I was very big into intramurals when I was an undergrad. While it may not impress the urban community on this board, it will be a great addition to the university and student life.
While a sports field isn't necessarily the highest use of urban land, I find that the most depressing aspects of this illustration are:
1. The huge swaths of vacant land to the south, which would be a perfect location for med student housing
2. The horrible suburban-style houses in the foreground.
I also agree that these pale green metal roofs are incredibly lame. Architects need to learn to stand up to Biondi and say "No more!"
1. The huge swaths of vacant land to the south, which would be a perfect location for med student housing
2. The horrible suburban-style houses in the foreground.
I also agree that these pale green metal roofs are incredibly lame. Architects need to learn to stand up to Biondi and say "No more!"
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Unfortunately, the Gate District is rife with "horrible suburban-style houses", it only gets worse toward the heart of the neighborhood and toward Jefferson (Lafayette is awesome though).dmmonty1 wrote:The horrible suburban-style houses in the foreground.
The University of Tulsa has had and ongoing Campus expansion that included a similar scenario of replacing adjacent underutilized lots with a track/sports complex and student apartments. The apartments were well received and the University has more than tripled the amount of student apartments from the initial build. Seems like a win for the University to improve their campus surroundings, increase revenue through rental income and improve campus life with additional on campus residences.DaronDierkes wrote:...at least Gone Corporate is right on about student apartments.
They definitely need to work on density surrounding this field or it will probably be underutilized and not much of an asset for the neighborhood or the school. 1. The immediate surrounding area is dark and unpopulated at night. 2. Terry Park, immediately south, has had some bad shooting incidents (people opening up on BBQ's etc) in the last few years. 3. Where are the bathroom facilities? (absolute necessity in my mind for a permanent and functional facility). 4. SLU HAS torn down buildings and contributed/created much of the vacant space surrounding the field. Not saying it is completely responsible, but definitely has been land-banking and demoing for years in the area. 5. The Gate District housing to the east is disgusting.
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^I'll go a step further than that and say the neighborhood looks and feels like a demilitarized zone. There's rampant violence, major drug trafficking, infiltration by new organized gangs, massive under-utilizement of land, and general instabilities throughout. The Gate District is an architectural abomination, but it's the anchor on the eastern side where the Foodland still sits vacant along Jefferson.
By putting modern sports facilities in there, it will attract students and ancillary development, as well as being a stabilizing factor in the neighborhood.
And you know what? SLU's not building this for us. They're building it for their students, to improve their quality of life. The university has to compete against schools across the country for these students, including suburban schools that have a whole lot of adjacent land to build on without worrying about street violence and condemned neighboring buildings. For fark's sake, it's a college campus building for intramurals and track teams, not a major economic development project (that's the biotech building next door).
Remember, SLU could have moved to the County decades ago, but they decided to commit to the City. When they have to build things like this to attract the right students and build their campus, we should first be glad that they're committed to StL and improving who they are, both as a student body and as a campus.
(But Father Biondi, we're still waiting for updates on the NE corner of Lindell and Grand...)
By putting modern sports facilities in there, it will attract students and ancillary development, as well as being a stabilizing factor in the neighborhood.
And you know what? SLU's not building this for us. They're building it for their students, to improve their quality of life. The university has to compete against schools across the country for these students, including suburban schools that have a whole lot of adjacent land to build on without worrying about street violence and condemned neighboring buildings. For fark's sake, it's a college campus building for intramurals and track teams, not a major economic development project (that's the biotech building next door).
Remember, SLU could have moved to the County decades ago, but they decided to commit to the City. When they have to build things like this to attract the right students and build their campus, we should first be glad that they're committed to StL and improving who they are, both as a student body and as a campus.
(But Father Biondi, we're still waiting for updates on the NE corner of Lindell and Grand...)
Personally I would have rather seen this built somewhere on Locust. We really don't need that "Midtown Alley" development, which really seems more like dereliction row. Seriously, can we get SLU to level that entire area and turn it into green-space? They have such a solid record with regards to economic development and I'm glad they're still investing in our City. And look at those fences! Talk about risk management and improving the surrounding area! If only they could build something like this in the Gate District, demolish some more buildings on Lafayette, and figure out what to do over in Clinton Peabody, then I wouldn't be afraid every time I walk around Lafayette Square during the day. We need solutions to bring our City out of the lawless Wild West. I think SLU will clean up our town with the planning equivalency of Wyatt Earp!
I think they are going way too stingy on both projects.
I like the idea of developing the surrounding area of the Med Campus, but I think the track and intramural field is a little out of place. I'd rather see a nicer student center and apartments for graduate students, med students, and even upperclassmen who are in Doisy College.
I am a big believer in SLU making a big investment in buying up a warehouse either behind Reinert somewhere on Forest Park or somewhere in the Valley under the bridge. They could really use additional training facilities, a track, tennis courts, and Field Hockey fields.
The image of the track had no stands and no indoor facility for bathrooms, concessions, and storage. If they want to have track meets there they are going to need more than they are showing there. They need a shot put area, javelin area, storage for pull vault pads, long jump area, etc. I'm assuming the artists diagram was very preliminary, but as shown, this isn't impressive even for a high school facility.
I really doubt it will get nearly the amount of use on that end of campus as it would somewhere closer to the main campus. I would estimate that it will get 1/8 as much use. And the astroturf athletic field in the middle of the track is a WASTE OF MONEY. The grass intramural soccer field on the corner of Laclede and Vandy has really come along. Now the grass has established itself, its quite a nice facility. Most students show up 5 minutes late to intramural games. If they move the intramural soccer field so that its a 15 minute walk from campus most students won't show up. Think practical. These are college students we are talking about.
I like the idea of developing the surrounding area of the Med Campus, but I think the track and intramural field is a little out of place. I'd rather see a nicer student center and apartments for graduate students, med students, and even upperclassmen who are in Doisy College.
I am a big believer in SLU making a big investment in buying up a warehouse either behind Reinert somewhere on Forest Park or somewhere in the Valley under the bridge. They could really use additional training facilities, a track, tennis courts, and Field Hockey fields.
The image of the track had no stands and no indoor facility for bathrooms, concessions, and storage. If they want to have track meets there they are going to need more than they are showing there. They need a shot put area, javelin area, storage for pull vault pads, long jump area, etc. I'm assuming the artists diagram was very preliminary, but as shown, this isn't impressive even for a high school facility.
I really doubt it will get nearly the amount of use on that end of campus as it would somewhere closer to the main campus. I would estimate that it will get 1/8 as much use. And the astroturf athletic field in the middle of the track is a WASTE OF MONEY. The grass intramural soccer field on the corner of Laclede and Vandy has really come along. Now the grass has established itself, its quite a nice facility. Most students show up 5 minutes late to intramural games. If they move the intramural soccer field so that its a 15 minute walk from campus most students won't show up. Think practical. These are college students we are talking about.
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^right, I've talked to a lot of SLU defenders who always say, "Biondi has done so much. Before SLU decided to expand there was nothing. There's just nothing in that whole area." That area being midtown, the gate district, or wherever we're talking about. If the land was bought and cleared a few years before the person observing sees the construction, of course they will say this. The obvious question in my mind is, 'ok, so where was SLU when there was something?'
Yes, but stingy folks like myself prefer not to pay for our tennis. No worries, though: there are free courts quite nearby in Compton Reservoir Park.DaronDierkes wrote:Or maybe as an urban university, do something radical like using a city park (Wheelfru, there are tennis courts in tower grove park).
You're absolutely right. This site is inappropriate - no one from the Doisy Campus will be using this field, and no one from the Frost Campus will want to make the trek down or wait for the perennially late SLU shuttle down Grand.bk18 wrote: I like the idea of developing the surrounding area of the Med Campus, but I think the track and intramural field is a little out of place. I'd rather see a nicer student center and apartments for graduate students, med students, and even upperclassmen who are in Doisy College.
I am a big believer in SLU making a big investment in buying up a warehouse either behind Reinert somewhere on Forest Park or
somewhere in the Valley under the bridge.They could really use additional training facilities, a track, tennis courts, and Field Hockey fields.
The Valley, though, is a space that will never really be appropriate for large scale construction. Buy this unused land from Corrigan Company (assuming they own it), and take over the Armory for a soccer complex.
From my understanding, it appears no thought was put into connecting the sports fields with the Greenway Corridor. If so, the thought must have beeen of avoiding it. That would be my disappointment in front of my other one of not incorporating the old Armory into a sports complex.
The planning almost appears to be what place can we get the most land the cheapest.
The planning almost appears to be what place can we get the most land the cheapest.
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That's not unused. It was paved and is used as bus storage, I believe.wheelfru wrote:
The Valley, though, is a space that will never really be appropriate for large scale construction. Buy this unused land from Corrigan Company (assuming they own it), and take over the Armory for a soccer complex.
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Utilizing the valley and/or the armory for athletics might be the best (or only) way to effectively bridge the Frost Campus with the Med Campus, while freeing up space in both. I like the idea.
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I was agreeing with TGE-ATW. Looks like I was on the wrong page.bk18 wrote:Is DaronDierkes in agreement with me?
No, I don't agree with you. Sports facilities aren't good investments. They sit empty most of the time, and SLU has a few too many. Remember as a non-profit, SLU isn't paying property taxes. The bigger they are, the less room for everyone else. They could build denser. As Gone Corporate said, they are building these facilities for their students, not for the greater community. Maybe SLU can lure in talent with that nonsense, but I bet the bigger draw for them is their placement in the middle of a major American city.
FROM BIONDI:
Construction is under way on a new outdoor recreation complex at our Medical Center
immediately east of the Hickory East Parking Garage. The complex includes a full-size
soccer field encircled by an eight-lane, 400-meter, NCAA-regulation track, providing a
green oasis for intramural activities as well as another great exercise and recreation
space for the entire SLU community. It also will provide our track and field teams a
home on campus.
We currently are moving soil to make the track and field level, and we expect the
project to be completed in six to nine months. To accommodate the new facility, we
have relocated the Department of Nutrition and Dieteticsʼ garden to an area just
south of its current location. Additionally, sections of two streets at the Medical
Center will be closed permanently for the project: Virginia Avenue from Router Street
to lassie streets, and Hickory Street from Ranked to Compton avenues.
Construction is under way on a new outdoor recreation complex at our Medical Center
immediately east of the Hickory East Parking Garage. The complex includes a full-size
soccer field encircled by an eight-lane, 400-meter, NCAA-regulation track, providing a
green oasis for intramural activities as well as another great exercise and recreation
space for the entire SLU community. It also will provide our track and field teams a
home on campus.
We currently are moving soil to make the track and field level, and we expect the
project to be completed in six to nine months. To accommodate the new facility, we
have relocated the Department of Nutrition and Dieteticsʼ garden to an area just
south of its current location. Additionally, sections of two streets at the Medical
Center will be closed permanently for the project: Virginia Avenue from Router Street
to lassie streets, and Hickory Street from Ranked to Compton avenues.
Nothing like getting rid of the existing street grid!bk18 wrote: Additionally, sections of two streets at the Medical
Center will be closed permanently for the project: Virginia Avenue from Router Street
to lassie streets, and Hickory Street from Ranked to Compton avenues.
Street closures begin on Monday:
http://www.slu.edu/x37811.xmlTwo blocks of Hickory Street — from Compton to Ranken avenues, and two blocks of Virginia Avenue — from Chouteau to Rutger streets, will be closed permanently for the project, which is under way immediately east of the Hickory East Parking Garage.
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Per the SLU Athletic Training website, here are some construction photos!
The future track site, with dirt now moved and leveled. Construction of the track itself should start very soon.
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Two photos of the new Medical Center Student Union Construction:
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The future track site, with dirt now moved and leveled. Construction of the track itself should start very soon.
Two photos of the new Medical Center Student Union Construction:
^I drove up Compton for the first time in about nine months yesterday, and I almost cried. Really a shame to see this neighborhood destroyed along with the street grid.
*referring to the first picture, BTW
*referring to the first picture, BTW
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Although when completed, it will bring more traffic and use to the empty spaces that have been there for years. I'll take a sports complex that will be used daily over empty fenced in lots.