Alderman Joseph Roddy envisions 40-story tower in CWE

urbanstlouis · PostMay 26, 2005#12005-05-26T15:24+00:00

<A HREF="http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/busine ... 9C8">Clock may be ticking for development on premier building site</A>

By Martin Van Der Werf

Of the Post-Dispatch

05/26/2005

Downtown construction is exploding. The Park East Tower is about to come out of the ground in the Central West End. But perhaps the premier building site in St. Louis - the block south of the Chase Park Plaza on Kingshighway - remains mostly parking lots and alleys.

"It's a mess," says Alderman Joseph Roddy, whose Ward 17 includes the block, which is divided into 11 parcels owned by eight different entities. "We called all the owners together to see if we could get them to work together, but it hasn't gone anywhere."

<A HREF="http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/busine ... 0D004899C8">>>> read more</A>

MattnSTL · PostMay 26, 2005#22005-05-26T17:30+00:00

I was so happy when I saw this. Good to see an alderman thinking big. Now lets see if he can jump through some massive hurdles.

suburban lou · PostMay 26, 2005#32005-05-26T17:55+00:00

Yeah its great to see an alderman thinking big, but I disagree about the building cycle coming to an end.

That blurb about Sterling Properties sounds interesting.

jmedwick · PostMay 26, 2005#42005-05-26T18:33+00:00

To be fair, i doubt if the alderman really has any idea about the building cycle. But it is good to see that he feels some urgency to get such a project done. 40 stories might be a bit tall, but a nice 20-30 story building would look great. Kingshighway would be one of the most vertical streets in STL and look really great from the park.

urbanstlouis · PostMay 26, 2005#52005-05-26T19:02+00:00

JMedwick wrote:40 stories might be a bit tall, but a nice 20-30 story building would look great.

I agree that 40-stories may be a bit much... and the article really said, "Roddy envisions a tower as tall as 40 stories", but as others have said, it is good to see him at least think it could be as tall as 40-stories. It sounds like he has his work cut out for him as it is.

stlgasm · PostMay 26, 2005#62005-05-26T20:24+00:00

Well at least we're hearing SOMETHING about this parcel. It's pathetic that such a prime location has been used for parking for so long. I'd love to see a nice new highrise here, and ideally I think it would be great to have streetfront retail. A juice bar, ice cream parlor or coffeehouse with sidewalk seating facing the park can't go wrong here (although I'm sure it will be strictly residential). Let's build on the lot at Lindell & Euclid while we're at it too!

arch city · PostMay 26, 2005#72005-05-26T22:00+00:00

I'm also glad this plot of land is being discussed. There's so much potential there.

Roddy fears that the opportunity for the corner will be lost while landowners try to outflank one another. "I think we are at the end of this building cycle," he says. "I hope I am wrong, but we've had so many residential units dropped on the market at the same time."

No offense, but that comment seems to be spoken with a "small town" mentality, in my opinion. The CWE (let alone St. Louis) hasn't seen this kind of development in a long time, so it's kind of natural that a conservative, fear-based comment like this would pop up from time-to-time.

I think he's wrong though.

smsplanstu · PostMay 27, 2005#82005-05-27T05:48+00:00

What's wrong with a 40-story high rise at Lindell and Kingshighway?

40 levels would be 400-500 foot skyscraper and overshadow Clayton's as the region's tallest residential highrise. It overlooks Forest Park, and is surrounded by other tall buildings like the Chase except 100-200feet more. The Park East, Montclair, and BJC and WashU complex add to the street skyline. Why not have an apex? Good design is needed for this prime and perfect spot.

comandantecero · PostMay 27, 2005#92005-05-27T09:26+00:00

i think a 20-30 story building complementing the Chase Park Plaza (creating a kind of "gate" effect for Lindell as you enter or exit the CWE) would be awesome. I don't think such a large project has a chance of being built this cycle though, not because it's near its tail end right now but because of the time it would take to solve all those ownership issues and then get an actual plan drawn up, studied, and proposed. That in itself could take a year or two, or more and by that time i think the window of opportunity for large new construction will have passed (i.e if it were all ready to go right now i think it could happen). It's a great idea, and they should start moving on it to take advantage of the next building boom. Maybe in 2012

jivecitystl · PostMay 27, 2005#102005-05-27T12:46+00:00

I just want you to know that until 1963, the Ambassador-Kingsway Hotel stood at the large surface lot adjacent to the Lindell/Kingshighway site, immediately southwest of the St. Regis. It burned down to the ground in '63. What a cool building it was though. Wow.

As long as Ted Koplar owns the lot at Lindell & Kingshighway, I have absolutely no doubt that something will be built there....IN 50 F*CKING YEARS!!!

That man is clueless. You should have seen what was going to be built there in 1986-- twin condo towers. Classy, very cool, modern...until the developer went bankrupt by the end of the year. Sucks.

debaliviere · PostMay 27, 2005#112005-05-27T12:54+00:00

I don't have much faith in Koplar either. I just hope he can get the Maryland Plaza development done at this point.

thewayofthearch · PostMay 27, 2005#122005-05-27T15:28+00:00

I'm hearing some intersting stuff, here. What's wrong with 40 floors? I think that that would be awesome. You could get some skyline form almost anywhere in forest park.

This "complimentary" to the other buildings thing, seems typical of the ol' STL. Its why Cornerstone on Skinker got shot down. Why does everything have to be made with the others. New York and San Fran and CHicago have Neo-Gothic, 2nd Eygptian revival, etc right alongside super-modern. Whay is the Chase the standard bearer? Can't anything else bear a NEW standard for st. louis? This is my big problem with HOK's work as an architectural firm. They classify cities. "St. Louis is a brick city so we have to use brick, or complimetnary material. WE can't do contemporary becasue of the history..." Well how the hell did Hong Kong get so modern, erupt from feudal roots? By not being scared to Progress! The past is great, its who we are, now who are we going to BE? The same as before? IF you allow these "experts" to convince you that you are destined always a brick town, then you will never be a contemporary city. I can only hope one day i will look down on the chase, as I one day hope to look back at the 1904 worlds fair. As a previous high point that we have surpassed as a city.

suburban lou · PostMay 27, 2005#132005-05-27T15:38+00:00

JivecitySTL wrote:I just want you to know that until 1963, the Ambassador-Kingsway Hotel stood at the large surface lot adjacent to the Lindell/Kingshighway site, immediately southwest of the St. Regis. It burned down to the ground in '63. What a cool building it was though. Wow.

Not to get off topic, but do you have any pics?

Expat · PostMay 27, 2005#142005-05-27T15:45+00:00

The mid atlantic suffers from the same thing. Can't get out of the brick mold. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy some of the new old fashioned buildings. Is the fear of modern a reaction from bad modern that was either cheaply built or was hostile to it's neighbors? When people see the Park East and 4545 Lindell, they will want more modern. 40 stories on Kingshwy and Lindell would be cool, but I would be happy to see any good looking building of respectable height on the parcel. Having an empty lot on that corner is a disgrace and embarrasment.

jivecitystl · PostMay 27, 2005#152005-05-27T15:47+00:00

^No, but you can find some old postcards of it on e-bay and at the Missouri Historical Society library on Skinker. That place is a wealth of STL archives.

WayoftheArch, I COMPLETELY agree with you. I'm so sick of the philosophy that everything has to look old. What a cop-out! Nothing that is built today to "look" old looks good. It all looks fake and if anything, it is an insult to the authentic historic context. I would much rather see a diversity of styles and materials in St. Louis's new buildings. Innovation baby!

ibleedlou · PostMay 27, 2005#162005-05-27T16:16+00:00

^ Except a few of the new houses in Soulard and Lafayette. But I get your point and agree with you 100%.

stlgasm · PostJun 06, 2006#172006-06-06T21:38+00:00

Well that article was published over a year ago, and unfortunately there is nothing new to report for that vast sea of parking.

PostJul 01, 2006#182006-07-01T15:10+00:00

When are the vast surface parking lots at Kingshighway & Lindell and Euclid & Lindell going to be developed already??? I wonder if the rejuvination of Maryland Plaza will spur some proposals. THe Koplars need to let them go already. It's preventing the overall continuity and cohesiveness of the neighborhood from being realized.

jcity · PostJul 04, 2006#192006-07-04T00:14+00:00

yeah, I love how the Koplars keep getting all this media attention while it is Ted Koplar who has basically sat on his properties for a number of years, stymieing any comeback that could have happened much sooner. We need to get a list of the people who own that lot at Kingshighway and Lindell.

publiceye · PostJul 04, 2006#202006-07-04T00:27+00:00

get a list of the people who own that lot at Kingshighway and Lindell

It will not be a short list.

Ted Koplar who has basically sat on his properties for a number of years, stymieing any comeback that could have happened much sooner

What moved the project along was a creative son who wanted to do it.

jlblues · PostJul 04, 2006#212006-07-04T06:25+00:00

publiceye wrote:What moved the project along was a creative son who wanted to do it.

Or...a son that showed some interest and an indulgent father.

Just out of curiousity, what do you find so creative about Maryland Plaza? I would imagine that a majority of the professionals on this forum could have done as well, if not better, if they had the Koplar family fortune with which to work.

trent · PostJul 06, 2006#222006-07-06T01:55+00:00

A lot of the work to Maryland plaza was not needed.

jcity · PostJul 11, 2006#232006-07-11T03:57+00:00

again, who owns the lot at Kingshighway and Lindell?

archmadness · PostJul 11, 2006#242006-07-11T16:16+00:00

Parking lot at Lindell and Euclid using the STL Assessors website.

http://stlcin.missouri.org/assessor/lookup.cfm

Address: 4900 Lindell

Parcel #: 38830000401

Owner: VENTAS REALTY LIMITED PARTNERSHIP

303 E WACHER DR (maybe it meant Wacker)

CHICAGO, 60601

no listed sales date

They also own the neighboring building @ 4936 Lindell

*************************************************************

4974 Lindell on the corner of Kingshighway and Lindell is owned by St. Louis' favorite landowner...

KOPLAR PROPERTIES, INC

Parcel # 38830000100

no sales history

PostJul 11, 2006#252006-07-11T16:29+00:00

Apparently KOPLAR doesn't own the lot south of the alley. That parking lot located at 4981 W Pine at the corner of W. Pine and Kingshighway is owned by: FRONTENAC ASSOCIATES LLC

111 GREAT NECK RD

GREAT NECK,NY 11021

Parcel # 38830001200

These guys also own the apartment building on the south side of W. Pine at Kingshighway.