^ i thought the plan was to shift some of the zoo-adjacent parking to this site to free up the land for future zoo expansion. as usual, cars f*cking ruin everything.
^ Pretty sure that is the plan. Hence them leaving the garage there. I think the reason it hasn’t happened yet has less to do with cars than it does with the Zoo being able to finance a massive expansion after just taking on the North County project and completing the new primate exhibit.
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^ i just meant that the "necessity" of car parking precludes the best use of both sites regardless of timeline.
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I recall talk of a zoo-themed hotel. Was that just urbanSTL speculation?
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No, that was featured in the Post-Dispatch and Biz Journal several years back. The zoo had renderings for a gondola that would go over the highway, among other things, such as a hotel and I believe restaurant.
It definitely wasn't some urbanstl fever dream.
It definitely wasn't some urbanstl fever dream.
Yeah I also think I remember a specific idea for a hotel. I know there were some nextSTL “what should be” articles, but I think the Zoo’s original “proposal” included a hotel near Hampton and Oakland.
Yes, recall that as well. Intention being to move parking to other side of freeway and redevelop a good part of surface lot as more zoo attractionKansasCitian wrote: ↑Aug 19, 2021No, that was featured in the Post-Dispatch and Biz Journal several years back. The zoo had renderings for a gondola that would go over the highway, among other things, such as a hotel and I believe restaurant.
It definitely wasn't some urbanstl fever dream.
I think it is a good plan overall for the site but must include some type of theme hotel (it would be nice if it include eatery/water park as well) to a tax generator feature such as sales tax back into the equation. But it would also go a long ways in securing more our of region/out of state visitors.
I think the plan was somewhat dense for the site and included
- Zoo offices, conference space
- Structured parking
- Hotel
- Gondala
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I would love to see a zoo-themed water park.
It could be a huge hit if done well.
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It could be a huge hit if done well.
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Sharks, stingrays, and alligators in the wave pool.KansasCitian wrote: ↑Aug 19, 2021I would love to see a zoo-themed water park.
It could be a huge hit if done well.
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Penguins on the slides with you.
25-30 year plan
Stl mag
https://www.stlmag.com/news/saint-louis ... -30-years/
Post dispatch
https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/gov ... 25794.html
Biz journal
https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/mor ... -plan.html
Next Stl (a few years earlier)
https://nextstl.com/2013/09/beyond-the- ... -30-years/
Stl mag
https://www.stlmag.com/news/saint-louis ... -30-years/
Post dispatch
https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/gov ... 25794.html
Biz journal
https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/mor ... -plan.html
Next Stl (a few years earlier)
https://nextstl.com/2013/09/beyond-the- ... -30-years/
Thanks Jshank83
Forgot how well of a write up Alex had on conceptual plan that was floated. As far as Alex comment on possible residential. I don't think that should be desired for this site. Honestly, rather see Forest Park Community College campus consolidated more, improve the street grid around community college & some of that space utilized for housing rather than the Hospital site. Zoo has a huge opportunity for zoo specific activities and zoo theme attractions for this site.
One thought that I didn't express was is what will help keep St. Louis Zoo a world wide recognition? Part of it is a expanded footprint and space for animals and programs. The other I think and most I think would agree is that the Forest Park Hospital Site offers an unique opportunity to relocate offices but more importantly expand research/educational/conference space. So hope they would go bigger with that thought.
Just be nice to hear a peep or two on any proposed tweaks and progress on the site. Land banking is brutal even if the outcome will be for the better.
Forgot how well of a write up Alex had on conceptual plan that was floated. As far as Alex comment on possible residential. I don't think that should be desired for this site. Honestly, rather see Forest Park Community College campus consolidated more, improve the street grid around community college & some of that space utilized for housing rather than the Hospital site. Zoo has a huge opportunity for zoo specific activities and zoo theme attractions for this site.
One thought that I didn't express was is what will help keep St. Louis Zoo a world wide recognition? Part of it is a expanded footprint and space for animals and programs. The other I think and most I think would agree is that the Forest Park Hospital Site offers an unique opportunity to relocate offices but more importantly expand research/educational/conference space. So hope they would go bigger with that thought.
Just be nice to hear a peep or two on any proposed tweaks and progress on the site. Land banking is brutal even if the outcome will be for the better.
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My understanding is nothing is going on with the old hospital site... the WildCare Park is the belle of the ball.addxb2 wrote: ↑Aug 13, 2021With all this talk of population, I’ve gotten latched to the idea that the zoo is really failing the City by land banking the old hospital site. It could be a great mixed-use development that could generate millions annually for the city.
I’ve considered attending the next ZMD meeting or writing a letter to mention it (scary, I know).
Has anyone heard of internal progress or next steps that I should be aware of?
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The Zoo already has plenty of those spaces that they waste and don't use, like about 75% of the Nutrition Center.dredger wrote: ↑Aug 20, 2021The other I think and most I think would agree is that the Forest Park Hospital Site offers an unique opportunity to relocate offices but more importantly expand research/educational/conference space. So hope they would go bigger with that thought.
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I miss Alex and his commentary. He was almost single handedly the reason I got interested in the STL urbanism scene (I'm sure I'm not alone here)
I wish he would come back and do a 2020 census analysis post on NextSTL for old times sake, his analysis and voice on the scene was the gold standard.
Hope he is doing well wherever he is these days.
I wish he would come back and do a 2020 census analysis post on NextSTL for old times sake, his analysis and voice on the scene was the gold standard.
Hope he is doing well wherever he is these days.
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^ agree. urbanreviewstl and builtstlouis were the spark for me, but when nextstl reached its peak it injected a lot of positivity and hope into the community (though things are arguably even better now in terms of progress).
Alex is in Cincy now—director of development at UC Cancer Center, which i think is similar to the position he had at WashU.
i believe his wife, an MD, was offered a position as the head of some department at Cincy Children's hospital.
as far as i can tell he no longer has any urban-focused media presence.
Alex is in Cincy now—director of development at UC Cancer Center, which i think is similar to the position he had at WashU.
i believe his wife, an MD, was offered a position as the head of some department at Cincy Children's hospital.
as far as i can tell he no longer has any urban-focused media presence.
My thoughts are along the line of relocating and consolidating on the northside of I64 to Hospital Site. Frees up more space along with surface for essentially more space for the zoo animals & more exhibits if that is really the right word. In other words, get as many human/admin activities not related to directly to the animals and their care to southside out of the zoo itself.Trololzilla wrote: ↑Aug 20, 2021The Zoo already has plenty of those spaces that they waste and don't use, like about 75% of the Nutrition Center.dredger wrote: ↑Aug 20, 2021The other I think and most I think would agree is that the Forest Park Hospital Site offers an unique opportunity to relocate offices but more importantly expand research/educational/conference space. So hope they would go bigger with that thought.
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Right, that's noted in the Zoo's published long-term plan - move everything besides the Nutrition Center and a few other critical departments to the South Campus. The problem is the Zoo isn't as benevolent as a lot of people in STL seem to think it is: there's enough politics going on behind the scenes to make D.C. blush (though that's fairly typical for the Zoo/Aquarium industry), and certain projects they've been undertaking aren't for the benefit of animals or conservation, but rather more for the benefit of certain administrators. The Zoo also doesn't really seem to care about research, since they don't really use the labs they have (and they have a good amount of very nice lab space) and are agnostic at best regarding education programs.dredger wrote: ↑Aug 20, 2021My thoughts are along the line of relocating and consolidating on the northside of I64 to Hospital Site. Frees up more space along with surface for essentially more space for the zoo animals & more exhibits if that is really the right word. In other words, get as many human/admin activities not related to directly to the animals and their care to southside out of the zoo itself.Trololzilla wrote: ↑Aug 20, 2021The Zoo already has plenty of those spaces that they waste and don't use, like about 75% of the Nutrition Center.dredger wrote: ↑Aug 20, 2021The other I think and most I think would agree is that the Forest Park Hospital Site offers an unique opportunity to relocate offices but more importantly expand research/educational/conference space. So hope they would go bigger with that thought.
The entire North County campus is also something of a farce as well (included in that 'benefitting certain people more than animals' category). It should focus primarily on continental (i.e. North American) conservation efforts, not on forcing a safari park where one shouldn't be. Leave the more exotic animals to the zoo proper.
Former publisher of the Riverfront Times, current publisher of St. Louis Magazine, longtime contributor to KETC's Donnybrook.aprice wrote: ↑Oct 21, 2021Who is Ray Hartmann?
He has a continuous hard-on about the free zoo.
Doesn't charging for parking accomplish the same thing?
Doesn't charging for parking accomplish the same thing?
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This isn't a sword I'm willing to fall on, or a hill I'm willing to die on, but I totally think non-residents should pay to go to the zoo.
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Sort of, but there is a lot of free parking in the park that’s a short and very pleasant walk.quincunx wrote:He has a continuous hard-on about the free zoo.
Doesn't charging for parking accomplish the same thing?
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It doesn't. Residents and non-residents are charged the same rate for parking.quincunx wrote: ↑Oct 21, 2021Doesn't charging for parking accomplish the same thing?
I think charging admission is a slippery slope. First it's tourists, then it's St. Charles County, then it's STL City/County. Also when you start charging admission for non residents that means everyone has to start carrying an ID to prove they are a resident, which I don't love, like what about kids or undocumented people? Or if you just forget your ID after going all the way over there? The openness of these institutions is one of their strengths.