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PostJun 21, 2007#76

Doug,



You buy your shoes on eBay - please refrain from talking about the downtown Macy's or any other establishment in the metro area that sells shoes! I kid, I kid, but c'mon. You don't really want to restrict who has a say on what happens in the city do you? There are some really dumb people in the city. (I think) I understand your concern, but the burbs don't have a corner on ignorance and bad ideas.

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PostJun 21, 2007#77

dutchtowner wrote:Doug is right! Who do those suburban residents think they are? How could they possibly believe they have the right to comment on the problems of North St. Louis? Don't they understand that they need to move to South St. Louis before they are allowed to have an opinion about North St. Louis?


:lol:



I don't really feel a south St. Louisan is necessarily much more fitting to comment on this situation any more than someone from Eureka or St. Peters. Especially if they exercise that same sort of flippant disregard for organic urban development that is sensitive to the needs of north St. Louis residents, they are not fit to comment.

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PostJun 21, 2007#78

Yes, they paid their federal taxes. I am not going to re-illustrate the failure of federal policies, or how CDBG funds were mostly not spent in poor areas per their intent.



I can be a little intense, but I grew up surrounded by individuals who hated the City without understanding its problems. They said it was dirty and should basically be destroyed. Or, that African Americans were the cause of all of the problems. So, when I read letters advocating bulldozing the places I love, I am a little upset. This was due to a stereotypical ignorance.



Similar mentality exists within some areas of City government. It is upsetting. Over and over areas are considered to be blighted or obsolete and should be destroyed, to be recreated with some other built environment that will supposedly be a draw and revitalize the area. Soulard is a good example. As we all know, the 47 plan called for its destruction. There are many other urban renewal examples which did happen and have failed miserably to both attract residents and business.



So, I am not going to apologize for how I "do my business." My business is not repeating the mistakes of the past. I will be intense when people outside the City, or those within, wish to repeat these mistakes. I am sorry if I offend anyone, but this is how I feel and I don't hesitate to join discussion.

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PostJun 21, 2007#79

Doug wrote:Suburban and exurban residents should keep their opinions to themselves.


I guess city residents should also keep their opinions about the suburbs to themselves too, or else that would be kind of hypocritical...



(I was going to go through and add some of Doug's previous posts here where he goes off on the suburbs but I decided not to waste my time)

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PostJun 22, 2007#80

buckethead wrote:(I was going to go through and add some of Doug's previous posts here where he goes off on the suburbs but I decided not to waste my time)


I am glad you didn't go to the trouble, everyone knows....

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PostJun 22, 2007#81

I would rather suburban and exurban residents be educated as to what makes the city work. We all know what the key to the success of urban neighborhoods is and what constitutes suburban and exurban success and their differances. I doubt if the typical suburbanite/exurbanite knows what constitutes city living, or even if they care (which many urbanites feel the opposite). The best thing is for both city and suburban/exurban resisents is to respect one anothers choice of residence and lifestyle and support those choices, even if we loathe that lifestyle. A healthy city has both!

That said, I do have a problem with suburbanites/exurbanites writing letters making comments about city neighborhoods when it seems obivous they have no sensitivities to the function and needs of such.

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PostJun 22, 2007#82

Doug wrote:They shouldn't comment. If they lived here and paid their taxes, then perhaps the City would have had tax dollars and wouldn't have cut services to the North Side. Perhaps the school wouldn't have declined? Their fiscal absence contributed to the current situation as well as their categorical stereotypical outlook of urban environments.



Their solution is to destroy when in fact they should have advocated in the past. Then the current situation wouldn't have occurred. They wouldn't drive through the North Side on Highway 70 to a Cardinals game and see blight. They wouldn't ride down Metrolink and see salvage yards and shells of buildings.



The reason it's there is because they abandoned the City!!!!


I've heard similar sounding arguments from East Germans...

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PostJun 22, 2007#83

FYI - the wall is down.




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PostJun 22, 2007#84

^What building is that in Grand Center?



Ohhhh, you meant the Berlin Wall...

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PostJun 27, 2007#85

Paul McKee Jr. is a bastard...I think I will puke!





June 2002: Developer Paul J. McKee Jr. incorporates Blairmont Associates, one of several entities used to buy land in and around Old North St. Louis.



August 2004: Amount of properties owned by McKee-linked companies stands at more than 100 parcels.



December 2004: Bridget G. Calcaterra leaves St. Louis Development Corp. before going to work for McKee.



November 2005: McKee holdings increase to more than 200 parcels.



December 2005: Erika Macon leaves Eagle Realty, which has the same address as McKee companies, and goes to work for St. Louis Development Corp.



Jan. 17, 2007: Old North St. Louis restoration group decries condition of McKee property in letter to Mayor Slay.



March 2, 2007: After months of controversy and lobbying from the mayor's office, aldermen approve leasing part of Forest Park to BJC HealthCare, whose board McKee chairs.



March 4, 2007: Slay accepts $10,000 in campaign donations tied to McKee.



March 28, 2007: Neighborhood stabilization officer writes memo raising concerns about drug and prostitution problems at McKee properties.



April 2007: Holdings for companies linked to McKee reach more than 500 properties



May 2007: Mayor's chief of staff testifies in favor of tax credit bill that could mean tens of millions for McKee companies.



June 2007: Paric Corp., a company McKee founded, agrees to donate services to Soldiers' Memorial, whose run-down condition was becoming a liability for the mayor.



http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument



http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/news/s ... enDocument

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PostJun 27, 2007#86

The practice of organizing a separate LLC for each property in an entire portfolio of properties is common.



I've discovered that many, many bar and restaurants in St. Louis have been sold -- probably when they run short of cash and have to sell their building.



Why doesn't a Citizens Service Bureau complaint work as a remedy for the real estate owned by McKee? Why aren't more of his properties in housing court? It must be that the neighbors don't know the process or the city is turning a blind eye.

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PostJun 27, 2007#87

Nice to see the Team Four plan is being implemented. The mystery surrounding Blairmont is finally being lifted. Let's see some facts from the mayor's office if he has the cajones to do it.

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PostJun 27, 2007#88

Now's as good a time as any to throw this in...



Within the past year an entity had a geographical survey done of north saint louis... specifically east of grand to the river, and north of MLK all with high definition satellite imagery from 4 different angles (North, West, East, South).



I have no idea of who paid for this (I don't work in contracts), but it wasn't cheap. I did get to see some nice pictures of my home though.

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PostJun 28, 2007#89

I know I am barking up the wrong tree here, but I am not ready to jump to conclusions on Mr. McKee, he could very well have a great plan to revitalize North St. Louis.



THe Mayor has added some new comments to his blog at www.mayorslay.com



I tend to agree with the Mayor, its not like anybody was lining up to buy these properties. I also think that calling him a scumbag and several other names is over the line. The man is ver involved in a lot of religious and civic charities, is the president of BJC healthcare (one of our largest employers) and founded Paric Constructin which has had a major role in a lot fo the loft projects downtown.



I just think people hear Winghaven and jump to conclusions.

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PostJun 28, 2007#90

^I agree. I dream sometimes, as I'm sure we all do, about buying up a whole block of rotting buildings on the northside and fixing them up all beautiful. But the fact is, the mayor has a point. No one else is really investing in North St. Louis outside of Old North. I found his blog post kinda reassuring, letting it be known that McKee just can't do whatever he wants without city approval. I never really knew what to think about this whole situation, but I've tried to be optimistic about it.



However, there is still no excuse for not boarding up the vacant properties and making them safe(or as safe as can be).

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PostJun 28, 2007#91

Well before I begin I have to admit, I havn't seen any of this with my own eyes, just read on here, the paper, and that ecology of absence blog. BUT a couple things seem pretty clear. He is intentionally allowing these buildings to detoriate much faster than they normally would. A lot of the infrastructure of the north side has detoriated (per a photo thread someone posted called north stl the good bad and the ugly). It is amazing what is left has survived some 50+ yrs of neglect. It's pretty disgusting that now, over a 5 yr period or however quick it happens, we might lose more in Mill Creek proportions. Again, I havn't read the bill myself, but it seems pretty frequent in explanations of the tax credit that the credit exists in large part to cover ,among other costs, DEMOLITION. If this guy seemed serious about rehabbing, this would have been the best thing to ever happen to the city. However, he doesn't even do things as simple as boarding up the buildings, which allows vagrants inside which leads to crime, fires etc. Look at the picture in this thread of that guy stealing bricks! They may be taking longer than one massive development, but PREVENTING the efforts of joe six packers to redevelop houses one at a time is again disgusting.



I would rather nothing happen for another 10 or 15 yrs than this guy get his way. We have to face facts. STL has clearly fallen far from its former coveted place as a world class city. This is GENERALLY not the type of place where people do daring cutting edge things like some of the new towers planned in Chicago. Our historic architecture is arguably the greatest asset the glory days left us with. Atlanta, Houston, Dallas, and Denver can super sprawl all they want or put up new condo towers but the one thing we have they could NEVER match is the grand architecture in places like the north side. Once its gone, its gone.



People from Eureka and St. Peters are free to comment and I agree with whomever said we must try to get them to understand our views rather than alienate them. However, I also agree with whoever said that they speak with an arrogant authority as if they know whats best for the city. I think the one thing relatively few people in the region know about is our architecture. Perhaps if they understood how treasured and irreplaceable it is, their opinions would change. Sorry for the rant :wink:

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PostJun 28, 2007#92

Shimmy wrote:No one else is really investing in North St. Louis outside of Old North.


Tell that to McCormack Baron Salazar, Judy Woolverton, Mary "One" Johnson the rehabbers of St. Louis Place, the Sensient Corporation and others who have risked a lot outside of Old North in the area McKee is targeting.



He's not the first person in the last decade to put money into this area, and he wouldn't be there if he was.

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PostJun 28, 2007#93

ecoabsence wrote:
Shimmy wrote:No one else is really investing in North St. Louis outside of Old North.


Tell that to McCormack Baron Salazar, Judy Woolverton, Mary "One" Johnson the rehabbers of St. Louis Place, the Sensient Corporation and others who have risked a lot outside of Old North in the area McKee is targeting.



He's not the first person in the last decade to put money into this area, and he wouldn't be there if he was.


Touche. But that raises an interesting point. Outside of Mary "One" Johnson, I was unaware of the others. Maybe I read something on here about them once or twice, but outside of that, I was clueless. I've been reading this form every day for a year, and if I was unaware, surely those from Eureka and whereever else were unaware. Maybe we should be doing more to make known these other developments and then maybe these perceptions of "We should bulldoze North St. Louis because its not getting any better" will change.



But, we still have no idea of what he is planning. I'm not going to condemn the man before giving him a chance to at least present what he is planning. Though as stated before, leaving the properties open to the elements and other things is both questionable and unacceptable.

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PostJun 28, 2007#94

Count me as one of those not quite ready to run McKee out of town. Not yet, anyway.



We really do need to give him a chance to reveal his plans. Assembling large tracts of land piecemeal fashion does take a long time. And it's true that once a developer's "cover" is blown, the costs jump dramatically.



That said, I have to agree that his practice of leaving the buildings exposed to the elements is not a good sign.

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PostJun 28, 2007#95

Why doesn't the city review the properties that have been acquired and look at them for code violations? I mean c'mon, you have to take care of these properties as you acquire them no matter what your final intention is.

PostJun 28, 2007#96

Mayor Slay's blog has a response to the Post article. I just really hope that this is done right.



http://www.mayorslay.com/desk/display.asp?deskID=737

There is a story on the front page of the local newspaper about substantial investment in some neighborhoods of north St. Louis by Paul McKee, developer of WingHaven and other local projects. Maybe you read it?



The story, by political writer/blogger Jake Wagman, is a thin web of half-facts, rumors, and tenuous connections that would have benefited from better editing and less careless reporting. It does, however, contain a large, colorful map, which will be useful to readers who are unfamiliar with north St. Louis.



I am a great admirer of Paul McKee. He has been active in local community projects for years. His development and construction companies have accomplished good things in several City neighborhoods, including the Downtown loft district. He is a generous donor of time and money to a range of civic enterprises. He is a mainstay of several Catholic charities. In fact, until he decided to spend money acquiring privately owned vacant lots and empty buildings in north St. Louis, he has been either feted or unnoticed. For whatever reason, this particular good deed has earned him the enmity of the local newspaper.



I don’t know in any detail what Paul has in mind for the properties he has acquired so far – but, I do know that he is buying properties that no one else has even looked at in decades. The work already accomplished by others in north St. Louis is undoubted and important. But it has been slow, rather than fast, and thousands of vacant lots and buildings still dot the landscape.



Paul has spoken in general terms of building new homes and schools, adding green space, attracting new businesses, and restoring historic properties. Whatever he does with his properties will end up being subject to a battery of commission and legislative approvals, and a forest of hearings and meetings. If he is able to use a new state tax credit program designed to stimulate investment in the state’s poorest areas, he will have to agree not to use eminent domain to acquire properties; not to displace most current residents; and to build on a scale that will change the area’s character quickly, rather than over decades.



No project in north St. Louis, no matter how significant, will be able to treat current residents or employers unfairly. No property owner, no matter how substantial his holdings, will be immune to the City’s regulations. And should there ever be a redevelopment plan for the area, current stakeholders must be included in the process.



If you do read the newspaper’s story, ask yourself these questions: If Paul McKee is chased away, who will invest in north St. Louis on a large scale? Who will do something today with the thousands of vacant lots and buildings there? And, finally, ask yourself why developers would ever do anything in the most challenging neighborhoods of the City, when they could more easily invest their money in other neighborhoods or the suburbs and exurbs — if this "coverage" is what they get?

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PostJun 28, 2007#97

^
brickandmortar wrote:Nice to see the Team Four plan is being implemented. The mystery surrounding Blairmont is finally being lifted. Let's see some facts from the mayor's office if he has the cajones to do it.


Allow me to quote myself, but I think that's a half-a**ed answer if it is anything. Paul McKee is letting buildings rot away on the north side. I've seen it first hand when I lived there. A lot of the buildings were unsecured...



Of course he'll defend McKee; he gives him money, is chair of the biggest employer in St. Louis. I'll answer his questions:



If Paul McKee is chased away, who will invest in north St. Louis on a large scale?





It's been proven that the so-called silver bullet large-scale development hasn't worked in the City. Does Union Station, Pruitt-Igoe, St. Louis Centre, St. Louis Marketplace, the Highlands office complex ring a bell? Most upcoming neighborhoods have seen a resurgence thanks to the little guy investing in one property at a time.



Who will do something today with the thousands of vacant lots and buildings there?



Obviously not Paul McKee



And, finally, ask yourself why developers would ever do anything in the most challenging neighborhoods of the City, when they could more easily invest their money in other neighborhoods or the suburbs and exurbs — if this "coverage" is what they get?



I pose this question. What developer with any sort of morals would hide behind several LLCs all the meanwhile buying up properties, some of which were occupied, with no public plan to remedy these 'vacant' buildings?

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PostJun 28, 2007#98

Let him invest his money elsewhere. The City does not need a messiah like Paul McKee. We might as well sign with the devil on the dotted line. The manner by which he does business is telling and clearly indicates he is not our friend.

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PostJun 28, 2007#99

metzgda wrote: Paul has spoken in general terms of building new homes and schools, adding green space, attracting new businesses, and restoring historic properties.


McKee has had two years to to tell his critics of these plans. This assurance early on could have prevented the scandal now brewing. McKee's critics, for the most part, are not zealots. They are intelligent people wanting straight answers. Some answers in 2005 would have quelled concerns and created supporters.



Odd that only after major-press attention does the mayor finally issue a statement on McKee's project, and finally offers assurances. That sure isn't leadership.

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PostJun 28, 2007#100

Whoa there!



There are millions of dollars being invested in the north side by developers and individuals homeowners. Why is it that nothing seems to remedy the blight on their blocks?



A single CSB complaint can remedy a problem on the southside. Why not on the north?



What possible excuse is there for the condition of the Clemens mansion?



Has there been an application for state and federal tax credits for the mansion in the past 10 years?

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