urbanSTL

Gone Corporate wrote:Focus: The problem is not homeless people themselves. The problem is Larry Rice's management of the facilities to house them and the detrimental effects that his actions have on the surrounding area and Downtown as a whole. Remember that this is the same guy who wanted the Federal Building next to the Kiel turned into a homeless warehouse. I do not believe the majority of respondents here are against the homeless per se, just Larry Rice's operational mismanagement of a homeless shelter where, if we remember, some guy was stabbed & killed earlier this year.

This is also the same man that has requested the city hand over 1 square mile (or some such) of land to set up a shanty town. How this would best help transition the homeless back to society, I have no clue. What I do know is that it would serve his selfish interest in making the homeless issue look much larger and more inhumane than it is. After all, what looks worse and can help gather more funds from our beloved elderly -- homeless subsisting in shelters or shanty towns? Not to mention, a shanty town would cost him far less money.



As a downtown resident and homeless advocate, I am sick and tired of this man that claims to be a godly minister and true advocate for the homeless. Any minister I know would work constructively with the social service community in best serving the interests of the homeless and also be sensitive to the community they reside in. This wolf in sheep's clothing does neither.



Additionally, his rhetoric pushes an us (residents) vs. them (the homeless) mentality that is disingenuous and non-productive. I think most downtown residents are supportive of the homeless and their successful transition back to contemporary society. Through his words and actions, Larry Rice brings discord to the community and does not effectively help the homeless.



His establishment breaks countless city codes and he has been observed to encourage the homeless to become a nuisance in the neighborhood. This is fact.



I believe it is now time for the community to ask the city to enforce its code, of which there are many violations. These code violations place the homeless at risk. Through Larry Rice's stewardship, he has blighted the neighborhood and is detrimental to the same homeless he aims to support.



Unless these code violations and nuisance issues are addressed, I support the city in declaring eminent domain if Larry Rice does not sell the NLEC property. To address the homeless and in the short-term, the city could work with Larry in establishing a more suitable property that passes code violations. In the longer term, the city and social service community should push for a private shelter run by a more effective and trusted sponsor.

Keep 'em coming...



If you need a petition, they are on Washington Ave. at several different locations (bars, restaurants, businesses, lofts, condos).



If you feel that NLEC is a detriment to our neighborhood sign it. The city will enforce the law when we show through proper legal channels that NLEC is a detriment to our neighborhood.



If you need to register to vote then here is the link:

http://www.co.st-louis.mo.us/Elections/ ... EG_APP.pdf

Can you be more specific where I can one? I will be more that happy to sign one.

Here's an electronic copy of the petition that is now available...



If you live within the immediate vicinity of NLEC, please sign the physical one.



This electronic copy is being used to show political support for the petition to the mayor's office, alderwoman Kacie Star-Tripplett, and the BPS.





http://www.petitiononline.com/NLECDetr/petition.html

^ Great, but where are the physical petitions available? Please be specific.

I'm reluctant to state EXACTLY (until this Thursday) where the petitions are located.



Suffice to say for right now most of the condos / bars / restaurants / shops on Washington Ave either have one or know of it. Especially the ones closest to the affected area.



If you know of a condo that would like copies, let me know and I'll make sure that they are delivered and who to give them to.



You can always message me directly and I'll make sure that you get several copies.

I just read the article in the RFT; and I completely agree with you and your petition.



The only problem; as stated in the article is....where are these people going to go if the shelter closes? Believe me, I have lived Downtown for 4+ years and the biggest problem is the effect of this shelter on "our community." But if they close down, I picture something possibly worse; all the homeless from inside the building end up on the street and in the parks. Granted after a few months a lot of these people will head for other cities etc, but what about everyone else?



Granted the biggest problem of all will come when loft owners just move away from the problem....out of the city.

^ Good work, Andy. The link to the RFT article is here: http://riverfronttimes.com/2008-08-06/n ... r-he-runs/



As for where the homeless would stay if Rice's current shelter were to close -- it's time for our politicians to start actively working this issue instead of the status quo of passing the buck. This includes but is not limited to alderwoman Kaci Starr Triplett, who is alderwoman for this location. Alderwomen Phyllis Young and April Ford-Griffin have constituents affected by this debacle as well so please contact them to express your support. Their contact information is located here: http://stlcin.missouri.org/alderman/ald.cfm



I ask for our elected officials to take this issue more seriously and work creatively to solve this problem. Like I've said before:

I believe it is now time for city to enforce its code, of which there are many violations. Why would you create the code in the first place if you're not going to enforce it?!?



These code violations place the homeless at risk. Through Larry Rice's stewardship, he has blighted the neighborhood and is detrimental to the same homeless he aims to support. Above and beyond code violations, his operations promote a gross nuisance to the neighborhood as defined by the Board of Public Service.



Unless these code violations and nuisance issues are addressed, I support the city in declaring eminent domain if Larry Rice does not sell the NLEC property. To address the homeless and in the short-term, I encourage the city to work with Rev. Rice in establishing a more suitable property that passes code violations. In the longer term, the city and social service community should push for a private shelter run by a more effective and trusted sponsor.

innov8ion wrote:As for where the homeless would stay if Rice's current shelter were to close -- it's time for our politicians to start actively working this issue instead of the status quo of passing the buck.

At least we know that if the shelter wasn't there, homeless people from outside of the city would no longer be dropped off there.

Correct.



If the supply dries up, the demand will go elsewhere to competition.



Hopefully the competition will actually help to transition more people.

The Centenary CARES program is the cities answer to Larry Rice. They are encouraging those groups that have previously been feeding the people on the streets to use that energy and money to work through the facility at Centenary. That way the food can be assured of meeting health department standards and the chaos they bring to the streets is better regulated. Also by providing a place where the homeless can hang out during the day, it gets them off the streets and into a safe environment. Both the city officials and downtown business organizations are behind this effort. Until recently the majority of the shelters were closed during the day (only open at night for sleeping) and did not provide a noontime meal. The Centenary CARES program is always in need of people and finances, instead of complaining about the problems be apart of the solution and help them out. If you don't have the time write a check.

Centenary CARES is part of the solution, but it is not the answer to Jerry Rice. NLEC is a shelter. Centenary CARES is not.

The majority of the complaints expressed by the individuals on this forum are related to the homeless congregating in the public places around NLEC. By proving them with a noon meal and a safe place to hang out during the day when Larry Rice and other similar shelters are closed these issues will be greatly reduced. The city can then target those individuals who refuse to comply.

southcitygent wrote:The city can then target those individuals who refuse to comply.

^ Wrong. That violates civil liberties.



People just don't seem to get it. You don't "target" the homeless. If anything, you "target" individuals like Jerry Rice of NLEC who are a disgrace to the homeless care community. But there had better be a replacement shelter in the process. One that meets city code and is not such a nuisance to the public.

Lucas park is first and foremost a PARK. It is not a homeless shelter, it is not a place to sleep, it is not a place to litter, it is not a bathroom, it is not a place to do drugs, it is not a place to feed people, it is not a place to drink malt liquor all day long, it is not a place to fight, it is not a place to put 32 loaves of out of date bread on a park bench, it is not a place to put your "stuff" during the day.



Lucas park is a PARK which should be enjoyed and used by all as a PARK.



If people follow the laws, rules, and regulations then we won't have a problem.



Can you imagine what would happen if everyone ignored the laws? What do you think would happen? How is it fair that businesses, residents, and everyone else has to follow the rules and we create a "politically correct" exception for the "homeless" because we feel sorry for them. I call BS on this.



Housing status does NOT exempt you from laws, rules, and ordinances.

I live in the city, own property in the city, pay all manner of taxes in the city and am unable to enjoy the park, a basic public service, because of everything that goes on there.



Is it really so much to ask that we be able to use a friggin park...seems reasonable to me.

I posted the statement below to a comment by a SLU student named Mr. Ken Homan in the RFT, "Fried Rice" article located here: http://www.riverfronttimes.com/2008-08- ... er-he-runs



--

Your post almost made me shed a tear, Mr. Homan. It's now time to welcome you back to reality. This is not a question of solving the homeless problem or not. It will unfortunately never be completely solved; simply because some people don't want to transition back to traditional society.



To be clear, this is a two-fold issue. First, about helping the homeless transition back to society in the best possible manner. Larry Rice's less than stellar reputation in the homeless services community was alluded to in this article, however this will soon be made crystal clear to the public at-large and to our city government.



Additionally, Rice's rhetoric pushes an us (downtown residents) vs. them (the homeless) mentality that is disingenuous and needlessly divides the community. I think most downtown residents are supportive of the homeless and their successful transition back to contemporary society. This thought is unfortunately lost on many who attempt to grasp the facts of this tender issue.



As a downtown resident and homeless advocate, I am sick and tired of this man that claims to be a godly minister and true advocate for the homeless. Any minister I know would work constructively with the social service community in best serving the interests of the homeless and also be sensitive to the community they reside in. This wolf in sheep's clothing does neither.



Larry Rice will be exposed for what he truly is; a charlatan. The homeless and community at-large deserve a more effective partner in the homeless service continuum. Unfortunately Rice is not that man.



Second, the issue of respect for all people -- not just those that are homeless.



Ken, may I ask where you live? Would you mind if your yard and the park your child plays in was consistently desecrated? Do you even have a child? Ken, as the thoughtful Christian you claim to be, I challenge you to open both your heart and mind and think about the welfare of not just one part of the community -- but the community as a whole.



With that said, I ask you to read a St. Louis City Code specifically dealing with respect. You will find it in Chapter 11.72, titled "Roominghouse or Hotel Detrimental to Neighborhood." The link is here: http://www.slpl.lib.mo.us/cco/code/data/t1172.htm



In that code, you will notice subsection 11.72.050, titled "Determination of detrimental operation of premises." Most if not all the determining factors listed in the city code apply in and around Lucas Park as a result of those that frequent the NLEC. This includes but is not limited to lewd and indecent conduct, public urination and defecation, sale of illegal drugs, littering, etc. A reasonable person would be apt to come to the conclusion that the NLEC is clearly in violation of this city code.



The flames of injustice have been fanning for far too long. The homeless deserve a better service provider who truly has their interests in mind and the community deserves a genuine homeless service provider that is not divisive, is respectful, and will work with us. The time for sitting idly by has passed. The time for action is now.



So what can be done to improve services for the homelesss and increase respect for the community as a whole? Here are some ideas to get the conversation started.



In the short term:



- Alderman Triplett can work with the Department of Human Services, the Board of Alderman, the Mayor's office, the Board of Public Service and the private sector.

- The Board of Public Service can and should issue a notice to the NLEC declaring each and every violation. The seriousness of these violations and possible courses of action should be relayed. If Rev. Rice will not work with the community and our government, this includes potentially repealing NLEC's hoteling permit and eminent domain.

- Work with Rev. Rice and/or other parties in establishing a more suitable shelter that passes code violations. This could include helping him to sell his current property for fair market value.



In the longer term:



- The city and social service community should push for a private shelter run by a more effective and trusted sponsor.



What can you do?

Do you want to help both the homeless and residents? Are you tired of sending in complaints to the Citizen's Service Bureau that accomplishes absolutely nothing? We need your help.



Please sign the petition so your voice can be heard in a hearing at the Board of Public Service. It is located here: http://www.martello.org/NLEC/NLEC_Detrimental.html



No matter if you live downtown or not, please contact your alderman and the Mayor to express your support. Heck, you could even cut and paste this message in an email to them. I think they'll get the picture.



CONTACT Mayor Slay @ http://stlcin.missouri.org/index/contactelect.cfm?ID=1



CONTACT your alderman @ http://stlcin.missouri.org/alderman/WardMap.cfm



Key Aldermen

- BOA President, Lewis Reed

- Alderman, Kacie Starr Triplett (NLEC resides in her ward)



Thanks,

Dave

SLUH Student. Was at least.



I know the family. Don't really know Ken much, but I know his older sister.

Excellent response, Inno.

Ken, may I ask where you live? Would you mind if your yard and the park your child plays in was consistently desecrated? Do you even have a child?

This really got me thinking. My house backs up to a playground. If a single homeless or non-homeless person showed up and shouted obscenities, urinated, etc. the whole neighborhood would go APE SH__. Just because this park is downtown, doesn't mean this should be tolerated.

^^ I'm sure he's a fine boy. He's just a little uninformed / naive regarding the various issues of this matter.