urbanSTL

I really hope/wish USL Pro (Division III) and NASL (Division II) would introduce relegation/promotion. It'd be amazing if they introduced a two-fold system wherein the team with the best record is promoted and the team with the best attendance is promoted. That would really encourage USL Pro fan bases to attend and owners to invest in the facilities/fan experience. It'd be a way for USL Pro fans to have a bigger impact on their team than any other sport. Not sure how the relegation from NASL would work, maybe just the worst two teams instead of an attendance element (somehow it seems more equitable to punish bad teams/owners than die-hard fans who show up to poorly attended games).

Perhaps at this early stage it's hard to introduce such a system since it would be a threat to investors in NASL (Division II) teams. But as teams get more established and owners look for more ways to get and keep fans interested I could see it being more of an option. Also, while MLS relegation/promotion seems unrealistic, USL Pro & NASL are the perfect laboratory to try it out.

St Louis is listed as a potential site for Copa America games in 2016 - this is a pretty big deal - I imagine that Busch is the likely venue - still a lot of vetting to be done - But an urban location near hotels and transport is preferred over some of the suburban NFL stadium locations - This would be a nice one to land and could bring tens of thousands to town depending on the draw

http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2 ... centenario

Prior tournaments have utilized seven or eight cities. I have no idea if being in the USA changes that equation.

Ambush indoor are 3rd in attendance in the MASL - averaging 5,523 per game - much better than I thought they would do - would live to see those numbers next spring at the Soccer Park

I don't think the stadium at the SG Soccer Park holds that many.

moorlander wrote:I don't think the stadium at the SG Soccer Park holds that many.

I think they max at at 5,000 - but can go above that with a lot SRO space

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/columns/ ... 7109d.html

Bernie Miklasz wrote:While in New York to meet with Grubman, Peacock also met with MLS commissioner Don Garber to gauge the soccer league’s interest in using a new Rams stadium as the home venue for an MLS expansion franchise. The MLS prefers soccer-specific stadiums but isn’t set on that. The MLS teams in Seattle and New England are housed in NFL stadiums. And the Falcons’ new stadium in Atlanta also will serve as the home for an MLS expansion franchise.

roger wyoming II wrote:^ whoah... the Saint Louis Speculatron just exploded!

It's a pretty big deal, in my opinion. To be clear, this is not the first time Bernie Miklasz has alluded to the path for the MLS to St. Louis being through a new football venue (see this article from 2013), but this is the first time, as far as I know, that someone actively engaged in new stadium plans in the St. Louis area has met with the MLS commissioner with the intention of pitching the possibility of an MLS team playing in that new stadium... at least since the failed efforts for a new stadium in the Metro East back 3-5 years ago.

It makes a lot of sense: the more immediate, concrete uses for this hypothetical new stadium Peacock can bring to the table, the easier it will probably be to secure funding, be it public or private, for said hypothetical new stadium.

This is gonna be an interesting thing to keep an eye on.

Greatest St. Louis wrote:

roger wyoming II wrote:^ whoah... the Saint Louis Speculatron just exploded!

It's a pretty big deal, in my opinion. To be clear, this is not the first time Bernie Miklasz has alluded to the path for the MLS to St. Louis being through a new football venue (see this article from 2013), but this is the first time, as far as I know, that someone actively engaged in new stadium plans in the St. Louis area has met with the MLS commissioner with the intention of pitching the possibility of an MLS team playing in that new stadium... at least since the failed efforts for a new stadium in the Metro East back 3-5 years ago.

It makes a lot of sense: the more immediate, concrete uses for this hypothetical new stadium Peacock can bring to the table, the easier it will probably be to secure funding, be it public or private, for said hypothetical new stadium.

This is gonna be an interesting thing to keep an eye on.

What would be more interesting and currently lacking (to the best of knowledge) is an ownership group - The price of expansion teams is going up and now there are several cities looking for a place at the table -

Sacramento - working very hard with good grass roots support
Las Vegas - Just last week passed a bill that would build a publicly financed stadium if a franchise is awarded
Minneapolis - MLS ready stadium under construction - Lead contender for the fourth expansion team

and in an interesting twist Beck's Miami club appears to be in limbo - no stadium and no good prospects on the horizon. The league really wants a team there and rescinding the offer seems like a long shot - but grows more likely with each proposal-less month that passes

MLS has a history of finding ownership groups for markets they want to be in - St. Louis while being talked about during the Cooper years was never attractive enough for the Don to drop an interested owner on us to close the sizable gap that Cooper needed to cover.

Could Kronke be an owner? already is - but has problems with the NFL owning a team outside of his NFL market - swapping out the rapids for a STL expansion could solve part of his problem there.

The Yankees are part owners of NYCFC along with Man City - Could the Dewitt's be in play? WWT co-founder Jim Kavanaugh is wealthy and interested - but would be part of a team as the fees and financial requirements for expansion have increased exponentially in the past decade.

The next round of expansion has not been determined and will depend on interest - the stadiums are full, but the TV numbers are bad. There has been a nice World Cup bounce in interest, but big time tensions between the league and USMNT, where Klinsmann is asking his players to bypass the MLS and play in Europe instead.

The play has improved, but still far below most European leagues, Americans seem to be embracing footy culture (why not it is drinking and community oriented) despite a mediocre but improving product.

My guess is that MLS still has a decade of growth to get to good product and be mentioned in the same breath as the US 'big 4" pro sports, could be sooner if ESPN got on the band wagon the same way they jumped on the NBA in the 90's.

I think after this round it could be 2019 or 20 for the next expansion round - play starting in 2022 or 23, but as my predictions from last year show - I am not good at it

beer city wrote:

Greatest St. Louis wrote:

roger wyoming II wrote:^ whoah... the Saint Louis Speculatron just exploded!

The Yankees are part owners of NYCFC along with Man City - Could the Dewitt's be in play? WWT co-founder Jim Kavanaugh is wealthy and interested - but would be part of a team as the fees and financial requirements for expansion have increased exponentially in the past decade.

I had speculated/wished earlier in the thread that the Yankees/Man City/NYCFC model would be a good one for St. Louis with a Cardinal/Rams/Arsenal/STLFC-styled arrangement. If Stan gets his stadium then perhaps he could pay it back with an MLS expansion team backed by him and the DeWitts, with the cache of having an attachment to Arsenal.

MLS is anti-promotion/relegation, but while we are dreaming...
I would like to see an eventual 40-team MLS with an MLS Premier and MLS Championship "leagues". The leagues play separate seasons, with promotion up from the Championship to Premier, and relegation downward. But the end of the season tournament would include the top teams from both leagues. Say the top four from the Premier would get automatic byes into the quarter finals, and the next 8 from the Premier, and top 8 from the Championship would have two rounds of play-in games to get into the quarter finals.

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/columns/ ... baece.html

Bernie Miklasz wrote:Peacock has also reached out to MLS commissioner Don Garber to lay the groundwork for obtaining a soccer franchise for St. Louis during a future round of MLS expansion. The soccer team would play in the Rams’ stadium.

I can add something else: the proposed stadium will be one part of a major development of the northern St. Louis riverfront, which is loaded with mostly unoccupied buildings.

juiceinkirkwood wrote:Don't know if anyone has mentioned this yet, but Kroenke's ownership group already owns an MLS team in Denver.

Yeah - that is why I think swapping ownership for a St. Louis team could help him out from a NFL stand point

I'm not sure that MLS is even a factor in the NFL's cross-ownership rule. I'm not sure it's not either, but I was under the impression that it's just NHL, NBA, and MLB. Maybe because when that rule came about MLS wasn't much of anything (or maybe literally nothing).

In any case, I suspect Kroenke could solve it in whatever way he chooses to solve his issues with the other 2 Denver teams. In the past MLS used to allow an owner to own multiple teams, but I believe they've reached the stage where they'd like 1 owner with 1 team.

...and we're back...

With St. Louis back in the mix - heard directly from the Don's mouth along with San Antonio as viable expansion cities - Garber is coming st St. Louis himself to check out the scene - From the article -

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/soc ... 1356592718

Has the number of expansion candidates narrowed?

“It’s actually getting bigger. I am going to be out in St. Louis in the next couple of weeks. St. Louis has got a lot of activity going on with a stadium they are trying to get done for the Rams. There is a big soccer community there and we would love to see the soccer stadium downtown like they are thinking about with a football stadium.

“San Antonio has been very active. There is a lot of stuff going on. There is a lot of interest in expansion.”

Given that there's an excellent chance the NFL leaves, is there any chance a scaled-down, MLS-specific stadium gets built on the riverfront absent a football co-tenant? I'm not going to get too excited about anything NFL-dependent.

MarkHaversham wrote:Given that there's an excellent chance the NFL leaves, is there any chance a scaled-down, MLS-specific stadium gets built on the riverfront absent a football co-tenant? I'm not going to get too excited about anything NFL-dependent.

all we need is an owner, no peeps on that front

How about we. build just the lower bowl for soccer but with hooks in to build the upper bowl if the NFL ever decides it wants another shot at my discretionary entertainment money.

Ah, the classic St. Louis mentality of "let's half-ass it for now, punt the other half down the road and hope that thirty years from now someone else might pick up the slack."

Greatest St. Louis wrote:Ah, the classic St. Louis mentality of "let's half-ass it for now, punt the other half down the road and hope that thirty years from now someone else might pick up the slack."

I don't think building a quality professional soccer stadium for MLS is "half-assing" it. Allowing for a future NFL team is just permitting future growth.