Ha, yeah. Good for a few laughs!dweebe wrote:Why would a 49ers wide receiver stuff the ballot box?innov8ion wrote:This isn't a scientific poll and as such can't really be used to cull any useful any information from it. For all we know, Jerry Rice stuff the ballot box.DeBaliviere wrote:I'm surprised that so many people oppose cracking down on charities that feed homeless people in the parks.
can't it be both?
Absolutely.
Most posters here know that the weekly MayorSlay.com Mini-Poll is not exactly scientific. It is neither predictive nor representative, by design. Its purpose is to encourage civic conversation on issues -- and to amuse its readers. The polls get lots of comments from readers, extending the dialogue with their own stories, objecting to questions, suggesting additional questions and new topics . . .
The polls change every Thursday. The homelessness poll is a week old. The current week's topic is cyber habits and manners. The coming week's topic will likely bemuse a couple of this forum's regulars.
TGE-ATW wrote:I liked the question about whether you supported the idea of bringing voting machines to homeless shelters to encourage eligible voters there to vote. That is great. Lets really work to turn out the homeless vote next election by bringing the voting machines to them, while everybody else has to either take time off of work or fight the crowds before/after the work day to vote. If there is one thing this country needs it is more people voting on issues that they know nothing about. Yes, I am assuming that homeless people in general are even less well versed in the issues that the country faces than the average American.
Great point!
And...who would be paying for this service? Us tax-payers, as usual.
And..the results of that answer surprised me more than the ludicrous question itself. 54% said they would support it vs. 46% who oppose it.
Unbelievable!!
- 1,768
publiceye wrote:can't it be both?
Absolutely.
Most posters here know that the weekly MayorSlay.com Mini-Poll is not exactly scientific. It is neither predictive nor representative, by design. Its purpose is to encourage civic conversation on issues -- and to amuse its readers. The polls get lots of comments from readers, extending the dialogue with their own stories, objecting to questions, suggesting additional questions and new topics . . .
The polls change every Thursday. The homelessness poll is a week old. The current week's topic is cyber habits and manners. The coming week's topic will likely bemuse a couple of this forum's regulars.
So we're NOT repainting the MLK then?
- 8
so far the daily cleanup seems to be working well. besides picking up trash, etc. and making sure that the trash cans are emptied regularly and the landscaping is kept nice, it keeps people from accumulating their belongings in trees and under/around trees and benches and, as a result, seems to keep the messy folk from becoming permanent fixtures in the park. who wants to move all of their belongings once a day?
someone commented earlier about there being no one in the park at night when they passed by... the park does have a curfew. the curfew seems to have become more lax since the weather got warmer, however, it's either being enforced again and/or the 2-3p daily closure combined with the "move it or lose it" of belongings seems to be discouraging sleepovers (as most who sleep there are the ones who accumulate stuff and trash).
re: taxpayers.
many (not all, but many) of the homeless in LP and nearby parks have jobs in the city and/or receive a fixed income. they pay taxes and have direct deposit into checking accounts, which do not require a home address--a p.o. box can suffice.
re: larry rice & other shelters.
the homeless i've talked to steer clear of many of these services because they come with strings attached or are too difficult to get a hold of due to organization rules & regulations. i don't think larry rice, as much as i am not a fan of the practices of his that i've seen, is the root of the problem.
re: feeding people in the parks.
as far as birdseed and garbage goes, there are a number of organizations (who are not NLEC) and well-meaning citizens--many from the county--who bring food, supplies, etc. to the park. this stuff is picked through by the homeless/poor folk and the unwanted things are often littered about the park, by the same culprits who leave their trash around campsites and accumulate an amalgam of filth. it would be nice if those doing the feeding would also spearhead the cleanup.
snarky sidenote:
it would also be nice if my fellow residents would clean up after their dogs.
constructive follow-up:
the ground between the sidewalk and 13th at st. charles reeks of dog pee. i wonder if spreading lime would help?
re: friends of lucas park.
good suggestion. i'll be attending this week's dslra mtg and will hopefully meet some likeminded folk.
someone commented earlier about there being no one in the park at night when they passed by... the park does have a curfew. the curfew seems to have become more lax since the weather got warmer, however, it's either being enforced again and/or the 2-3p daily closure combined with the "move it or lose it" of belongings seems to be discouraging sleepovers (as most who sleep there are the ones who accumulate stuff and trash).
re: taxpayers.
many (not all, but many) of the homeless in LP and nearby parks have jobs in the city and/or receive a fixed income. they pay taxes and have direct deposit into checking accounts, which do not require a home address--a p.o. box can suffice.
re: larry rice & other shelters.
the homeless i've talked to steer clear of many of these services because they come with strings attached or are too difficult to get a hold of due to organization rules & regulations. i don't think larry rice, as much as i am not a fan of the practices of his that i've seen, is the root of the problem.
re: feeding people in the parks.
as far as birdseed and garbage goes, there are a number of organizations (who are not NLEC) and well-meaning citizens--many from the county--who bring food, supplies, etc. to the park. this stuff is picked through by the homeless/poor folk and the unwanted things are often littered about the park, by the same culprits who leave their trash around campsites and accumulate an amalgam of filth. it would be nice if those doing the feeding would also spearhead the cleanup.
snarky sidenote:
it would also be nice if my fellow residents would clean up after their dogs.
constructive follow-up:
the ground between the sidewalk and 13th at st. charles reeks of dog pee. i wonder if spreading lime would help?
re: friends of lucas park.
good suggestion. i'll be attending this week's dslra mtg and will hopefully meet some likeminded folk.
So we're NOT repainting the MLK then?
Nope. I've spent the last year listening to the photographer complain about how tedious the photo-shopping for that one was.
i don't think larry rice, as much as i am not a fan of the practices of his that i've seen, is the root of the problem.
- 6,775
johnny sunshine wrote:re: larry rice & other shelters.
the homeless i've talked to steer clear of many of these services because they come with strings attached or are too difficult to get a hold of due to organization rules & regulations. i don't think larry rice, as much as i am not a fan of the practices of his that i've seen, is the root of the problem.
You mean those pesky "strings" like you can't sell drugs or drink beer in the shelter?
- 10K
^
It looks like Larry is making people wear t-shirts. I've seen several people walking around downtown wearing NLEC t-shirts lately.
It looks like Larry is making people wear t-shirts. I've seen several people walking around downtown wearing NLEC t-shirts lately.
DeBaliviere wrote:^
It looks like Larry is making people wear t-shirts. I've seen several people walking around downtown wearing NLEC t-shirts lately.
He should now require deodorant and muzzles.
- 2,093
Just for fun Larry should find some puffy shirts to make them wear.
[/quote]snarky sidenote:
it would also be nice if my fellow residents would clean up after their dogs.
constructive follow-up:
the ground between the sidewalk and 13th at st. charles reeks of dog pee. i wonder if spreading lime would help?[/quote]
Dogs are supposed to go to the bathroom outside, people are not. Besides, how are your fellow residents supposed to clean up dog piss? Have you invented some kind of doggie-diaper?
it would also be nice if my fellow residents would clean up after their dogs.
constructive follow-up:
the ground between the sidewalk and 13th at st. charles reeks of dog pee. i wonder if spreading lime would help?[/quote]
Dogs are supposed to go to the bathroom outside, people are not. Besides, how are your fellow residents supposed to clean up dog piss? Have you invented some kind of doggie-diaper?
- 10K
southsidepride wrote:Just for fun Larry should find some puffy shirts to make them wear.
We could be known for having the largest population of homeless pirates. Maybe that would bump up our ranking on the "weirdness" scale and FastCompany would rank us as an up-and-coming city!!
TGE-ATW wrote:snarky sidenote:
it would also be nice if my fellow residents would clean up after their dogs.
constructive follow-up:
the ground between the sidewalk and 13th at st. charles reeks of dog pee. i wonder if spreading lime would help?
Dogs are supposed to go to the bathroom outside, people are not. Besides, how are your fellow residents supposed to clean up dog piss? Have you invented some kind of doggie-diaper?
The problem is we haven't had a good soaking rain for a long while that would clean things up. The Live on the Levee concerts were not fully enjoyable because all the horse drawn carriages park in that area during the day. The resulting smell was not nice.
I've got it bad by my apartment. Living within a block of me are two Irish Wolfhounds, a Bull Mastiff, two German Shepherds, three Golden Retrievers, a full size/standard poodle and two Labs. These large dogs have decided to have a territory marking /crap war in the small strip of grass between the street and the sidewalk and most of their owners don't clean up after their dogs.
I caught the owner of the Irish Wolfhound this morning not cleaning up after her dog. I gave her a super sarcastic "Thanks for cleaning up after your dogs." Classy b*tch flipped me off.
- 6,775
dweebe wrote:I caught the owner of the Irish Wolfhound this morning not cleaning up after her dog. I gave her a super sarcastic "Thanks for cleaning up after your dogs." Classy b*tch flipped me off.
Take her picture. Then tell her you're calling the police.
Johnny,
Sounds like you found some progress in the area. That's good news.
Sounds like you found some progress in the area. That's good news.
Johnnie - The DSLRA meeting you mention is a board meeting and not open to the general public. We do host monthly social events, and at times break out into subteams to tackle relevant downtown issues. I encourage you and other downtown residents to take part.
Also, Kacie Starr Triplett, the 6th ward alderman, is hosting a forum for downtown residents on Monday the 13th. Since Lucas Park is in her ward, this topic would appear to be fair game. See http://dslra.org/content/view/29/1/ for more information.
Also, Kacie Starr Triplett, the 6th ward alderman, is hosting a forum for downtown residents on Monday the 13th. Since Lucas Park is in her ward, this topic would appear to be fair game. See http://dslra.org/content/view/29/1/ for more information.
I like this idea. Even if you don't have a pic phone, just pretend. It might do the trick.......The Central Scrutinizer wrote:dweebe wrote:I caught the owner of the Irish Wolfhound this morning not cleaning up after her dog. I gave her a super sarcastic "Thanks for cleaning up after your dogs." Classy b*tch flipped me off.
Take her picture. Then tell her you're calling the police.
I love how the city of Chicago works. First they count crimes differently than the FBI and most other big cities. That way we don't get reported in national lists about crime.
Now Mayor Daley's office claims there's only 24 homeless living in downtown Chicago.
http://www.suntimes.com/news/politics/5 ... 10.article
Now Mayor Daley's office claims there's only 24 homeless living in downtown Chicago.
http://www.suntimes.com/news/politics/5 ... 10.article
- 1,493
I call that being smart. Nothing wrong with fighting a PR battle with equal intensity as Quitno uses to smear cities.dweebe wrote:I love how the city of Chicago works. First they count crimes differently than the FBI and most other big cities. That way we don't get reported in national lists about crime.
Now Mayor Daley's office claims there's only 24 homeless living in downtown Chicago.
http://www.suntimes.com/news/politics/5 ... 10.article
There needs to be a reason for residents to utilize Lucas Park. Even if there were no homeless in Lucas Park, there would still be little to no reason to go.
The neighborhood demographic is comprised mainly of empty nesters and young professionals without children. Yet Lucas Park seems to be dominated by playground equipment. Doesn't this seem out of place?
What if space was made up for residents to utilize and help establish community? A dog park. Barbeque pits and a picnic area. A community garden which residents can tend to. All of these ideas can better promote a sense of community. What do you guys and gals think? Your feedback and ideas are important.
There's been a lot of talk and no action in regards to the park itself. I've contacted our alderman and have informed her of my interest in spearheading improvements to the park as a downtown resident and member of the DSLRA. If she bites, I'd like to enlist your help in making Lucas Park something that downtown residents can be proud of.
Yes, homeless currently congregate in the park. No, they aren't to be demonized. The dog park could be membership only and require an RFID passkey to utilize. The picnic area could require some sort of reservation as well. (No different from other parks, I believe) And the garden, perhaps even a plot could be saved for the homeless to tend to. This could be a statement of good will...
Other initiatives are being worked to help the homeless. They're not being ignored. All I know is that I'm sick to death of hearing people complain about Lucas Park. Let's use that energy to instead work together to improve the park and take it back.
The neighborhood demographic is comprised mainly of empty nesters and young professionals without children. Yet Lucas Park seems to be dominated by playground equipment. Doesn't this seem out of place?
What if space was made up for residents to utilize and help establish community? A dog park. Barbeque pits and a picnic area. A community garden which residents can tend to. All of these ideas can better promote a sense of community. What do you guys and gals think? Your feedback and ideas are important.
There's been a lot of talk and no action in regards to the park itself. I've contacted our alderman and have informed her of my interest in spearheading improvements to the park as a downtown resident and member of the DSLRA. If she bites, I'd like to enlist your help in making Lucas Park something that downtown residents can be proud of.
Yes, homeless currently congregate in the park. No, they aren't to be demonized. The dog park could be membership only and require an RFID passkey to utilize. The picnic area could require some sort of reservation as well. (No different from other parks, I believe) And the garden, perhaps even a plot could be saved for the homeless to tend to. This could be a statement of good will...
Other initiatives are being worked to help the homeless. They're not being ignored. All I know is that I'm sick to death of hearing people complain about Lucas Park. Let's use that energy to instead work together to improve the park and take it back.
- 2,005
From mayorslay.com today
Thursday, August 23, 2007
Lucas Park
My mail folder regularly contains correspondence on the subject of homeless people in Downtown’s parks, though the tone and suggestions vary wildly. For example, some people write to say that the City is not doing enough to remove homeless people from Downtown’s several parks. Other people complain that the City*s policies regarding its parks and some of their users are too harsh. Most of the mail is thoughtful; some of it, though, is not.
I do not think that the most pressing problem presented by homeless people is that they can be seen from the windows of expensive condos. However, I also do not believe that that the range of activities permitted in public spaces, like parks, should include erecting shelters, buying or selling drugs, drinking alcohol, breaking things, littering, fighting, terrorizing passersby and each other, or bathing.
Obviously (at least to me), the most pressing problem presented by chronically homeless people is the need to identify their problems and address them. That means matching people to available services, a process that usually takes some time and always takes coordination. The City has a plan in place to do just that — and we have made substantial progress in our goal of connecting every homeless person to housing and other services. In the interim, we have created more services so homeless people can get a meal (not in a park), take a shower (not in a park), use the bathroom (not in a park), and store their belongings (not in a park).
One of the battlegrounds for homeless people, their advocates. and the people who complain about them has been Lucas Park, a small green space behind Washington Avenue across from the St. Louis Public Library and adjacent to several faith-based homeless centers. Lucas Park has been a popular (and loud) gathering spot for homeless people for decades, resisting almost every public and private effort to make it cleaner, safer, and quieter. It has my attention.
We have asked the suburban churches who feed the homeless in Lucas Park to do so in a more sanitary place, like one of the drop-in centers we helped create. We have told them that we will, albeit reluctantly, enforce our health code and ordinances against them, if they do not stop the practice. We have begun closing Lucas Park for an hour every day to clean it. And we have begun strictly enforcing all park regulations, City ordinances, and state laws — whether the perpetrators are homeless or not, especially against repeat offenders. As a result of this effort, Lucas Park is looking better — though, some of its usual inhabitants have simply moved up or down the block to new spaces and new inhabitants have arrived from other parts of the region to take their places. Our efforts will follow them.
There is one last point to make, one that you have heard me make before: homelessness is a regional problem that other communities in the region largely address by doing nothing. Until the suburbs create their own programs and coordinate their own efforts with ours, the City — and its residents — will continue bear disproportionate share of the costs and burdens. That’s wrong for a lot of reasons. (Editors and reporters take note.)
If the rest of the region doesn't want to open shelters, then downtown should say, fine, we'll close ours too. Build shelters along the riverfront, or elsewhere. Do homeless shelters need to be in the HEART of downtown St. Louis? Does Michigan Avenue or Newberry Street have homeless shelters on them? This city is 62 square miles, plenty of it barren and vacant, build the best homeless shelters in America there, NOT downtown. And yes, our problem isn't even close to that of many other cities, especially Denver, but there are plenty of people in STL who still think it's cooler, oddly, to want to live in the clean/sterile "downtown" Clayton highrises, than those in a REAL urban downtown.. maybe homelessness is a major reason why...
The Post Dispatch's headline today regarding Lucas Park seemed a bit off-base. "Homeless clash with push to gentrify city." Framing the issue in this fashion seems a bit disingenuous. If there is any clash, it is a clash against homelessness; not the homeless themselves.
Just why do homeless congregate in Lucas Park and its environs? It is clear that the mix of homeless services in the area is currently inadequate. The city, along with private enterprise, is working together to expand services to better help the homeless and eventually help get them back on their feet.
Additionally, do you consider public urination, drug-use, littering and panhandling to be acceptable behavior? How would you feel if this was in your backyard? Would you feel safe as a single woman living in the area? Would you take your children here? Walk your dog? As a good person, I think you would work to both help the plight of the homeless and in the process, improve local conditions.
And if you want to help, please align with services that are working to best help the homeless. Services like Centenary Church, New Horizons and the St. Patrick Center.
Given this information, if anyone took issue with these aims, I'd really be interested in understanding their true motivations. Because as someone that lives in the neigbhorhood, ours are genuine.
Full article here: http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument
Just why do homeless congregate in Lucas Park and its environs? It is clear that the mix of homeless services in the area is currently inadequate. The city, along with private enterprise, is working together to expand services to better help the homeless and eventually help get them back on their feet.
Additionally, do you consider public urination, drug-use, littering and panhandling to be acceptable behavior? How would you feel if this was in your backyard? Would you feel safe as a single woman living in the area? Would you take your children here? Walk your dog? As a good person, I think you would work to both help the plight of the homeless and in the process, improve local conditions.
And if you want to help, please align with services that are working to best help the homeless. Services like Centenary Church, New Horizons and the St. Patrick Center.
Given this information, if anyone took issue with these aims, I'd really be interested in understanding their true motivations. Because as someone that lives in the neigbhorhood, ours are genuine.
Full article here: http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument