Funding for the Arch Grounds and Downtown Improvements

quincunx · PostMar 19, 2013#262013-03-19T22:37+00:00

I'd like to know what gets built if the tax fails. Or at least the priority list since they are counting on a lot of donations too.

My problems with it
The process has not involved community input
No highway removal
The tax is a sales tax
The tax applies to less than half the region, though it would capture visitors' purchases
The are other things I'd fund with a new tax before this
A local tax for a national park, the Feds aren't putting in enough
Big "silver-bullet" projects haven't worked

Presbyterian · PostMar 19, 2013#272013-03-19T23:47+00:00

While I have not been happy with the process, I suspect I'll vote for the tax. I want the specific improvements that the tax will fund.

I won't advocate for it, though. To gain that level of commitment, the process would have to have developed differently.

Alex Ihnen · PostMar 20, 2013#282013-03-20T00:46+00:00

Presbyterian wrote:While I have not been happy with the process, I suspect I'll vote for the tax.

That's all they want.

roger wyoming II · PostMar 20, 2013#292013-03-20T18:27+00:00

quincunx wrote:I'd like to know what gets built if the tax fails. Or at least the priority list since they are counting on a lot of donations too.

My problems with it
.....
The are other things I'd fund with a new tax before this

How about a competitive process for different proposals to get on a ballot.... maybe a March Madness of Arch Tax v. Early Childhood School Building winner takes on winner of Rams Stadium v. Police/Fire/Public Safety.

quincunx · PostMar 21, 2013#302013-03-21T15:06+00:00

Great idea! Which would win in your bracket? Some tough match-ups.

BTW, got my 4th mailer yesterday.

Alex Ihnen · PostMar 21, 2013#312013-03-21T15:46+00:00

I haven't received a mailer, but the one I saw didn't mention the Arch, not a picture, nothing - all about parks for our grandchildren.

terence d · PostMar 21, 2013#322013-03-21T18:50+00:00

Alex Ihnen wrote:I haven't received a mailer, but the one I saw didn't mention the Arch, not a picture, nothing - all about parks for our grandchildren.

Easy guess with a broadbrush: Cause you're county, yo. County folk give a hoot much more about their suburban parks than they do about the arch grounds.

Alex Ihnen · PostMar 21, 2013#332013-03-21T19:50+00:00

^ FWIW, I saw the mailer I refer to at a downtown city business.

terence d · PostMar 21, 2013#342013-03-21T20:48+00:00

Alex Ihnen wrote:^ FWIW, I saw the mailer I refer to at a downtown city business.

Someone from the county must've left it there LOL ...Seriously tho, I recall the one I dropped directly from my mailbox into the recycle bin the other day prominently displayed the arch.

framer · PostMar 22, 2013#352013-03-22T03:23+00:00

I got two mailings here in U City; neither one showed the Arch. Hardly even mentioned it, in fact.

quincunx · PostMar 22, 2013#362013-03-22T13:22+00:00

All four of mine show at least part of the Arch and Arch grounds. Two feature the Arch.

olvidarte · PostMar 22, 2013#372013-03-22T13:48+00:00

Both of the mailings I received featured the arch and new renderings of the grounds and something about the tax creating jobs.

quincunx · PostMar 22, 2013#382013-03-22T14:30+00:00

Here's a quick and dirty No on Prop P mailer. It needs some slick graphics.

roger wyoming II · PostMar 22, 2013#392013-03-22T14:47+00:00

quincunx wrote:Great idea! Which would win in your bracket? Some tough match-ups.

BTW, got my 4th mailer yesterday.

Awesome, my friend! I had Early Childhood Schools beating out Historic Renovation Grants.
But I also did a revised play-in, where a Giant Statue of Billikens Basketball Under the Wing of Rick Majerus (to be located at NE corner of Grand and Lindell) beat out Beer Business Incubator. The Bills played Cinderalla all the way to the Championship!

quincunx · PostMar 25, 2013#402013-03-25T23:48+00:00

Got a 5th mailer today- "It's for the kids" No picture of the Arch, just a mention. Also I find interesting is that in almost all the pictures in all the mailings it's not summer time. The people are wearing coats and gloves.

PostMar 27, 2013#412013-03-27T03:17+00:00

According to page 16 half the 1/10th cent GRG tax goes to counties and munis for their parks. Anyone know how it's distributed to the munis? Under the sales tax pool/point-of-sale system or something else? What about the portion a Prop P for parks in the counties and munis?

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/24850819/CityA ... 0FINAL.pdf

roger wyoming II · PostMar 27, 2013#422013-03-27T16:15+00:00

Post-Dispatch printed Alex's letter to the editor today about his non-support of Prop P. Also had a lte in support of Prop P from Open Space Council.

quincunx · PostMar 28, 2013#432013-03-28T22:49+00:00

Got my 6th mailer today "It will make the Arch grounds safer and more accessible"

Alex Ihnen · PostMar 29, 2013#442013-03-29T03:59+00:00

Beating a dead horse here, but I can't stand that argument. How? Memorial Drive is gone, great. The Arch grounds are connected to Luther Ely Smith Square...now what? Oh, right, everyone must cross 4th Street where all the Memorial Drive traffic has been diverted. KWMU has a Prop P rep on the air today stating that the plan will seamlessly connect the Arch, Old Courthouse and Kiener Plaza for pedestrians. BS.

roger wyoming II · PostMar 29, 2013#452013-03-29T15:20+00:00

^ yeah, I'd love to see traffic projections on how much more will be going down Broadway and 4th.

Aside from their "seamless connections" argument, they also seem to be implying that Prop P will bring more actual physical security presence at the Arch grounds.... while I am rather mixed on my feelings about local taxes helping to pay for infrastructure of an urban national memorial (this whole JNEM concept has been led by Saint Louis civic leaders since the very beginning.... city: if we clear cut our riverfront and have a competition for a shaft or arch or somesuch celebrating westward expansion will you partner with us? feds: sure, why not... its the Great Depression and it might put people to work) the thought that local taxpayers might be paying directly for more park rangers does seem to go too far.

Trailnet also is officially supporting Prop P, btw.

Alex Ihnen · PostMar 29, 2013#462013-03-29T15:59+00:00

The usual suspects are all supporting Prop P. Get on board, or prepare to be a target (yes, I know this personally).

Presbyterian · PostMar 29, 2013#472013-03-29T16:26+00:00

^I've already shared how I'll vote, but if you need a personal body guard or something, let me know. (I have friends who work out.)

The Great White Fathers may have thrown me just enough of a bone to get me to play along--it's their specialty--but that doesn't mean they get to crush the dissenters.

goat314 · PostMar 29, 2013#482013-03-29T17:10+00:00

I have a feeling this will be shoved down our throats. I'm not adamantly against Prop P, but I definitely didn't like they whole process. If it passes I'll say meh and if it fails I'll say meh. Although, I think Prop P is almost a sure vote at this point. Too much institutional backing.

Alex Ihnen · PostMar 29, 2013#492013-03-29T17:53+00:00

^ My thoughts almost exactly.

bonwich · PostMar 29, 2013#502013-03-29T18:16+00:00

Presbyterian wrote:The Great White Fathers may have thrown me just enough of a bone to get me to play along--it's their specialty--but that doesn't mean they get to crush the dissenters.

Bless you.

Funding for the Arch Grounds and Downtown Improvements

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