sc4mayor
sc4mayor

PostJan 13, 2020#5826

^ I like the overall idea.  But I would simply consolidate all of the current air service into the Main Terminal, build out the single FIS checkpoint in B concourse, consolidate rental car facilities over there in some way.  Then use the East Terminal for your incubator idea.  It's a nicer building, more glass, more natural light, higher ceilings etc.  Built in MetroLink and parking and whatnot.

Regardless, any plan for the future of the airport, startups or not, needs to have all the airlines in one terminal.

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PostJan 14, 2020#5827

sc4mayor wrote:
Jan 13, 2020
^ I like the overall idea.  But I would simply consolidate all of the current air service into the Main Terminal, build out the single FIS checkpoint in B concourse, consolidate rental car facilities over there in some way.  Then use the East Terminal for your incubator idea.  It's a nicer building, more glass, more natural light, higher ceilings etc.  Built in MetroLink and parking and whatnot.

Regardless, any plan for the future of the airport, startups or not, needs to have all the airlines in one terminal.
I love this idea for a couple reasons.
   
1) Terminal 1 ticket area and baggage area could handle current and future traffic for considerable future.   Heck, it handled TWA hub with at a lot more passengers
2) You could rebuild A & C as one long linear concourse (think Delta's Detroit) with new single FIS checkpoint where concourse B is.  Put Southwest on side, all others on the other side and 3-4 new international gates in the middle.   New concourse would still be fraction of new terminal cost, relocation.   Call it Phase I with an underground chamber built for future metrolink station or automated people mover or both.  Call it Phase I.  
3) Take metrolink underground with single airport station under B/new single FIS - escalators go up to non secure/baggage side of Terminal 1.   This also gives a way to extend metrolink west - whether it goes to Earth City & stops or one day into St. Charles.  Also lines up nice for Lindbergh Ave station/hotels stop.   Call it Phase II
4) Frees up space where Concourse D is for future on site parking/consolidated parking.   Maybe add a future automated people mover or moving sidewalks from Terminal 2/existing parking, stop at new CCR.  Call it Phase III and put out as PPP, and or privatization (privately financed with operator guaranteed x years of revenue generation) 
5) Terminal 2 becomes new incubator, office, hotel and so on connected via automated people mover and moving sidewalks.  Put it out PPP   

Understand that it would be least favorite idea as far as Southwest goes.   However, I can see it funded by the region and separate of bond & tax measures that would not add debt to airport & therefore keeps runway fees, landing fees, etc. on downward trend.   Heck, I see the county entertaining the idea of using metrolink tax funds to realign metrolink, new airport station and short extension west to Lindbergh Ave or Earth City first over Daniel Boone line if they got a piece of the airport

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PostJan 15, 2020#5828

Sorry if I've lived under a rock but has there been any serious consideration of building a new terminal/concourse to replace the old ones? I would think that would be the last thing they would want to do considering they still have a massive amount of empty space and are nowhere near capacity. Plus they are still paying off debt from runway 11/29 correct?

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PostJan 16, 2020#5829

Perseus767 wrote:
Jan 15, 2020
Sorry if I've lived under a rock but has there been any serious consideration of building a new terminal/concourse to replace the old ones? I would think that would be the last thing they would want to do considering they still have a massive amount of empty space and are nowhere near capacity. Plus they are still paying off debt from runway 11/29 correct?
No. It has just all been speculation on message boards/twitter/etc. 

Yes, still more debt to go. 

PostJan 18, 2020#5830

Got a bunch of stats. Just putting them all in here in one post.
February 2020 Frequency Numbers

Flights - YoY change by week
Southwest 734 +22 (+3%)
AA 254 -1 (-0.4%)
UA 196 +15 (+8.3%)
Delta 183 -9 (4.7%)
Frontier 29 -8 (-21.6%)
Air Canada 21 +1 (+5%)
Allegiant 20 +1 (+5.3%)
Alaska 6 -7 (-54%)
Sun Country 4 FLAT

STL Total 1612 +31 (1.9%)


Seats - YoY Seat Change (Based on Mondays only)
UA 1753 +10.46%
DL 3419 +7.85% 
AA 4465 +5.53%

Notes
UA mainline to EWR starts.
AA starts a A321 to CLT. Been a long time since they had A321s here. 
Southwest RDU goes back to daily mon-fri
Apple Vacations to HUX/Cabo start back up. Run by VivaAerobus this year. 


Full Spreadsheet
Full Spreadsheet

_____________________

July INTL Load Factor

Southwest Montego Bay 97%
Southwest Cancun 96%
Frontier Cancun 96%
Volaris/Apple Cabo 93%
Volaris/Apple Puerto Vallarta 93%
Air Canada 83.5%
Frontier Punta Cana 63%

________________________

April changes after Southwest MAX schedule change 

Change from original schedule
-9 Mon-Fri
-6 Saturday
-29 Sunday
-80 flights a week total (-9.4%)

Hartford goes to Sun only
SFO Sat/Sun only

Outbound changes (inbound and outbound don't match)
+1 
Sun San Diego
Sat Fort Lauderdale
Mon-Fri KC

-1 
Sun Baltimore/DEN/KC/Vegas/LAX/Nashville/OMA/Orlando/PHL/PHX/San Antonio
Sat Baltimore/BOS/CHI/Detroit/KC/Nashville/RDU
Mon-Fri CHI/CLE/Columbus/Fort Myers/HOU/LAX/MSP/PIT/San Diego/SFO

-2
Sun Fort Myers/New Orleans/RDU

-3
Sun TPA

-4
Sun CHI/DAL

I didn't update April/May after the groundings last year so I am not sure how that compares to what were flown last year. Original schedule last year was about 40 more than this schedule.

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PostJan 18, 2020#5831

That's a pretty big MAX related cut. Guessing the legacies increasing seats by a good number is related to this? Since the demand growth from STL is outpacing available seats now due to the MAX issues so others are trying to grab some market share during this time. This summer might be tough on seat avaialbility going somewhere and costs rising if its not fixed, hopefully theres enough growth outside of Southwest to get enough seats in.

Hopefully the MAX issues are resolved eventually since St. Louis is possibly one of the most exposed markets in the world to the grounding due to having one of if not the largest market share Southwest has in any metro area aviation market.

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PostJan 18, 2020#5832

imperialmog wrote:
Jan 18, 2020
That's a pretty big MAX related cut. Guessing the legacies increasing seats by a good number is related to this? Since the demand growth from STL is outpacing available seats now due to the MAX issues so others are trying to grab some market share during this time. This summer might be tough on seat avaialbility going somewhere and costs rising if its not fixed, hopefully theres enough growth outside of Southwest to get enough seats in.

Hopefully the MAX issues are resolved eventually since St. Louis is possibly one of the most exposed markets in the world to the grounding due to having one of if not the largest market share Southwest has in any metro area aviation market.
Prices have pushed up in March for sure to Florida with the cut backs and high demand. I haven’t dug into the other airlines numbers for March-May yet. But united and American have their own max issues to a lesser extent. I would guess the connecting % thru here has been lower than normal. I think I remember Rhonda saying some months connecting has actually be down while local travelers account for the growth.

I just can’t imagine the MAX isn’t back by summer but I thought it would be back by Christmas. So who knows.

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PostJan 18, 2020#5833

Crazy that United now has more flights than Delta, but half the seat capacity. 

What's the story with Alaska cutting over half their flights? Is that also MAX related? 

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PostJan 18, 2020#5834

wabash wrote:
Jan 18, 2020
Crazy that United now has more flights than Delta, but half the seat capacity. 

What's the story with Alaska cutting over half their flights? Is that also MAX related? 
I "heard" it was that they are refocusing and Seattle and then west coast in general with Southwest expanding so much out there and now Delta expanding in Seattle. Trying to retrench in their home turf. They cut a  bunch of west coast to midwest flying. KC-San Diego/SFO, Nashville-SFO, STL-San Diego, Oma-San Diego, etc. Lots of San Diego and SFO cuts. I think they added more flights up and down the west coast with those planes.

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PostJan 19, 2020#5835

wabash wrote:
Jan 18, 2020
Crazy that United now has more flights than Delta, but half the seat capacity. 
Yep, UA is primarily RJs and DL mostly mainline.

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PostFeb 05, 2020#5836

Starting June 10 Contour Airlines is starting nonstop service to Indy. $99 each way. 2x weekday 1x weekend.

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PostFeb 05, 2020#5837

jshank83 wrote:
Feb 05, 2020
Starting June 10 Contour Airlines is starting nonstop service to Indy. $99 each way. 2x weekday 1x weekend.
Looking at their route map, this seems odd.  This would be the only route connecting 2 major metro areas rather than the standard metro area to EAS area.

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PostFeb 05, 2020#5838

I thought that was odd too. Although, I’m glad we add another non-stop destination. I can strike Indy off the list. Albuquerque, Memphis, Birmingham and Buffalo are the other contiguous domestics I’d like to see added.

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PostFeb 05, 2020#5839

I am driving to Indy,  no amount of coaxing is going to get me on those puddle jumpers.  Nope!!!!!!

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PostFeb 05, 2020#5840

This is a newer growth strategy for Contour, seems to be a focus of their time at Rotues America. Indianapolis is a big winner here with connections to three major MSA's but happy St. Louis is included. 

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PostFeb 05, 2020#5841

Reading press releases, this is part of an effort to build a second focus city (after Santa Barbara California) and establish a base in Indy.  Their network begins with 3 cities - St. Louis, Pittsburgh and Nashville but their goal is more growth.   They may be smaller planes but I would not have passed up the opportunity.

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PostFeb 06, 2020#5842

Thoughts on these terminal update ideas?

I’m a hard no on B.

A I’m fine with.

C, I would need convincing that more income could be made so airlines fees don’t go way up.

https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/new ... yptr=yahoo

sc4mayor
sc4mayor

PostFeb 06, 2020#5843

That link is paywalled so here are the details.  Consultants provided three options for improving Lambert.  One was a "no build" re-arranging, two was decommissioning the East Terminal and consolidating everything in a fully renovated Main Terminal and the third option was a full new terminal.

Option One ($141 million).  Southwest is consolidated into T1 and "others" are moved to T2.

Terminal 1's security checkpoints would be relocated to the same level as the check-in hall, allowing for greater airline operational flexibility between its three concourses. (Two concourses, called B and D, are not used for air service).  The report also envisioned adding new retail nodes at the entrances of Concourses A and C, and a new customs facility within Concourse B, replacing the current facility in Terminal 2.  Positives include that "demand would be better balanced across the terminal campus, with capacity available to enable future growth by all carriers. Current pressure on curbside access at Terminal 2 would be relieved," the report said.  Among the downsides are that congestion could be seen at check-in and passenger screening. "The building envelope of Concourse B constrains space for future expansion and limits space for restrooms and offices," it said.
Option Two ($1.1 billion):

It calls for demolishing Concourse D, and decommissioning Concourse E in Terminal 2. Concourses A and C would be widened by 100 feet "to accommodate future up-gauge of aircraft," and Concourse C would be extended to the west. Concourse B would be refurbished with four contact gates. Two international gates would be built between Concourses B and C.  And existing security screening processes would all be moved to the upper level.  The plan also calls for rebuilding the Terminal 1 garage, and building a 4,350-space garage on the site of the existing parking lot A.
Option Three (New Terminal - $2 billion):

A new-build concept would provide "a modern structure for consolidated operations," the report said, adding that it would have 45 contact gates and two ground loading gates, with the ability to expand to 52 gates. It would encompass two levels, with departure and arrivals on the same level. A new pedestrian walking bridge could be built to connect the new facility with the MetroLink stop.  And the current Terminal 1, considered architecturally significant, "could be repurposed as new non-aeronautical development," such as a hotel, the report said.  A new six-level parking facility would be located across from the terminal, accommodating 4,830 spaces. And a new 1,800-space rental car facility would be located in the garage.  It could prove complicated, though. The document says three terminals could be in operation at once during construction, and existing movement on aircraft apron, or the area where planes are parked, would be disrupted.
Edit:  My two cents...I also would be fine with Option One.  I think moving SWA to T1 and a really high quality renovation to bring the terminal up to modern standards would solve a lot of the airport's issues in my opinion.  The main hall itself is already a fine centerpiece. 

I also like the idea of a brand new consolidated terminal in Option Three and I like the location they picked out here in terms of connecting to MetroLink and the garages...plus the rental car improvements.  But my dream of a new terminal at Lambert has always been for a mid-field terminal closer to 11/29 with access from Lindbergh Blvd.  Pros, you can basically isolate the rest of the airport's operations from construction effects, the airport can finally put 11/29 to good use too.  Cons, no good MetroLink access, land acquisition, lots of new infrastructure would need to be built etc.  Option Two would be my last choice too.

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PostFeb 06, 2020#5844

Here's the entire article if anyone wants to read it.

Consultant offered 3 options for reorganizing Lambert airport. The cost? $141M to $2B. 
By Jacob Kirn  – Economic Development Editor, St. Louis Business Journal
Feb 5, 2020, 5:22pm CST

A consultant for the city of St. Louis offered three options to fundamentally reorganize St. Louis Lambert International Airport, newly available documents show, part of the now-defunct effort to privatize the facility’s operations.
The documents give a glimpse into challenges the airport faces — and possible long-term solutions. A primary issue is that Southwest Airlines, Lambert’s largest carrier, will in coming years reach capacity in Terminal 2, while Terminal 1, home to American Airlines and others, has significant excess space, according to the city's consultant.

The 365-page report from Chicago-based aviation consultant Ricondo, crafted in December for potential Lambert bidders, lays out the options. The report could offer a blueprint for solutions at Lambert, which regional leaders agree must be improved. It’s still unclear how that could be done, as Lambert carries about $560 million in debt used to build a runway that’s underutilized, though business leaders have said they’re more engaged on tackling the issue.
Paul Payne, the city’s budget director and a member of its working group on Lambert privatization, said the Ricondo report represents "what potential options may be."

"This wasn’t 'what we’re going to do.' We never got to that point," Payne said. The city last month ended the exploration of privatization, which could have extinguished Lambert's debt and led to facility improvements.
Payne said had the city issued a request for proposals to potential Lambert operators, it would have also evaluated their ideas. Still, he said Ricondo was "very good."

"It’s a good report on all the financial, operational and planning needs of the airport, so I think it’s something that is worth sharing," Payne said.

An airport spokesman, Jeff Lea, said the airport is reviewing the Ricondo report as it works on a Federal Aviation Administration document called an Airport Layout Plan, part of the federal agency's approval process for airport development. The report has "new information that informs the airport about possibilities," Lea said.

The options presented in the report were:
  • Moving Southwest Airlines and international operations to Terminal 1, and "some other carriers would relocate to Terminal 2." Cost: $141 million.
  • Moving all carriers to Terminal 1. Terminal 2 would be "taken out of service and either decommissioned or repurposed." Cost: $1.1 billion.
  • Constructing a new, central terminal, totaling 1.1 million square feet, between Terminals 1 and 2. Cost: $2 billion.
Option 1: 'Preserve most of the existing structures'

The least expensive option would "preserve most of the existing structures and require minimal construction of new facilities," but also "meet future gate requirements with no major upfront capital investment," the report said.
Terminal 1's security checkpoints would be relocated to the same level as the check-in hall, allowing for greater airline operational flexibility between its three concourses. (Two concourses, called B and D, are not used for air service.)
The report also envisioned adding new retail nodes at the entrances of Concourses A and C, and a new customs facility within Concourse B, replacing the current facility in Terminal 2.
Positives include that "demand would be better balanced across the terminal campus, with capacity available to enable future growth by all carriers. Current pressure on curbside access at Terminal 2 would be relieved," the report said.
Among the downsides are that congestion could be seen at check-in and passenger screening. "The building envelope of Concourse B constrains space for future expansion and limits space for restrooms and offices," it said.

Option 2: Extend Terminal 1, decommission Terminal 2
This option would require reconfiguring and expanding Terminal 1 "to optimize passenger flow and capacity."
It calls for demolishing Concourse D, and decommissioning Concourse E in Terminal 2. Concourses A and C would be widened by 100 feet "to accommodate future up-gauge of aircraft," and Concourse C would be extended to the west. Concourse B would be refurbished with four contact gates. Two international gates would be built between Concourses B and C.
And existing security screening processes would all be moved to the upper level.
The plan also calls for rebuilding the Terminal 1 garage, and building a 4,350-space garage on the site of the existing parking lot A.

Option 3: A new terminal
A new-build concept would provide "a modern structure for consolidated operations," the report said, adding that it would have 45 contact gates and two ground loading gates, with the ability to expand to 52 gates. It would encompass two levels, with departure and arrivals on the same level. A new pedestrian walking bridge could be built to connect the new facility with the MetroLink stop.
And the current Terminal 1, considered architecturally significant, "could be repurposed as new non-aeronautical development," such as a hotel, the report said.

A new six-level parking facility would be located across from the terminal, accommodating 4,830 spaces. And a new 1,800-space rental car facility would be located in the garage.
It could prove complicated, though. The document says three terminals could be in operation at once during construction, and existing movement on aircraft apron, or the area where planes are parked, would be disrupted.

PostFeb 06, 2020#5845

STLCityMike wrote:
Feb 05, 2020
Reading press releases, this is part of an effort to build a second focus city (after Santa Barbara California) and establish a base in Indy.  Their network begins with 3 cities - St. Louis, Pittsburgh and Nashville but their goal is more growth.   They may be smaller planes but I would not have passed up the opportunity.
Per the Indy Star -- Indiana is subsidizing this.

From the article,
"The Indiana Economic Development Corporation is offering Corporate Flight Management Inc., which does business as Contour Airlines, a minimum revenue guarantee of up to $1.5 million that the company would earn if it does not meet its minimum revenue targets for the routes. 

The state has also offered up to $550,000 in performance-based tax credits based on the company's job creation plans. Contour will only be able to claim the incentives once Indiana workers are hired."
Full paywall article below.

New airline coming to Indianapolis International Airport to offer flights to nearby cities
Alexandria Burris, Indianapolis StarPublished 11:28 a.m. ET Feb. 5, 2020 | Updated 5:46 p.m. ET Feb. 5, 2020

Areas with millions of people have no direct air routes from Indianapolis. Indianapolis Star

A new carrier is coming to Indianapolis International Airport, airport and state officials said at a news conference Wednesday morning.
Contour Airlines, based out of Smyrna, Tennessee, will offer non-stop daily service to Nashville, St. Louis and Pittsburgh beginning June 10, officials announced at the Routes Americas 2020 aviation conference at the JW Marriott Indianapolis. 

Currently there are no non-stop flights from Indianapolis to those cities. Adding those markets brings the total non-stop destinations available from IND to 53.
  (Photo: Jay Calderon/The Desert Sun)

"We look for major markets that don't have any nonstop service so we don't compete against any other carrier in any of the markets we serve," Matt Chaifetz, Contour's chief executive officer, said. "When we looked at Indy, we looked at all the markets we thought would be a good fit. The greatest number of them started and ended in Indianapolis so it kind of made sense to plant our flag here."


Contour Airlines flies Embraer regional jets on several local routes. The airline offers low-fare flights with limited-time introductory fares of $99 each way. Flights can be purchased now. The introductory fare sale ends on Wednesday, Feb. 19. 

After the sale, all markets will have regular fares beginning at $119 each way. 

Contour advertises its planes, many of which seat 30, as featuring leather seating with expanded legroom in every row. The airline also provides complimentary in-flight snack and drink service. 

St. Louis, Nashville and Pittsburgh are considered "drive markets," or cities so close to Indianapolis that travelers can drive to them within a few hours. Airport officials previously told IndyStar that they recognized St. Louis and Pittsburgh as key markets for airline connectivity. 

Jim Schellinger, Secretary of Commerce for the State of Indiana, at an announcement by Contour Aviation to beef up direct flights with service to out-of-state cities Nashville, St. Louis, and Pittsburgh, Indianapolis, Wednesday, Feb. 5, 2020.  (Photo: Robert Scheer/IndyStar)

Mario Rodriguez, the Indianapolis Airport Authority's executive director, said drive markets are typically the most difficult routes to land because of the lack of available data to substantiate demand for them. But, he said business traffic to these three cities is "solid." 
Buy Photo
Contour Airlines' three new routes will bring the total number of nonstop destinations from Indianapolis International Airport to 53. (Photo: Stephen J. Beard/IndyStar)

"The principle reason for having the routes right here is having all of these people understand what the market is," Rodriguez said. 
To support its growth in Indiana, Contour plans to create up to 55 jobs in Central Indiana by the end of 2023. The company is purchasing additional ERJ-135/145 aircraft and plans to invest in a base of operations in Indianapolis.   The company plans to immediately begin hiring pilots, flight attendants, customer service agents, ground personnel and mechanics.
Buy Photo
Steven Small (left), Joe Hogsett, Matt Chaifetz, and Jim Schellinger at an announcement by Contour Aviation to beef up direct flights with service to out-of-state cities Nashville, St. Louis, and Pittsburgh, Indianapolis, Wednesday, Feb. 5, 2020. (Photo: Robert Scheer/IndyStar)

Indianapolis will be the airline's second "focus city," a destination where it operates multiple nonstop flights. Contour's first focus city was Santa Barbara, California. 
The Indiana Economic Development Corporation is offering Corporate Flight Management Inc., which does business as Contour Airlines, a minimum revenue guarantee of up to $1.5 million that the company would earn if it does not meet its minimum revenue targets for the routes. 

The state has also offered up to $550,000 in performance-based tax credits based on the company's job creation plans. Contour will only be able to claim the incentives once Indiana workers are hired. 

PostFeb 06, 2020#5846

jshank83 wrote:
Feb 06, 2020
Thoughts on these terminal update ideas?

I’m a hard no on B.

A I’m fine with.

C, I would need convincing that more income could be made so airlines fees don’t go way up.

https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/new ... yptr=yahoo
The best option, in this case, is the cheapest (A).  I can't see WN packing up shop and moving into The C Concourse, however, especially when they're spending millions for a new baggage carousel.

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PostFeb 06, 2020#5847

frequentflyer wrote:Here's the entire article if anyone want to read it.

Consultant offered 3 options for reorganizing Lambert airport. The cost? $141M to $2B. 
By Jacob Kirn  – Economic Development Editor, St. Louis Business Journal
Feb 5, 2020, 5:22pm CST

A consultant for the city of St. Louis offered three options to fundamentally reorganize St. Louis Lambert International Airport, newly available documents show, part of the now-defunct effort to privatize the facility’s operations.
The documents give a glimpse into challenges the airport faces — and possible long-term solutions. A primary issue is that Southwest Airlines, Lambert’s largest carrier, will in coming years reach capacity in Terminal 2, while Terminal 1, home to American Airlines and others, has significant excess space, according to the city's consultant.

The 365-page report from Chicago-based aviation consultant Ricondo, crafted in December for potential Lambert bidders, lays out the options. The report could offer a blueprint for solutions at Lambert, which regional leaders agree must be improved. It’s still unclear how that could be done, as Lambert carries about $560 million in debt used to build a runway that’s underutilized, though business leaders have said they’re more engaged on tackling the issue.
Paul Payne, the city’s budget director and a member of its working group on Lambert privatization, said the Ricondo report represents "what potential options may be."

"This wasn’t 'what we’re going to do.' We never got to that point," Payne said. The city last month ended the exploration of privatization, which could have extinguished Lambert's debt and led to facility improvements.
Payne said had the city issued a request for proposals to potential Lambert operators, it would have also evaluated their ideas. Still, he said Ricondo was "very good."

"It’s a good report on all the financial, operational and planning needs of the airport, so I think it’s something that is worth sharing," Payne said.

An airport spokesman, Jeff Lea, said the airport is reviewing the Ricondo report as it works on a Federal Aviation Administration document called an Airport Layout Plan, part of the federal agency's approval process for airport development. The report has "new information that informs the airport about possibilities," Lea said.

The options presented in the report were:
  • Moving Southwest Airlines and international operations to Terminal 1, and "some other carriers would relocate to Terminal 2." Cost: $141 million.
  • Moving all carriers to Terminal 1. Terminal 2 would be "taken out of service and either decommissioned or repurposed." Cost: $1.1 billion.
  • Constructing a new, central terminal, totaling 1.1 million square feet, between Terminals 1 and 2. Cost: $2 billion.
Option 1: 'Preserve most of the existing structures'

The least expensive option would "preserve most of the existing structures and require minimal construction of new facilities," but also "meet future gate requirements with no major upfront capital investment," the report said.
Terminal 1's security checkpoints would be relocated to the same level as the check-in hall, allowing for greater airline operational flexibility between its three concourses. (Two concourses, called B and D, are not used for air service.)
The report also envisioned adding new retail nodes at the entrances of Concourses A and C, and a new customs facility within Concourse B, replacing the current facility in Terminal 2.
Positives include that "demand would be better balanced across the terminal campus, with capacity available to enable future growth by all carriers. Current pressure on curbside access at Terminal 2 would be relieved," the report said.
Among the downsides are that congestion could be seen at check-in and passenger screening. "The building envelope of Concourse B constrains space for future expansion and limits space for restrooms and offices," it said.

Option 2: Extend Terminal 1, decommission Terminal 2
This option would require reconfiguring and expanding Terminal 1 "to optimize passenger flow and capacity."
It calls for demolishing Concourse D, and decommissioning Concourse E in Terminal 2. Concourses A and C would be widened by 100 feet "to accommodate future up-gauge of aircraft," and Concourse C would be extended to the west. Concourse B would be refurbished with four contact gates. Two international gates would be built between Concourses B and C.
And existing security screening processes would all be moved to the upper level.
The plan also calls for rebuilding the Terminal 1 garage, and building a 4,350-space garage on the site of the existing parking lot A.

Option 3: A new terminal
A new-build concept would provide "a modern structure for consolidated operations," the report said, adding that it would have 45 contact gates and two ground loading gates, with the ability to expand to 52 gates. It would encompass two levels, with departure and arrivals on the same level. A new pedestrian walking bridge could be built to connect the new facility with the MetroLink stop.
And the current Terminal 1, considered architecturally significant, "could be repurposed as new non-aeronautical development," such as a hotel, the report said.

A new six-level parking facility would be located across from the terminal, accommodating 4,830 spaces. And a new 1,800-space rental car facility would be located in the garage.
It could prove complicated, though. The document says three terminals could be in operation at once during construction, and existing movement on aircraft apron, or the area where planes are parked, would be disrupted.
Is this axed due to the ending of the privatization process? It sounds like this is what the airport wants done either way


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PostFeb 06, 2020#5848

Hands Off!!!!!










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PostFeb 06, 2020#5849

^^ No, none of this was ever formally introduced.  It is very likely one of these options will be pursued in the near future though, Southwest keeps growing and there really isn't anymore capacity in T2.  The silver lining in this airport privatization failure is the trove of information and data that the airport and city now have at their disposal to move forward.  All paid for by an outside party too.  The business community seems to have woken up as well, and recent reporting suggests they've been meeting with Southwest executives (apparently one meeting just days before they pushed Krewson to kill privatization).

I think something along the lines of option one is coming regardless.  From what I understand the only reason it hasn't happened yet is because Southwest up to this point has refused to share a terminal.  T2 was originally built for Southwest and they apparently don't want to leave it.

frequentflyer wrote:The best option, in this case, is the cheapest (A).  I can't see WN packing up shop and moving into The C Concourse, however, especially when they're spending millions for a new baggage carousel.
Pretty sure that baggage expansion has been put on hold...at least I think I saw that here.  My guess is Southwest could be persuaded to move provided a deal could be worked out.  Even with the ability to add gates in D and a potential new carousel, they can't do anything about easing the pickup/drop-off traffic or about space in the check-in area.  Either they would have to spend even more money to fix all of those issues, or they could just move where all that extra capacity already exists.

framer wrote:Hands Off!!!!!
That beauty ain't going anywhere.  I personally really like the idea of turning it into a hotel of some kind provided a new terminal had been selected as the way forward.  Kind of like the old TWA Terminal at JFK.  But I honestly think she'll end up centering a newly consolidated terminal structure before anything else.

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PostFeb 06, 2020#5850

In my opinion, Option 1 is the way to go. The main terminal building is a landmark, make that the home of our busiest airline in and out of St. Louis. The recent renovations made it better but a few more dollars could make it better if they really wanted to. 

Option 3 is iffy in my opinion. The layout and logistics of moving planes around just wouldn't make sense. Also, imagine getting off of a plane on the East End and having to connect to some other flight on the West End. That would be a hike to take. For people who would take Metro, this isn't a good configuration. It would be a giant mess for operations, passenger flow, and other things. On the bright side, at least it saves the main terminal. 

Option 2 is the worst of the plans. It would alter the main terminal way too much to where it probably wouldn't even resemble how it does today. It's just a wacky plan all around.

I know these are all concepts but we have to be real here, Option 1 is really the only option that's really worth anything at this point in time. If they so badly want a new terminal, go visit some of the new airports built or being built throughout the country and learn a thing or two because the concept site plan they came up with isn't good at all.

On another note, I would love to see us pick up some bigger airline names and get expanded services for other airlines at Lambert. The smaller airlines can go to MidAmerica after the MetroLink expansion is completed. It will actually give that airport a usage 

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