urbanSTL

Downtown1999 wrote: ↑

Aug 22, 2021

OnTheEdge wrote:

Downtown1999 wrote: ↑

Aug 22, 2021

 Anyone interested in further discussions regarding Reign should listen. It’s informative:  

Man, that was a little tough to listen to.  A microcosm of the STL in a nutshell.  I can empathize with both parties in that interview - the interviewer wanting to protect their community - and the business owner wanting to maximize success of their business venture - but at the same time also cringe at the level of thinly veiled racist statements from the interviewer and disingenuous statements from the interviewee.

Could the interviewer be any more clear without saying it that they don't want African American's representing hip hop culture enjoying nightlife in their community?  That, mind you, was a club district before it was a residential community.

Hip hop culture is beautiful.  St. Louis should be celebrating its art and diversity.  Not trying to put a lid on it.

In my opinion, anyone who's buys on Washington Ave and doesn't expect to hear some degree of clubbing, especially on weekend nights, well, I'm sorry for them for not doing their homework before making a big investment, but hey, that's the neighborhood you bought in.

Of course, that said, I'm not excusing it when things get criminally out of hand, and that is clearly what the interviewer is concerned with, and justifiably so, as it's a safety concern anyone should be concerned with....  And I think this brings us back to policing....  Which is an entirely different can of worms....

IMHO, this is just yet another symptom of a much larger issue: Marginalization of the have nots and how much the happenstance of being born into a specific zip code in the STL impacts your future.

The real solution is for the region to act as one and equalize opportunity as much as possible.  This approach will take possibly an a act of god (i.e. some sort of reuniting of the city/county at a minimum, more even distribution of tax dollars for school funding, etc, etc, etc) and even then will maybe take a generation or so to start seeing the dividends.  Not that it's not worth doing, it's just that there's no quick fix there.

In the meantime, hopefully leadership can mitigate things as best as possible to keep things as copacetic as possible.

“Could the interviewer be any more clear without saying it that they don't want African American's representing hip hop culture enjoying nightlife in their community?  That, mind you, was a club district before it was a residential community.”

It WAS a club district. The clubs were allowed in to help the speculators/owners carry their vacant, deteriorating, historic warehouses. But when McGowans, Pyramid, LoftWorks & others redeveloped Downtown they had to first kick the clubs out. You cannot truly sound proof a building w/o spending millions and even then it is never adequate if residents are above.

McGowans built Lucas Park Grille, but the first 3 floors above were made office. This buffered sound transmitted some, and McGowans knew they needed a restaurant destination.

Orchard Development followed suit and built Red Moon (now Blood & Sand) but had the insight to write into their own HOA bylaws some controls so as to avoid future loud venues.

Most developers of lofts failed to copy the Orchard plan, which protected residents in longevity.

Example: Reign. Reign is massive. That’s because developer Bill Bruce built it as a gift/passion project “ET” … Bill passed away. The portfolio was sold. And Reign now occupies the space. Check out the Vanguard Lofts comments on the rental websites. They are not good. I hear Vanguard has lost double digit occupancy since Reign moved in.

I do not hear “hip hip” once in the audio clip. Does it really matter? It’s about sound. You cannot have loud music under thousands of residents.

The idea the loft district is an “entertainment district” is something propagated by the concentration of ground floor venues. It’s far more, by square feet, a residential district. And, again, you must be concerned about sound if the two are going to mix.

Bottom line, Dana Kelly flat out lied. You don’t really acknowledge that in your post. She literally said she wouldn’t have live music, loud music or after 11 PM hours.


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JJ Rivera wrote: ↑

Aug 22, 2021

Ok all… Let’s keep professional and apolitical.
Lets bring ideas to fix this!

All I’m saying is in other major cities the place would have been closed a long time ago!

Questions is: Wash Avenue and Downtown is becoming a Residential area little by little so any Nightclub or nightclubs are going to need to relocate to venues that don’t have apartments on top!

I’m not a cop or an investigator so I have no clue but “Reign” needs to be accountable at some level. What level? I have no idea! But DT needs to evolve and we need as a community bring more businesses to DT. There’s way too many empty spaces for a DT. If we don’t stop these shooting and these low life wanna be speed racer no business will move DT.

Again lets brings ideas and no need for political and personal disrespects.


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Downtown1999 wrote: ↑

Aug 22, 2021

dbInSouthCity, I thought the discussion was Reign? But since you brought up Truth Comedy Club I guess we can go there. It’s somewhat like Reign in that, like Reign, Truth owner Rhome McGee lied to the neighborhood. He said he would be opening a comedy club. Instead he opened … well I’ll let you decide. See attached photos of Truth owner Rhome McGee at his liquor license hearing and then Rhome at his “comedy club” …





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dweebe wrote:I really think the nightclubs need to end up back on the Landing or on Locust west of Jefferson so they stop torturing the growing residential population. No more 3am licenses along Washington Ave.

JJ Rivera wrote: ↑

Aug 22, 2021

dweebe wrote:I really think the nightclubs need to end up back on the Landing or on Locust west of Jefferson so they stop torturing the growing residential population. No more 3am licenses along Washington Ave.

Agree! Washington Avenue should stay residential with retail and restaurants! That’s my opinion.


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dweebe wrote:

JJ Rivera wrote: ↑

Aug 22, 2021

dweebe wrote:I really think the nightclubs need to end up back on the Landing or on Locust west of Jefferson so they stop torturing the growing residential population. No more 3am licenses along Washington Ave.

Agree! Washington Avenue should stay residential with retail and restaurants! That’s my opinion.


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Same way there’s no 3am in the heart of Soulard. Molly’s, 1860s, Dukes all close at 1:30am. Places like Bar 101, Social House, DBs Taft have 3am permits are away from residents.

dweebe wrote: ↑

Aug 22, 2021

JJ Rivera wrote: ↑

Aug 22, 2021

dweebe wrote:I really think the nightclubs need to end up back on the Landing or on Locust west of Jefferson so they stop torturing the growing residential population. No more 3am licenses along Washington Ave.

Agree! Washington Avenue should stay residential with retail and restaurants! That’s my opinion.


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Same way there’s no 3am in the heart of Soulard. Molly’s, 1860s, Dukes all close at 1:30am. Places like Bar 101, Social House, DBs Taft have 3am permits are away from residents.

robertn42 wrote: ↑

Aug 23, 2021

Reign is a problem.  It should be closed.

I don't care about the owner's religious beliefs, race, sexual orientation, favorite foods, or anything else.

If a business creates chronic problems in the neighborhood I call home... affecting my family's quality of life and putting my investment at risk, I want it out.

Thatguy644 wrote:

robertn42 wrote: ↑

Aug 23, 2021

Reign is a problem.  It should be closed.

I don't care about the owner's religious beliefs, race, sexual orientation, favorite foods, or anything else.

If a business creates chronic problems in the neighborhood I call home... affecting my family's quality of life and putting my investment at risk, I want it out.

100 Percent Agree. Its shame how she uses race do deflect the blame. From what I see she dose not care or have interest  for downtown as a whole just a backdrop to her. Also Why has the company has not kick them out.  She has thousands behind in rent and at the same time causing the building to lose tenants. 

JJ Rivera wrote: ↑

Aug 23, 2021

Does anyone knows if there’s new loft developments happening in Downtown area?


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robertn42 wrote:Reign is a problem.  It should be closed.

I don't care about the owner's religious beliefs, race, sexual orientation, favorite foods, or anything else.

If a business creates chronic problems in the neighborhood I call home... affecting my family's quality of life and putting my investment at risk, I want it out.

Downtown1999 wrote:There is a new construction apartment building planned by Opus (very experienced) in the Cupples Station complex. It will utilize the City Treasurer’s existing garage.

There is a 184 unit new construction apartment building over retail planned for 1801 Washington Avenue. The developer is King Realty Advisors. It’s their first one.

Otherwise, there is nothing else that I know of planned.


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