If we want to land the DNC 2020, they we will need to have a new stadium.
^The 2012 DNC was held in the Time Warner Cable Arena, which is a little smaller than the Scottrade Center.
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That was interesting. They always seem to try to schedule noon C/1pm E start times for Miami, Tampa or Jacksonville games to avoid those typical Florida late-afternoon thunderstorms.blzhrpmd2 wrote:Sidenote: Dome looking pretty good to the NFL and Tampa fans this afternoon.
I've been to Raymond James Stadium before: nice place. The one thing I really like is they have a lot more entrance and exit gates than the Edward Jones Dome. Makes crowd movement much better.
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I think your stadium can only be considered top tier if it forms a Faraday cage to protect the fans and players. One lightning strike to the head might reduce that fan's gameday experience.dweebe wrote:That was interesting. They always seem to try to schedule noon C/1pm E start times for Miami, Tampa or Jacksonville games to avoid those typical Florida late-afternoon thunderstorms.blzhrpmd2 wrote:Sidenote: Dome looking pretty good to the NFL and Tampa fans this afternoon.
I've been to Raymond James Stadium before: nice place. The one thing I really like is they have a lot more entrance and exit gates than the Edward Jones Dome. Makes crowd movement much better.
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I'm assuming you're talking about the keynote speeches, and they were supposed to be outdoors at Bank of America Stadium. Storms pushed them inside to that arena at the last second.wabash wrote:^The 2012 DNC was held in the Time Warner Cable Arena, which is a little smaller than the Scottrade Center.
Make no mistake, St. Louis will not receive serious consideration for another RNC, DNC, NCAA Final Four, or any other marquee event unless/until we have a significant overhaul of our convention/sports facilities.
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I'll have to disagree.. I think Saint.Louis will always be a viable option & can run with other cities even if our facilities aren't fresh & new.
I do know eventually we'll have to replace them however Scottrade is still relatively young so is EJD although EJD is completely outdated.
For example look at KC's Sprint Center it used to up there each year when it came to recruiting all types of event's including concerts. It's not even 10 yrs old & starting to lose it's steam.
I do know if we want to keep the Rams the EJD will have to be replaced also I feel like if KC can make a run to obtain a super bowl & the state is very much willing to chip in to help out i don't see why Saint.Louis can't do the very same..
That's if we don't lose the Rams & build a new stadium
I wouldn't mind seeing new Football stadium & hockey arena connected together in some sort of way .
I do know eventually we'll have to replace them however Scottrade is still relatively young so is EJD although EJD is completely outdated.
For example look at KC's Sprint Center it used to up there each year when it came to recruiting all types of event's including concerts. It's not even 10 yrs old & starting to lose it's steam.
I do know if we want to keep the Rams the EJD will have to be replaced also I feel like if KC can make a run to obtain a super bowl & the state is very much willing to chip in to help out i don't see why Saint.Louis can't do the very same..
That's if we don't lose the Rams & build a new stadium
I wouldn't mind seeing new Football stadium & hockey arena connected together in some sort of way .
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Gee, if only they had had some sort of dome-like structure over their stadium...I'm assuming you're talking about the keynote speeches, and they were supposed to be outdoors at Bank of America Stadium. Storms pushed them inside to that arena at the last second.
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You guys can be snarky or in denial all you want.... if you're ever interested in seeing St. Louis land major conventions or events that don't have to do with Christianity, guns, or robots.... we'll need new facilities.
Oh yeah, the NCAA might also toss us a bone and have a few Sweet Sixteen or Round of 32 games here and there.
Oh yeah, the NCAA might also toss us a bone and have a few Sweet Sixteen or Round of 32 games here and there.
The Scottrade Center has fine bones and is really not much different than other arenas I've been to. Scottrade doesn't need replacing but does show a number of signs of delayed maintenance and lack of upgrades when compared to other arenas of the same age. Pretty soon the city of St. Louis and the Blues ownership are going to have to talk about a decent remodeling project.Greatest St. Louis wrote:You guys can be snarky or in denial all you want.... if you're ever interested in seeing St. Louis land major conventions or events that don't have to do with Christianity, guns, or robots.... we'll need new facilities.
A decent refresh of Scottrade is also what it's going to take to get a political convention here. Tampa's arena is about the same age as Scottrade Center and they put $35 million worth of upgrades in for the 2012 RNC.
My guess is that the NCAA for the mens Final Four will be on a rotation of Indianapolis, New Orleans, Atlanta with second tier cities mixed in. Even with a new building for the Rams St. Louis can't compete with Indianapolis 4 hours to the east. They have a huge advantage since the NCAA headquarters is literally 8 or 9 blocks from Lucas Oil Field.Greatest St. Louis wrote:Oh yeah, the NCAA might also toss us a bone and have a few Sweet Sixteen or Round of 32 games here and there.
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If we have to build a new convention center every 10 years to be in the running, is it even worth doing?
Only if we had the business to justify it. But seriously, we wouldn't need a new convention center every 10 yrs.MarkHaversham wrote:If we have to build a new convention center every 10 years to be in the running, is it even worth doing?
^ I do think CVC needs to act on tearing down the parking garage just behind the entrance to expand its ballroom/banquet space. That space should be well lighted and its direct access to Wash Ave is a plus. I think that is a no brainer considering that they are on the smaller side if not mistaken.
As far as EJD, they will have that large space all to themselves in a couple of years as something will happen with the Rams one or another. Either way, it would be nice to see CVC plow some funds to freshen EJD towards in terms of convention business.
As far as EJD, they will have that large space all to themselves in a couple of years as something will happen with the Rams one or another. Either way, it would be nice to see CVC plow some funds to freshen EJD towards in terms of convention business.
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^ It WAS snarky (and hopefully funny) but it was meant to highlight the absurdity of the stadium arms race. Not to mention that a new open air stadium has serious drawbacks that make it less attractive for many uses. Retractable roof is an upgrade, Open Air is a step back IMHO.You guys can be snarky or in denial all you want.... if you're ever interested in seeing St. Louis land major conventions or events that don't have to do with Christianity, guns, or robots.... we'll need new facilities.
Personally I think a major retrofit would make the dome viable for another 20 years. Probably not top tier of course but is that really the requirement for the Rams to stay? Or was it just the requirement for them to remain constrained to the old lease? I'd think ~400-500M could bring the dome up to par. With a retractable roof, fan zones, and updated AV (but not moving the wall out another 100 feet as shown in the Rams counter-proposal to the city). The roof as imagined would retract over the convention center and its weight supported by two trusses that would span the structure From Broadway to 9th. Would this be acceptable to the Rams?... I have no idea, but it would probably be less money than building a new less versatile open air stadium, the Rams would still get a new sweetheart lease (minus a top tier out clause
) and the stadium would still be where it should be, at the heart of downtown. Of course some will claim its not enough... I personally think it could be.None of this helps the Rams win football games of course which is whats needed for them to sell tickets.
Also there are few things more terrifying than gun-toting christian robots...
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I personally feel the Rams mean more to me than others & i would absolutely dislike seeing them leave town however at the end it's a business so Saint.Louis really needs to make a decision on if it wants to keep the Rams .
I preferably like for them to build a retractable roof stadium if we decide to keep them.
Scottrade needs a good power wash some updating & it will look as good as new
I preferably like for them to build a retractable roof stadium if we decide to keep them.
Scottrade needs a good power wash some updating & it will look as good as new
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Question: is the hotel/car rental/restaurant/entertainment district tax in place to help pay off the Dome in place indefinitely, or does it have a sunset? If sunset, when is it set to expire?
Thanks to Enterprise's lobbying I didn't think any car rental money went into the Edward Jones Dome. Every time I've rented a car here the tax is very low and there's no split out tax line mentioning the sort. The Taylor family has made sure St. Louis and Missouri's rental car tax is stunningly low. There's nothing like renting in Tampa, Orlando or Phoenix and paying 25% over the base rate in taxes and fees.Greatest St. Louis wrote:Question: is the hotel/car rental/restaurant/entertainment district tax in place to help pay off the Dome in place indefinitely, or does it have a sunset? If sunset, when is it set to expire?
I don't have my receipt from a recent rental in Orlando any more: but I'm pretty darn sure one of the tax lines was "Stadium/Arena Fund". I'm guessing that's partly for the new MLS team they're getting.
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I'd like to think someone in town, who was not trying to come up with something uber expensive to get the Rams out of a lease, could come up with a really creative way to cut out a few panels in the dome roof and install a clever system that opens and closes one or multiple lids over the new holes. What if each cut out square had a BallPark Village style roof that opened and closed? How much would that cost? I can't see that being too heavy for the massive girders holding up the current roof. Or maybe something like the retractable fabric roof over Wimbledon? The structural support is there, you just need the holes and the fabric.STLEnginerd wrote:^ It WAS snarky (and hopefully funny) but it was meant to highlight the absurdity of the stadium arms race. Not to mention that a new open air stadium has serious drawbacks that make it less attractive for many uses. Retractable roof is an upgrade, Open Air is a step back IMHO.You guys can be snarky or in denial all you want.... if you're ever interested in seeing St. Louis land major conventions or events that don't have to do with Christianity, guns, or robots.... we'll need new facilities.
Personally I think a major retrofit would make the dome viable for another 20 years. Probably not top tier of course but is that really the requirement for the Rams to stay? Or was it just the requirement for them to remain constrained to the old lease? I'd think ~400-500M could bring the dome up to par. With a retractable roof, fan zones, and updated AV (but not moving the wall out another 100 feet as shown in the Rams counter-proposal to the city). The roof as imagined would retract over the convention center and its weight supported by two trusses that would span the structure From Broadway to 9th. Would this be acceptable to the Rams?... I have no idea, but it would probably be less money than building a new less versatile open air stadium, the Rams would still get a new sweetheart lease (minus a top tier out clause
None of this helps the Rams win football games of course which is whats needed for them to sell tickets.
Also there are few things more terrifying than gun-toting christian robots...
What if each cut out square had a BallPark Village style roof that opened and closed?
Or something like the retractable fabric roof over Wimbledon by HOK Sport?
Check out the Veltins-Arena for soccer in Germany. It appear to have a girder roof not unlike the dome, but the roof panels above the girders slide open. Arsenal team plays here sometimes.
http://theshortfuse.sbnation.com/2012/1 ... tins-arena
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http://theshortfuse.sbnation.com/2012/1 ... tins-arena
I think they said the panels can't get messed with because of the original design requirement for it being able to withstand a 100-year snowstorm plus earthquake safety. Then add they have the whole convention lighting grid support and you've got a third problematic factor.gary kreie wrote:I'd like to think someone in town, who was not trying to come up with something uber expensive to get the Rams out of a lease, could come up with a really creative way to cut out a few panels in the dome roof and install a clever system that opens and closes one or multiple lids over the new holes. What if each cut out square had a BallPark Village style roof that opened and closed? How much would that cost? I can't see that being too heavy for the massive girders holding up the current roof. Or maybe something like the retractable fabric roof over Wimbledon? The structural support is there, you just need the holes and the fabric.
What if each cut out square had a BallPark Village style roof that opened and closed?
Or something like the retractable fabric roof over Wimbledon by HOK Sport?
Hadn't seen that before. I like.gary kreie wrote:Check out the Veltins-Arena for soccer in Germany. It appear to have a girder roof not unlike the dome, but the roof panels above the girders slide open. Arsenal team plays here sometimes.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veltins-Arena
Highly acclaimed, the Veltins-Arena served as a model for the University of Phoenix Stadium. This stadium shares features with its German counterpart such as a retractable roof and a slide-out pitch. Veltins-Arena has also been a source of inspiration for Friends Arena. The arena also has ties to Lucas Oil Stadium. In that stadium, the retractable-roof also opens lengthwise from the center to the touchlines.
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Greatest St. Louis wrote:Question: is the hotel/car rental/restaurant/entertainment district tax in place to help pay off the Dome in place indefinitely, or does it have a sunset? If sunset, when is it set to expire?
That makes a huge difference at the Georgia Dome. Still wasn't enough to save that building though.pat wrote:You would think they could install clear panels that let light through
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So we have another 80 years to wait for that snowstorm. How big of an earthquake plus snowstorm will it take to collapse the current roof? And removing some roof panels and covering the holes with movable fabric tarp may actually reduce the weight of the roof.dweebe wrote:I think they said the panels can't get messed with because of the original design requirement for it being able to withstand a 100-year snowstorm plus earthquake safety. Then add they have the whole convention lighting grid support and you've got a third problematic factor.gary kreie wrote:I'd like to think someone in town, who was not trying to come up with something uber expensive to get the Rams out of a lease, could come up with a really creative way to cut out a few panels in the dome roof and install a clever system that opens and closes one or multiple lids over the new holes. What if each cut out square had a BallPark Village style roof that opened and closed? How much would that cost? I can't see that being too heavy for the massive girders holding up the current roof. Or maybe something like the retractable fabric roof over Wimbledon? The structural support is there, you just need the holes and the fabric.
What if each cut out square had a BallPark Village style roof that opened and closed?
Or something like the retractable fabric roof over Wimbledon by HOK Sport?
In the stadium proposal given to the Rams by CVC, they proposed hanging a giant double sided electronic video screen from the roof. They didn't seem to be concerned about the weight or the light grid. And with regard to the lighting grid, they should just remove it and use the game lights, which would reduce the weight on the roof even more. What does Indy do for night concerts or conventions?
These problems seem ridiculously easy to solve.
Convention in Lucas Oil Stadium with NO separate lighting grid structure lowered from the ceiling:
