urbanSTL

sc4mayor wrote: ^ Did the Moxy break ground?

Chris posted update on Moxy on the Moxy thread.   Not yet, Developer refined design, cost increased and they will be sending out docs to bid soon..

sc4mayor wrote:^ Did the Moxy break ground?

Not yet. As I have said on the Moxy thread, ground breaking is slated for later this year. They included the rendering to show what’s coming.

I wasn’t sure where to put this but I wanted to share some key highlights for St Louis this decade and still 4 months to go nothing will be in order but it’ll range from corporations crime sports construction etc. so here it goes

1. Cardinals go on to win the World Series in fact it’ll be the last time they appeared in the World Series since
2. Centene goes on major expansion spree
3. Phase 1 of Ballpark Village begins
4. Rams leave St Louis
5. Mike Brown
6. City population continues to decline but overall region remains stagnant to barely grow
7. Arch grounds get a major revamp
8. Fair St Louis is held outside of downtown for the time which was at Forest Park
9. St Louis zoo is rated number 1 in the country for the first time ever
10. Cortex gains momentum and expands rapidly
11. AT&T abandons 909 chestnut leaving a gaping whole in the CBD
12. Famous Bar is bought out by federated and several years later Macy’s shutters it’s railway exchange location leaving another whole
13. Millennium hotel shutters
14. Delmar loop trolly
15. Crime continues to be the biggest headache
16. Monsanto is bought out by Bayer
17. Express Scripts is bought out by Cigna
18. Blues win the Stanley Cup for the first time ever
19.XFL announces they’ll add a St Louis team
20. St.Louis is in advance discussion on landing a expansion MLS team
21. The Stan Span opens
22. Square enters the St Louis market adding plentiful jobs
23. 100 kings highway could become the most iconic high rise in St Louis
24. St Louis elects it’s first ever female mayor
25. Washington U continues its torrid expansion
26. City foundry begins construction
27. The grove becomes the hottest hood in the city
28. Construction begins on the latest incarnation of Union Station
29. Microsoft moves jobs to the city
30. NGA selects north St Louis for its new Western HQ giving that area of the city a significant jolt
31. St Louis riding the wave of becoming the Ag tech capitol of the country possibly the world
32. St Louis also becoming a world leader in Geospatial tech
33. Bunge announces it will move its GH to St Louis likely becoming the first Fortune 500 company to do so in who knows when
34.Lacledes Landing faced major down turn but is now seeing some momentum
35. Nestlé moves jobs from LA to St Louis
36. Phase 2 of Ballpark Village begins
37. Keiner Plaza gets a complete major overhaul
38. CWE receives the brunt of the city’s new construction
39. North St Louis continues to suffer with little investment
40. South St Louis becomes stable with significant investments
41. Convention business remains steady
42. St Louis rides a hot wave of new hotel rehabs conversions and construction
43. Start up scene is rapidly growing
44. Benson Hill could become a future Fortune 500 company
45. Post becomes St Louis’s latest and new Fortune 500 company
46. St Louis continues to be one of the most affordable places to live in the country

I could possibly go a bit more but I’ll end it here
But I’ll go onto say that despite some deep wounds everything overall is on the positive and clearly we’re gaining a lot of momentum that momentum could either continue the same pace maybe even become rapid slow down or disappear but one thing I can say St Louis is definitely trying although the road is long could St Louis be the new hot city in the Midwest?
Who knows what the next decade will bring


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Rumor circulating is that the faction opposing renewal of the downtown CID due to perceived mismanagement by Downtown STL has pretty serious support. I wonder what will happen to downtown if the CID is not renewed.

^A grassroots movement?

I can't recall how Downtown STL was formed.  But I've always been skeptical of it.

faction is bunch of losers led by parking lot operator Brad Waldrop, whose group NIA Downtown West took $10,000 from now fired Schlafly CEO to go after black owned bars and try to close them down.   

* Gets excited that there's a group opposing Downtown STL Inc * 
* Sees that it's led by Brad Waldrop * 

I'm new to town. 

What is to hate about Downtown STL Inc.? 

Wolfpaw, thanks for the 2010-2020 rundown. Pretty crazy 10 years!
-I would add the following:
St. Louis lands MLS team after Tuesday.
-Union Station redo
-Armory redo
-First unification effort in recent years fails (Better together)
-Stenger resignation, conviction and sentencing
-Greitens resignation
As you mentioned, you could add more. Thought I’d assist. It has been a long 10 years!
Let’s hope for a transformational (in a positive way) next 10 years!

KansasCitian wrote: I'm new to town. 

What is to hate about Downtown STL Inc.? 

I don't live downtown, so I can't speak from a personal view; but what I've heard/read is that business owners and residents are starting to think Downtown STL is mismanaging the CID money, and maybe that is the cause of Downtown's sluggish growth. But I also don't know why they think voting the CID out of existence will help downtown.

I would like to add to the list: the creation of TREX and their purchase of the Lammert Building at 911 Washington Avenue as the beginning of the startup scene in downtown STL.

DogtownBnR wrote:Wolfpaw, thanks for the 2010-2020 rundown. Pretty crazy 10 years!
-I would add the following:
St. Louis lands MLS team after Tuesday.
-Union Station redo
-Armory redo
-First unification effort in recent years fails (Better together)
-Stenger resignation, conviction and sentencing
-Greitens resignation
As you mentioned, you could add more. Thought I’d assist. It has been a long 10 years!
Let’s hope for a transformational (in a positive way) next 10 years!

You’re welcome and it has be astonishing how much has happened even politically


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dbInSouthCity wrote: faction is bunch of losers led by parking lot operator Brad Waldrop, whose group NIA Downtown West took $10,000 from now fired Schlafly CEO to go after black owned bars and try to close them down.   

You are entitled to your opinion, but insinuating that Brad's motivations are racist and that he was a hired gun for the ex-Schlafly CEO is way out of bounds. 

chaifetz10 wrote: I disagree - this is a public message board and dblnSouthCity is entitled to his interpretation of facts.  There have been way worse things said than this.  Now, if you are Brad or are friends with him, then I understand your position but... let's not go down the road of trying to call things "way out of bounds" unless they truly are, in fact, way out of bounds.

Thank you for your thoughts. As a former, long-time downtown resident I was very familiar with Brad and supported some of his efforts, not others.  In my opinion his overall intentions were/are good.  To your comment, I think this goes beyond an interpretation.  Flippantly playing the race card because you don't like someone's methods is out of bounds and frankly lazy.

...Meanwhile, WeWork has leased 60,000 sq. ft. at Metropolitan Square.

https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/new ... c1a2c9PSJ9

framer wrote: ...Meanwhile, WeWork has leased 60,000 sq. ft. at Metropolitan Square.

https://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/new ... c1a2c9PSJ9

I was surprised somewhat when I saw the article posted this morning.   For someone reason I thought WeWork was headed to the Armory.  Was I completely off base, or did I miss something?  

Met Square slowly filling out their leases and hopefully movement on 909 Chestnut will be a big turnaround for downtown.

dredger wrote: I was surprised somewhat when I saw the article posted this morning.   For someone reason I thought WeWork was headed to the Armory.  Was I completely off base, or did I miss something?  

WeWork was looking at space in the Armory. They could still be for a second location. I guess we will find out over time.

They're in negotiations with the Armory and one other landlord in the city. Both have had cold feet due to negative press surrounding WeWork's financials, but maybe the Met Square decision will convince them both to pull the trigger on a lease.

robertn42 wrote:

dbInSouthCity wrote: faction is bunch of losers led by parking lot operator Brad Waldrop, whose group NIA Downtown West took $10,000 from now fired Schlafly CEO to go after black owned bars and try to close them down.   

You are entitled to your opinion, but insinuating that Brad's motivations are racist and that he was a hired gun for the ex-Schlafly CEO is way out of bounds. 

You said racist pal, not me.  His group has gone only after black owned businesses.  Those are just the facts, don’t care whose feelings are hurt.

Multiple shootings at ballpark village- not a word from their group. Constant fights and sexual assaults at wheelhouse etc. not a word from their group.

I have heard that WeWorks expects to have 3 facilities in STL, therefore, both BPV and Armory could still be in play.  I have also heard they are looking in Clayton?

I feel I need to address this as multiple people in the real estate development industry have brought it to my attention.

Note that I use my full name and I do not hide behind a user name such as Chaifetz10 when practicing freedom of speech.  I feel there is a difference between practicing freedom of speech and blasting people anonymously versus doing so without anonymity.

I find it interesting Denis Beganovic tries to be cordial in person but rants about me here behind dbinSouthCity and also on Twitter.  It’s doubly interesting he was fired from the City of St. Louis Streets Department for violating their social media policy while tweeting from behind his day job's desk.  I guess UrbanSTL.com allows this same type of behavior. 

I also find it very interesting Alex Price throws a little gas on the fire when we work in the same field and his firm is architect for an infill project we’re working on in Soulard.

With just a few comments made, mainly by Denis Beganovic, there’s quite a bit to unpack and address here. 

First off, I’ve never been a part of NIA Downtown West.  I have been a part of DNA, Neighbors of NLEC and other downtown entities.  

I also know that no one working on liquor license problems has received Schlafly money.  Seriously?  Schlafly money?

Denis Beganovic often mixes facts with fiction.  Don't believe everything you read.

Where is this vitriol coming from?  Denis, is it because I love good cops, good policing and a strong business environment?  Alex, is it because I think we have enough low income housing already in and around downtown?  I assume you also have a problem with me liking good police and good policing.  These days the word "developer" is synonymous with "cop" ... maybe it's a generational thing.  I feel just fine in that company.

What I do know is I am not a part of any group or faction of losers as Denis and Alex assert.  More about CID renewal efforts at bottom.

Now, to unpack Denis’ accusations of discrimination:  

First off, my anchor tenant at Monkey BLDG, a NGA contractor, is owned by a black couple.  In fact, multiple tenant businesses at Monkey BLDG are black-owned and/or woman-owned.  You can tell by looking at the storefronts if you’re not vision-impaired, as I have to suspect from Denis' comments he may be vision-impaired (although I do not know if that originates in his eyeballs or deeper within).  

We have many other tenants in many other properties throughout downtown and the city that might be described as people of color. 

I AM involved in scrutinizing liquor license applications. I have supported many and I have not supported many. 

Here is a partial list of those I have NOT supported and the color of the skin of their owners and landlords:

*Voodoo:  white bar owner; white landlord;
*Copia:  middle eastern bar owner; white landlord;
*Fried STL:  white bar owner; white landlord;
*Bobby’s Place:  white bar owner (and friend and colleague of mine); white (bank) landlord;
*House of Soul:  black bar owner; black landlord (SUPER politically connected, so much so that the black bar owner was arrested on felony charges yet Judge Jimmie Edwards, as a favor to the landlord, made the arrest go away and the bar owner was not charged);
*Ely Walker Event Space:  white bar owner; white landlord;
*Elder Shirt Event Space:  white bar owner; middle eastern landlord (my apologies as I do not know if my description of the landlord is accurate, I do not know him -- but he too has accused me of being racist)
*Truth:  black bar owner; white landlord

Here is why I have not supported liquor licenses lately:

After working on homelessness for years, and after shuttering Larry Rice, I turned my attention to other downtown problems. Namely, shootings and shots fired that occur at nighttime.

Since about 2008, when the effects of the Recession were really evident in an uptick in downtown crime, specifically on Washington AVE, which gets described as "downtown" in the news media, we have seen many, many shootings and shots fired, including some high profile murders, in an area that is dense in bars.  Remember, this is the street associated with the Convention & Visitors Center, Stifel Financial Corp, Thompson Coburn, the loft district, Arch visitors (at eastern end), T-Rex, several hotels ...

During the day time, downtown and Washington AVE are great centers of diversity and economic activity.  But at night, they have become somewhat desolate outside of sporting events, conventions and other point-in-time activities.

Further, our rent rates and building occupancies have remained stagnant at best.  In fact, a recent Development Strategies Inc study showed our apartment rent rates are flat and our occupancies are worse, while other city neighborhoods like the CWE and Grove are growing.

Another Development Strategies Inc study showed downtown produces $90M in tax revenue per year for the City of St. Louis, and downtown only receives $30M back.  The same study showed, had downtown grown at even an inflationary rate (which it has not), it would produce $170M per year in tax revenue for the City of St. Louis.

So I studied these things.  And a friend of mine put a map together showing shots fired and shootings.  It became very clear there are four main causes of crime in downtown:
*liquor licensing;
*cruising;
*open-air (MetroLink, parks etc.) & closed-air (apartment buildings) drug markets;
*homelessness (not persons-in-need themselves, but rather drug dealers preying on persons-in-need, as well as the region continuing to concentrate persons-in-need in downtown and the resulting quality of life issues)

It was my hope that, post shuttering NLEC, I could work on something else that would improve downtown.  And I have to say I think we've had some success, but we are far from keeping downtown out of the news for shots fired, shootings etc. related to the night time economy.

Here is what we have observed while concentrating efforts on liquor licenses:

*promoters should be banned.  If a promoter is allowed into a licensee's venue, the licensee should lose their liquor license.  A promoter is someone that rents the bar from the licensee for a night.  They are typically given full power to pack the bar and manage the bar.  Promoters do not have skin in the game.  They have nothing to lose as they are not indebted to the landlord via a lease agreement and they have no capital expenditure in the build out of the venue.  They also do not have a liquor license to lose.  I believe promoters may have been involved with the BPV incident referenced in this thread;

*the state of Missouri largely disbanded its liquor control department under Nixon.  This is a problem for the City of St. Louis.  In places like Nashville or Texas, liquor control can enter your bar and if you are serving minors or otherwise violating the provisions of your liquor license, you can be fined, arrested, lose your liquor license ...  Our state has gutted that enforcement mechanism;

*the City of St. Louis has an underfunded and understaffed Excise division.  The Excise department mainly processes the plethora of cheap liquor licenses ($500 per liquor license) that passes through the department.  The Excise department has little to no time to research the applicant, much less enforce the licensees after their license is issued;

*Many of these liquor license applications are shuttled through by consultants that blatantly lie what the applicant's intent is in the neighborhood.  These consultants should be banned from the process;

*Outside of Missouri, and outside of the City of St. Louis, other governments have figured out that a controlled substance such as alcohol should not be licensed to a bar venue or restaurant venue so cheaply.  $500 per license does not allow for funding of enforcement.  And, $500 for a license is very little skin in the game.  A bar owner has relatively little to fear when running a raucous operation in a neighborhood.  Additionally, a full bar (liquor versus just wine and beer) should cost more than a beer & wine license. Full bars many times result in clubs.  And clubs have far more problems associated with them than restaurants.  It makes no sense that it is $500 to open an "ultra lounge" or club and it's also $500 to open up a pizza shop or Italian joint.

*Catering licenses and existing written code related to same are a problem.  Remember, when you apply for a liquor license, you are asking for a privilege to operate in someone's neighborhood.  The neighborhood has the right to deny you that privilege, or to take it away.  In many cases in the City of St. Louis, a neighborhood will respond by saying "we have enough bars ..." or "we do not want a bar in our neighborhood" and, especially in the case of downtown, the landlord and applicant will respond by circumventing the neighborhood and applying for a catering license.  This allows the bar owner to use a license from outside of downtown to cater booze into a location in downtown ... having a one night blow out party, or multiple.  *see earlier mention of felony charges that were dropped.

We've uncovered other problems with liquor licensing in the city.

This is not a black & white issue.  This is a government issue.  A policy issue.  But when a white developer gets involved, people that are seeking personal gain, specifically bar owners or money-desperate-landlords, will cry foul and flip the race card if that achieves their ends (getting a liquor license through).  These same bar owners and landlords may or may not understand, or may or may not want to understand the overall "shots fired" issues and resulting bad media attention and its negative effect on all sectors of downtown and hence our city and state.  These money-hungry bar owners and landlords will continue to flip the race card.  Many of the bar owners and landlords do NOT even live in downtown.  *I myself do not live in downtown.  I have lived in downtown.  

Flipping the race card, sometimes for personal gain, and killing an otherwise constructive conversation for safety and diversity, has been the case for decades in St. Louis, and it has gained even more traction post-Ferguson.

At the end of the day policing is down city wide post-Ferguson; the City is having trouble attracting and retaining cops; **police themselves are making 20-30% fewer arrests in the post-Ferguson environment; and, specifically at night (not during the day), downtown is suffering.  We cannot just shuttle through $500 licenses and continue to concentrate behaviors when we aren't even allotted an adequate amount of police downtown.  It's not logical.  **NOTE:  lately and I suspect for some time to come, you will hear "crime stats are actually trending down in downtown ..." or "this sector of crime is actually down in such and such neighborhood in the the City of St. Louis ..."  these are lies being perpetuated by people in charge that are not taking into account that data collection has changed downwardly by cops not interacting as often with criminals.  The reality is police are interacting less with criminals/behaviors on a daily basis and the result is that crime stats show crime is down, when crime is actually up.  Some cops are staying in their cars because they are spread too thin, so thin that they are one per vehicle (and it is easier to take down a criminal with two cops versus one).  Some cops are staying in their cars because every person in the city seems to carry a weapon these days thanks to our rural politicians and their constituents.

Our government is failing us.  This IS why I am a supporter of a reformed downtown CID.  The CID is a whole another layer of government on top of our failing City gov.  And if we are to turn downtown around the CID MUST BE EFFECTIVE.  Currently, the CID is not effective, and has not been for many, many years (*see earlier mention of Development Strategies Inc study that showed downtown should be producing at least $170M per year in tax revenue today, but is only producing $90M in tax revenue).

I hope this clarifies my efforts downtown.  I want to end with adding that Denis Beganovic only joins the ranks of the St. Louis Post Dispatch's Tony Messenger, Alderwoman Tammika Hubbard and property owner and Kwame Building Group owner Tony Thompson in insinuating that my motives are discriminatory.  It is my belief that if this great city and the region that calls it theirs is going to truly move forward post-Ferguson, we cannot let the "race card" stop these conversations about safety and the effect on the economy and downtown.  To have growth, including growth in diversity in downtown, we need jobs.  And flipping the race card instead of having constructive conversations gets us no where.