urbanSTL

prophett wrote:DT has had a very bad couple of weeks with the loss of the following items.

* VA 800 Jobs
* Lewis and Clark Statue moving away from DT to another location in the city
* Loss of Taste of STL ( This really is a big deal )
*Loss of Blues Fest

DT has lost it's mojo big time. Driving in the area last night was depressing. Also I know of at least 3 long time residents who are giving up on the area. There sick of it.

What do you think is wrong with Downtown? What can we do better? Is it out of our control? Don't you think it will eventually reach that turning point?

You sound very gloom and doom. Downtown is still growing residential population, so somebody still thinks it has mojo. I know just as many people who love Downtown and are never moving.

For those of you who think Downtown has one foot in the grave, imagine what it would be like without the added residents. It's also been cold as s*** lately and that always makes any Midwestern city feel depressing.

^ Add local harvest to the list of bad news this week(Although that isnt a huge surprise). Im teetering on giving up. Still more like a 70/30 stay/leave. Everyone says wait and see but that is becoming tiresome and the outlook is more of the same. Also i dont buy this cold winter BS. It was super quiet during the summer last year

^ Add local harvest to the list of bad news this week(Although that isnt a huge surprise). Im teetering on giving up. Still more like a 70/30 stay/leave. Everyone says wait and see but that is becoming tiresome and the outlook is more of the same. Also i dont buy this cold winter BS. It was super quiet during the summer last year

We lose 800 employes, a food festival, and a statue, and that causes you to give up?

Yet, we're adding residents for the Roberts Tower, Arcade, Chemical, among others. Upgrading Union Station. We've added a law school. We're adding a small entertainment district with Ballpark Village. Potentially adding a streetcar and two music festivals of about 75,000 people for the next 20 years. And there's still potential projects for the Jefferson Arms, the old municipal building next to Scottrade, and others floating around out there. I think we're doing alright. You must be tough to please.

The statue is staying on LKS Blvd by the way. Just moving off the cobblestone so it's not always flooded. We've also added a statue at Stifel. So we're a net positive on statues.

A new sign for "Asia Gourmet" just went up on one of the small buildings on Tucker across from the Jefferson Arms. Maybe a new restaurant? A small bright spot in all this gloom?

pat wrote:You must be tough to please.

Yes very

If there is one thing that bugs me about St Louis is the doom and gloom attitudes. Its seems flight always prevails over fight. If a restaurant closes or a series of bad news comes about, all the good things that have happened future developments are forgotten. The ability to make an holistic judgment is thrown out and knee jerk reactions prevail. Local Harvest is a poorly run small business. Period. Its closure is not that surprising.

Neighborhoods do not continue hyper growth like we had downtown from 2003-2010. The market has to settle and in that settling process there will be casualties and stagnation. The important thing to keep in mind is the fundamentals and investment in downtown remain strong. There are 3 places getting ready to open on Wash Ave as we speak. The time for this same shakeout pattern will come for places like Cherokee and the Grove as well. Places will close and people will move on. The key is to replace the people and places that leave and formulate a way to drive future growth.

If you are concerned about the prospects downtown, then do something about it. Frequent establishments, bring people downtown to do things, start a blog, tell people about the great things happening downtown, start a business, perform activities downtown like walking and jogging, etc. But just don’t sit there and say I am moving because I am tired of the bad news.

rawest1 wrote:Like anything else in St. Louis, it's always very much a two-steps-forward-one-step-back process. I suspect things will start looking up more in the summer with better weather and BPV and all the new residential buildings over the next year or two.

I think that's right. Just a little negative blip in the grand scheme. All in all, things are on the upswing all over the city I'd say.

I'm not doom and gloom on downtown in fact i love being in downtown i'll never stop being fascinating about the architecture and history of downtown.. I do feel like downtown has made a couple of bad moves like the failed proposal to remove 70/44 from downtown. Where was our leadership in this? I can honestly say i HATE driving on downtown streets they are horrible.. You're better off walking to avoid all the wear and tear.. Also traffic lights are way too long for the lack of traffic on the streets and roads. Why are they not flashing from 11pm till 6am ??
Also maybe residents are setting a tone with all the Larry Rice bull****..
With the recent crimes in such that been occurring downtown people don't want to deal with that either.. Who wants to go to a bar or restaurant when suddenly some person pulls out a gun or a report of a shooting just outside one of the night clubs... These are things to think about.
Leaders of downtown need to do some cleaning of things.. The Cardinals arent going to be the saving grace for downtown the residents aren't either. Downtown needs something big and the lack of retail downtown is abysmal theres simply no options for residents to get necessities such as clothing and other goods.. Culinaria is awesome i love it but with jobs leaving how long can it sustain its small gain in revenue for the foreseeable future.
I just think it's time for Slay and the gang to think smarter be bold and drive downtown into a new frontier...

dweebe wrote:

downtown2007 wrote:If there is one thing that bugs me about St Louis is the doom and gloom attitudes. Its seems flight always prevails over fight. If a restaurant closes or a series of bad news comes about, all the good things that have happened future developments are forgotten. The ability to make an holistic judgment is thrown out and knee jerk reactions prevail. Local Harvest is a poorly run small business. Period. Its closure is not that surprising.

Neighborhoods do not continue hyper growth like we had downtown from 2003-2010. The market has to settle and in that settling process there will be casualties and stagnation. The important thing to keep in mind is the fundamentals and investment in downtown remain strong. There are 3 places getting ready to open on Wash Ave as we speak. The time for this same shakeout pattern will come for places like Cherokee and the Grove as well. Places will close and people will move on. The key is to replace the people and places that leave and formulate a way to drive future growth.

If you are concerned about the prospects downtown, then do something about it. Frequent establishments, bring people downtown to do things, start a blog, tell people about the great things happening downtown, start a business, perform activities downtown like walking and jogging, etc. But just don’t sit there and say I am moving because I am tired of the bad news.

So you're saying we shouldn't be "down" after the recent spate of bad news with downtown?

Okay: la la la la la. Everything is great downtown! Business is wonderful! City Hall is doing a bang up job!

Taste of STL And Bluesweek were kicked out of downtown and will likely be replaced by something bigger. LH can't pay the rent and were evicted stemming from a poor business decision to open a suburban location.

Not saying you have to turn a blind eye but not all bad news can be taken at face value.

I would have to agree that people make mountains out of hills with any bad news. Losing the Taste is not a good thing but if we get 2 national acts in return, i dont see that as an overall negative. It would also not shock me if the Taste comes back downtown next year. Transferring a statue acrosss the street is nothing. Yes, losing 800 jobs hurts and is a big negative, but let's see over the next few months if any positive news about jobs comes out. As for Culinaria, every time I go it is always busy where I am always waiting in line to check out. So to me, they seem to be doing alright.

I just get tired of all the negativity. Things are not always great but things really are affected with word of mouth and perception. If we harp on every negative thing, it hurts the whole area. People are attracted to things that are hip and fresh, by constantly ripping downtown, you are only hurting the perception and it has a trickle down affect.

I also really do think the weather has taken a toll on people being out and about. The weekends are still crowded but i know a majority of people that just want to stay inside and be comfy. As for last summer, i thought the foot traffic was good and there were many people eating outside every day of the week.

My two cents.

Sorry no weather has nothing to do with a stagnated dt. When was the last time there was a movie night on the plaza for resident's , when was the last first friday happy hr , when are we going to see pot holes filled on the streets ,and where are the new jobs? You cant fill $1200 dollar apts when the day time population continues to decline. Moderators I recommend starting a new thread " the current state of dt". ..

prophett wrote:Sorry no weather has nothing to do with a stagnated dt. When was the last time there was a movie night on the plaza for resident's , when was the last first friday happy hr , when are we going to see pot holes filled on the streets ,and where are the new jobs? You cant fill $1200 dollar apts when the day time population continues to decline. Moderators I recommend starting a new thread " the current state of dt". ..

That programming was set up by the downtown partnership who was searching for a new CEO last year. Now that the CEO role was filled in Jan I would hope those activities come back in some form.

Quite frankly this has nothing to do with the amount of jobs downtown or the overall trend of downtown.

prophett wrote:You cant fill $1200 dollar apts when the day time population continues to decline.

well, you can actually. you can fill them with people who don't work downtown, which is what's been happening for the most part.

With slu students? Sure... I believe that...

Speaking for me, i do not work downtown and most of the people on my floor do not work downtown. Looking at the garage every morning, i would say the majority of the people do not work donwtown but choose to live downtown.

Other than me not being able to walk to my work, what is unhealthy about it?

It's not like I don't go grocery shopping, eat out at restaurants, go to bars, walk to sporting events, go for a jog downtown. So, I dont see what is negative about it. It is better than nobody living there.

The biggest dt residential population works at scott air force base. Layoffs at scott will be huge and will affect dts resident base significantly.

Presbyterian wrote:Government jobs are not the future of Downtown. Yes, a loss. But the trend line has been positive for fifteen years and does not appear to be changing.

All jobs are important to downtown!!!!!!!

Ok so the loss of the Law firms to clayton, Macy workers, May Company headquarters, ATT(whole building), 35% wellpoint contractors, others, I guess those dont matter either.

Im sure there have been some small gains but nothing to offset that. What has downtown lost over the past decade? 10000 jobs?