't a "Reign vs. Wheelhouse" debate.  It's a "just enforce the laws everywhere for once" conversation.

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PostSep 10, 2021#3255

kipfilet wrote:Wow I don't know if anyone else is watching the Reign excise hearings. They showed footage of an incident that happened on December 2020 at the door
- SD cards were removed from the cameras inside Reign
- Owner refused to produce camera footage from these cameras
- There is a security guard carrying an assault rifle
- Said security guard hides a gun used in the shoot out before cops arrived

I haven't said anything about Reign so far because I don't live Downtown, don't care about what happens there at night (I work Downtown but am out of there before 8pm most days), and was waiting to "hear both sides", but this is absolutely ridiculous.
That business is a cancer for Downtown!! And yes all businesses that break the law should be closed down! All of them!!


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PostSep 10, 2021#3256

The reign lawyer has some good points, city’s code doesn’t talk anything about outside of the licensee premise.   You may think that’s just a technical issue but this is going to go to court and they have a point.   Liquor license holder has no obligation to conduct outside its 4 walls

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PostSep 10, 2021#3257

That's a totally valid legal point, but doesn't make up for the other incidents (the having patrons leave out the back, refusing to share video with police officers during the criminal investigation where four people were shot outside, etc). Is Reign 100% liable for all the shootings? Of course not, but we can't just sweep away any and all criticism of the venue as being racist.

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PostSep 10, 2021#3258

Laife Fulk wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
That's a totally valid legal point, but doesn't make up for the other incidents (the having patrons leave out the back, refusing to share video with police officers during the criminal investigation where four people were shot outside, etc). Is Reign 100% liable for all the shootings? Of course not, but we can't just sweep away any and all criticism of the venue as being racist.
In our chat sure but this is a legal proceeding
Do they have to share video?  Police could have issued a subpoena.   Do we usually pull a license for one offense of after hour drinking?
This is what happens when the City doesn’t care; the police don’t care etc. they take short cuts and places like this get to stay open by courts.     The LL officer just said we didn’t issue citations because we are short staffed.  Courts will laugh that out the door.     City may pull the license but idk if the court will be as generous

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PostSep 10, 2021#3259

Even if they skate past the city, there is zero reason they shouldn't be evicted if they're truly six figures deep in past due rent, not to mention the general nuisance language I'm sure their lease has.  No judge will have any sympathy for them.

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PostSep 10, 2021#3260

Here where this is at- should Reign lose its LL because in May 2021 it didn’t allow a LL officer inside for 22 minutes. All the other stuff is irrelevant to the hearing

PostSep 10, 2021#3261

jbacott wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
Even if they skate past the city, there is zero reason they shouldn't be evicted if they're truly six figures deep in past due rent, not to mention the general nuisance language I'm sure their lease has.  No judge will have any sympathy for them.
Apparently they had a payment plan with the landlord in place before the city leaning on the landlord to pull the deal.  So I assume that contract will be in the evidence for that hearing

And you’re right, I think the 9/20
Hearing is a better chance then this waste of time

PostSep 10, 2021#3262

This is all performance art for the court appeal at the court. But the lawyer for Reign is very good

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PostSep 10, 2021#3263

Be careful what you say the mods will delete your post.

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PostSep 10, 2021#3264

If there are really that many shootings nearby, it seems like a matter of public safety. No business owner should have the right to put the greater public at risk.

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PostSep 10, 2021#3265



The first step is admitting you have a problem.

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PostSep 10, 2021#3266

UrbanW5 wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
If there are really that many shootings nearby, it seems like a matter of public safety. No business owner should have the right to put the greater public at risk.
Which biz owner? The one where the shooter Parked, had dinner at, smoked a cigar or the biz where they ended their night dancing?

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PostSep 10, 2021#3267

dbInSouthCity wrote:
UrbanW5 wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
If there are really that many shootings nearby, it seems like a matter of public safety. No business owner should have the right to put the greater public at risk.
Which biz owner? The one where the shooter Parked, had dinner at, smoked a cigar or the biz where they ended their night dancing?
The one that is a magnet 🧲 for problems!! Reign should be close and building owner should not extend their lease! They need to be shut. I just can’t see how a business with all those problems can stay open! No wonder why DT STL growth is not at is full potential and kind of slow! We need to do better! There’s no way anyone can defend their actions! Forget about the shootings, tampering with evidence should be cause to remove LL.


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PostSep 10, 2021#3268

JJ Rivera wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
dbInSouthCity wrote:
UrbanW5 wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
If there are really that many shootings nearby, it seems like a matter of public safety. No business owner should have the right to put the greater public at risk.
Which biz owner? The one where the shooter Parked, had dinner at, smoked a cigar or the biz where they ended their night dancing?
The one that is a magnet 🧲 for problems!! Reign should be close and building owner should not extend their lease! They need to be shut. I just can’t see how a business with all those problems can stay open! No wonder why DT STL growth is not at is full potential and kind of slow! We need to do better! There’s no way anyone can defend their actions! Forget about the shootings, tampering with evidence should be cause to remove LL.


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What evidence did they temper with? Is there a police report?

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PostSep 10, 2021#3269

Wherever they were at last. I would say if it’s outside a front door it’s pretty damning. Looks like they’ve also had issues with masks and social distancing. Just a general disregard for the welfare of the public.

I don’t know if you are connected with that place or you think businesses shouldn’t worry about externalities but I can’t see why anyone would be okay with a business completely disregarding health and safety even if they are technically correct.

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PostSep 10, 2021#3270

dbInSouthCity wrote:
JJ Rivera wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
dbInSouthCity wrote: Which biz owner? The one where the shooter Parked, had dinner at, smoked a cigar or the biz where they ended their night dancing?
The one that is a magnet 🧲 for problems!! Reign should be close and building owner should not extend their lease! They need to be shut. I just can’t see how a business with all those problems can stay open! No wonder why DT STL growth is not at is full potential and kind of slow! We need to do better! There’s no way anyone can defend their actions! Forget about the shootings, tampering with evidence should be cause to remove LL.


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What evidence did they temper with? Is there a police report?
If the city didn’t do their job its a problem as well. But the agents words should be taken into account. On one of the articles the businesses owners said Reign is the problem and that they will or might relocate. I rather close the one that is a magnet for crime than lose 3 or maybe more businesses. I know in court you must present formal evidence and some other stuff but that place shouldn’t be open! No one in the community (business owners) want it there.


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PostSep 10, 2021#3271

UrbanW5 wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
Wherever they were at last. I would say if it’s outside a front door it’s pretty damning. Looks like they’ve also had issues with masks and social distancing. Just a general disregard for the welfare of the public.

I don’t know if you are connected with that place or you think businesses shouldn’t worry about externalities but I can’t see why anyone would be okay with a business completely disregarding health and safety even if they are technically correct.
They should have been shut down for covid violations last fall/winter and the city did issue a 1 year closure before letting them reopen this spring.  But they had to do that because they let other places reopen after 100s of covid violations like, again, the wheelhouse who racked up 275 covid violations


I want the law to apply the same to all, that’s it. And we don’t apply it to all that’s why places like Reign get to stay open because they can point to dozens of examples of “see you let them stay open”

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PostSep 10, 2021#3272

dbInSouthCity wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
UrbanW5 wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
Wherever they were at last. I would say if it’s outside a front door it’s pretty damning. Looks like they’ve also had issues with masks and social distancing. Just a general disregard for the welfare of the public.

I don’t know if you are connected with that place or you think businesses shouldn’t worry about externalities but I can’t see why anyone would be okay with a business completely disregarding health and safety even if they are technically correct.
They should have been shut down for covid violations last fall/winter and the city did issue a 1 year closure before letting them reopen this spring. But they had to do that because they let other places reopen after 100s of covid violations like, again, the wheelhouse who racked up 275 covid violations

Cool then shut the wheelhouse down. I don’t have time for this whataboutism conservative tactic where we can’t hold any business to account because it may have happened before. If you have a problem with those other places than report them too

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PostSep 10, 2021#3273

dbInSouthCity wrote:
UrbanW5 wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
Wherever they were at last. I would say if it’s outside a front door it’s pretty damning. Looks like they’ve also had issues with masks and social distancing. Just a general disregard for the welfare of the public.

I don’t know if you are connected with that place or you think businesses shouldn’t worry about externalities but I can’t see why anyone would be okay with a business completely disregarding health and safety even if they are technically correct.
They should have been shut down for covid violations last fall/winter and the city did issue a 1 year closure before letting them reopen this spring.  But they had to do that because they let other places reopen after 100s of covid violations like, again, the wheelhouse who racked up 275 covid violations


I want the law to apply the same to all, that’s it.
It should apply to everyone breaking the law! Whoever break it needs to pay!! I agree 💯!!!


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PostSep 10, 2021#3274

Reign Restaurant hearing begins with video of gunfight (includes video of the incident)

https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... op-story-1

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PostSep 10, 2021#3275

UrbanW5 wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
dbInSouthCity wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
UrbanW5 wrote:
Sep 10, 2021
Wherever they were at last. I would say if it’s outside a front door it’s pretty damning. Looks like they’ve also had issues with masks and social distancing. Just a general disregard for the welfare of the public.

I don’t know if you are connected with that place or you think businesses shouldn’t worry about externalities but I can’t see why anyone would be okay with a business completely disregarding health and safety even if they are technically correct.
They should have been shut down for covid violations last fall/winter and the city did issue a 1 year closure before letting them reopen this spring.  But they had to do that because they let other places reopen after 100s of covid violations like, again, the wheelhouse who racked up 275 covid violations

Cool then shut the wheelhouse down. I don’t have time for this whataboutism conservative tactic where we can’t hold any business to account because it may have happened before. If you have a problem with those other places than report them too
Wheelhouse and Start Bar both got shut down for not following the rules. 

https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... 4fdcd.html

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