St.Louis UAB alumni wrote:They should turn TBD site into a tailgating park.
At least for the short term, I agree.
- 10K
At least for the short term, I agree.
Dog park too!St.Louis UAB alumni wrote:They should turn TBD site into a tailgating park.
- 10K
innov8ion wrote:Dog park too!St.Louis UAB alumni wrote:They should turn TBD site into a tailgating park.
Hopefully MiguelTejada isn't doing anything rash after the mention of a dog park.
St.Louis UAB alumni wrote:They should turn TBD site into a tailgating park.
It's currently used for tailgating. It's where we tailgate for Rams games.
However the lots are rough and pretty messy.
We tailgate there too.
It's amongst the few lots with port A potties though
And..... a short walk to the stadium after a 5 hour drinks session....... to watch the Rams stink up another one, like they have been recently.
It's amongst the few lots with port A potties though
And..... a short walk to the stadium after a 5 hour drinks session....... to watch the Rams stink up another one, like they have been recently.
- 11K
TBD & McGuire missed the boat and lost out in the near term.
Very true. In the longer term I think they have a lot to smile about. So they have to sit on the land for a couple years, but with Pinnacle, Washington Avenue and Old North St. Louis all moving along in their own way, this is becoming a very valuable piece of land.
Ihnen wrote:TBD & McGuire missed the boat and lost out in the near term.
Very true. In the longer term I think they have a lot to smile about. So they have to sit on the land for a couple years, but with Pinnacle, Washington Avenue and Old North St. Louis all moving along in their own way, this is becoming a very valuable piece of land.
You mean, a very valuable piece of torn up gravel hole.
Received a letter today concerning The Bottle District.
I originally inquired, quite awhile back, about leasing commercial space in TBD. The letter said today that the district will breakground this Spring (2007). It cited that with the recent developments on Laclede's Landing with the Pinnacle Casino, hotel and Lumiere District and the developments underway around the district, construction should be underway by this spring. It also gave a phone number direct to TBD... so I called it to see where it went. It was actually answered by a live person that answered "Thank You for calling The Bottle District"... I hung up (not wanting to look like an idiot).
The letter was primarily to let "interested" commercial developers know that the district construction date was set for spring and that TBD now has layout plans for space if wanted.
Anyway, just an FYI.
I originally inquired, quite awhile back, about leasing commercial space in TBD. The letter said today that the district will breakground this Spring (2007). It cited that with the recent developments on Laclede's Landing with the Pinnacle Casino, hotel and Lumiere District and the developments underway around the district, construction should be underway by this spring. It also gave a phone number direct to TBD... so I called it to see where it went. It was actually answered by a live person that answered "Thank You for calling The Bottle District"... I hung up (not wanting to look like an idiot).
The letter was primarily to let "interested" commercial developers know that the district construction date was set for spring and that TBD now has layout plans for space if wanted.
Anyway, just an FYI.
- 8,912
^Exactly, I wonder which plans they decided to go with. We all know it has been scaled back, but I wonder to what extent?
Was contacted TODAY about securing space at The Bottle District. Construction is to start in Spring. 
- 1,026
Does the fact that you guys have been contacted mean the project is definately a go? Its a serious question - I really have no idea.
And perhaps more importantly, what is the new project scope?markofucity wrote:Does the fact that you guys have been contacted mean the project is definately a go? Its a serious question - I really have no idea.
Those questions I cannot answer... just that I have been contacted. Told they are on building schedule for this spring.
I would imagine that the project is rolling on since they actually now have an office, phone number and have sent and phones me information on space. They have also given Spring 07 as construction date.
That is all I know now.
I would imagine that the project is rolling on since they actually now have an office, phone number and have sent and phones me information on space. They have also given Spring 07 as construction date.
That is all I know now.
Well, yeah, but haven't we heard all this before? Why should anyone think anything's differant this time?
- 923
^ Agreed. And - if they're contacting you, why hasn't this made it into the post-discrap? Conisdering the scale of this project, the fact they've set a date for groundbreaking...again...should be pretty big news - yes?
All I know is, if you're serious about thinking of locating a business to the BD, I'd wait to take out that loan for a few more months.
All I know is, if you're serious about thinking of locating a business to the BD, I'd wait to take out that loan for a few more months.
Let's all try to be a little more patient. It's been a lonnnnnnng time since a large project like this has been built in DT St. Louis. Anyone who visits Emporis regularly will see that many such large projects take time from the annoncement/planning stage to actual construction start up. Look at Trump Tower in Chicago, just for one example. We've known about this for at least 5 years now, and it's just now going up...and Chicago isn't a place where they hem and haw, at least not publicly.
So it ain't been in the PD, so what? It's a crummy newspaper that doesn't realize the value of the very city it serves in the first place!! Believe me, they'd be the first ones to headline some project being cancelled downtown. So, that's no barometer by any means.
Besides, who on earth would waste money on an office, personel to answer phones, giving start of construction dates, etc. on a project that isn't going to happen?
So, When we read or hear about a new project DT (such as TBD) and it doesn't start to rise in 6 months, or a year, or two years, that doesn't mean it won't be built.
So it ain't been in the PD, so what? It's a crummy newspaper that doesn't realize the value of the very city it serves in the first place!! Believe me, they'd be the first ones to headline some project being cancelled downtown. So, that's no barometer by any means.
Besides, who on earth would waste money on an office, personel to answer phones, giving start of construction dates, etc. on a project that isn't going to happen?
So, When we read or hear about a new project DT (such as TBD) and it doesn't start to rise in 6 months, or a year, or two years, that doesn't mean it won't be built.
I think many people now believe that if TBD is built, it will be built to a much smaller scope than was planned before. Much of everything that was talked about will be at Pinnacle now or elsewhere. Still, it would be nice if TBD could find a niche in downtown and as the market allows, build on it.Marmar wrote:Let's all try to be a little more patient. It's been a lonnnnnnng time since a large project like this has been built in DT St. Louis.
FYI - TBD has had an office, direct phone numbers and e-mail accounts since this project hit the streets, so this is not anything new and does not inspire any level of confidence after suffering through all the starts and stops of this project. There are a few questions that need to be answered before any hope should be realized; 1. who is the developer of record since Ghazi has left the project? 2. what is the actual proposed scope of phase 1 of this project (don't give me some elaborate and beautiful collection of buildings in phase 4 that will never happen - show me what you actually think you can and will build). And just to let you know, the engineering team on this project has not been cut loose yet to start, so I seriously doubt this project will start this spring.
- 6,775
matguy70 wrote:Was contacted TODAY about securing space at The Bottle District. Construction is to start in Spring.
What do you do that would cause the BD folks to contact you?
- 10K
jambalaya wrote:FYI - TBD has had an office, direct phone numbers and e-mail accounts since this project hit the streets, so this is not anything new and does not inspire any level of confidence after suffering through all the starts and stops of this project.
And the number probably just went to McGuire Moving & Storage's offices anyway.
Excellent points, Marmar.
Being a bit cynical, I would add that St. Louis isn't used to such big projects, which is why there is such cynicism by some locals. Some locals just don't know the mechanics of big ambitious projects.
Major projects are delayed, downsized, upsized and redesigned all of the time in major cities all across America. Some projects ARE canceled. But I say it ain't over until the fat lady sings ie until the developers say so. Philadelphia's new tallest, Comcast Center, was redesigned (upsized), delayed for about five years and renamed before they finally broke ground in 2006. Comcast Center was originally called One Pennsylvania Plaza.
Just because we have not been exposed or privied to the behind-the-scenes business of the BD, it doesn't mean there isn't planning under way or a potential spring re-groundbreaking.
Being a bit cynical, I would add that St. Louis isn't used to such big projects, which is why there is such cynicism by some locals. Some locals just don't know the mechanics of big ambitious projects.
Major projects are delayed, downsized, upsized and redesigned all of the time in major cities all across America. Some projects ARE canceled. But I say it ain't over until the fat lady sings ie until the developers say so. Philadelphia's new tallest, Comcast Center, was redesigned (upsized), delayed for about five years and renamed before they finally broke ground in 2006. Comcast Center was originally called One Pennsylvania Plaza.
Just because we have not been exposed or privied to the behind-the-scenes business of the BD, it doesn't mean there isn't planning under way or a potential spring re-groundbreaking.
markofucity wrote:Does the fact that you guys have been contacted mean the project is definately a go? Its a serious question - I really have no idea.
article from todays Belleville Democrat
http://www.belleville.com/mld/bellevill ... 443414.htm
- 466
well, ok. i've always been a optimist on this. there wer times i wanted to give up on it, and part of me is glad they didn't go with lebiskind on this only because he is a tool and not the mast of urban design that people say he is, if you go to the denver art museum, his plaza fits in with a patht hat is set out by the city and is on axis with the civic center park, but the condo building is on broadway, a major street with lots of walking and activity all through out the day is a large concrete wall, no windows no nothing. it's not even nice concrete. oh well, enough ranting about that, i was just very unimpressed when i went there.
Bernsen said the target audience for the Bottle District is not only people from the local area looking for something new to do on Saturday night -- including metro-easters -- but also St. Louis' rapidly growing tourist trade. That could take a bite out of the business of St. Clair and Madison county hotels and restaurants.
Bernsen said there are 20 million overnight stays in the St. Louis region every year.
"One of the issues with that market is that a lot of that base comes to see a baseball game or comes to see the Arch, but they don't stay in the city," Bernsen said. "We want to provide a stickiness to the downtown area that lures them here and keeps them here."
Now let me see if I understand this correctly. This guy is promoting a $300 million development aimed in large part at people who go out on Saturday nights and people who come in for an activity that only occurs 71 days out of the year? And where is he seeing this "rapidly growing tourist trade"?